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Author Topic: Shure ULX, SLX, PGX ???  (Read 32285 times)

Adam Ellsworth

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Re: Shure ULX, SLX, PGX ???
« Reply #30 on: September 07, 2010, 12:38:52 am »

Leo Melkote wrote on Tue, 07 September 2010 05:10

I would like if someone could outline the technical reasons (Ok, not too technical Smile ) as to why a wired mic is a better option than wireless.


I'm not a wireless expert, but I can take a stab, anyway.

Let's say you can put the same Beta58 capsule on a wired mic, or a wireless mic. And at first blush, you'd expect them to sound identical... but of course they don't. The "problem" is what's in the middle. A wired mic delivers (more or less) exactly what is coming from the mic element to the board's pre-amp.

A wireless mic has to take the analog signal, convert it to something else (whether it's digital or analog), transmit it through air, piece it back together, and then build a new signal that gets sent to the board. At each of these steps, the quality of components and design will detract from or color the signal.

So the primary disadvantage to wireless (at a logical level) is that it is made of a bunch of components trying to behave exactly like a pair of wires. And the more money you spend, the closer you get. On the other hand, the advantage to wireless is that you don't need those wires. Smile

...I hope I didn't oversimplify it too much. But that's the gist of it, I believe.
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Rick Stansby

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Re: Shure ULX, SLX, PGX ???
« Reply #31 on: September 07, 2010, 12:39:03 am »

Brian Jojade wrote on Mon, 06 September 2010 19:13

Ryan Lantzy wrote on Fri, 19 March 2010 18:31

Charles Wick wrote on Wed, 17 March 2010 02:40

Ok, so here is my question. I am looking at the Shure wireless mic systems. I know that there are the PG, PGX, SLX, ULX, etc. Pertaining to the PGX, SLX, and ULX systems only, assuming that they all had the SM58 mic, and if I wanted only 6 systems max to use at one time, is there any really big need to purchase a ULX or SLX over the PGX? (This is for installed sound at a church, used 3 times a week.) Thanks.


Can't say enough about the ULX stuff.  It's really great for the money IMO.  The receivers, handhelds and beltpacks are mostly plastic, but very durable.  Do yourself a favor and buy the ULXS (Standard) series.  The ULXP (Professional) has a bunch of pretty useless features for what you want to do.  With six units, just pop in your zip code on the Shure website and it will give you a group and channels to set your gear to and you'll be golden.  I've never, ever, had any RF issues with these units in small numbers and they sound fantastic.  You'll save about $200-300 on the S series vs. the P.



The p series comes with 1/2 wave antennas, which can really help with reception. Put the 1/2 waves on the ulxs units, and i agree that they are very similar


I bought a ULXS unit, thinking I didn't need the extra features of the ULXP.
Asside from the 1/2 wave antennas, the ULXP adds mounting hardware ,if you are going to mount them in pairs (2 per rack space) you will need the $25 mounting kit for each pair of ULXS. The ULXP also has metal case, group scan, and white lettering on the back of the unit, so you can hook it up easier in the back of a dark rack.
After having to buy the mounting kit, I decided the ULXP is a better deal.  YMMV
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Conrad Muzoora

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Re: Shure ULX, SLX, PGX ???
« Reply #32 on: September 07, 2010, 03:33:48 am »

I have 4 slx wireless mics all with sm58 capsiles, i had some issues with them for a while sounding brittle and occasionally producing some horrible distortion especially when pushed hard by vocalists. I was advised to swith the sensitivity of the transmitters from the factory preset 0db to -10db and they have been great since.
Hope this helps someone having similar troubles. Am otherwise very satisfied with them.
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Tony "T" Tissot

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Re: Shure ULX, SLX, PGX ???
« Reply #33 on: September 07, 2010, 03:39:15 am »

Adam Ellsworth wrote on Mon, 06 September 2010 21:38

\

...I hope I didn't oversimplify it too much. But that's the gist of it, I believe.

You have to start the explanation somewhere.

The big issue is the same one "phone" folks faced for years - limited dynamic range.

Read up on companding.
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Don Boomer

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Re: Shure ULX, SLX, PGX ???
« Reply #34 on: September 07, 2010, 05:27:23 pm »


Crunch a bag of potato chips in front of your wired mic ... you get loud potato chips.  Now crunch it in front of a wireless that uses a compander.  It pretty well sounds like you've thrown a blanket over the speakers.

Fortunately not ALL wireless mics have companders  Very Happy

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Jason Lavoie

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Re: Shure ULX, SLX, PGX ???
« Reply #35 on: September 07, 2010, 05:37:24 pm »

Don Boomer wrote on Tue, 07 September 2010 17:27


Crunch a bag of potato chips in front of your wired mic ... you get loud potato chips.  Now crunch it in front of a wireless that uses a compander.  It pretty well sounds like you've thrown a blanket over the speakers.

Fortunately not ALL wireless mics have companders  Very Happy




Or shake a ring of keys, or riffle through a stack of poker chips..
All will show noises/artifacts that you've probably heard before but didn't know where they came from (or didn't know they were avoidable)

Jason
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John Roberts {JR}

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Re: Shure ULX, SLX, PGX ???
« Reply #36 on: September 07, 2010, 06:45:03 pm »

Jason Lavoie wrote on Tue, 07 September 2010 16:37



Or shake a ring of keys, or riffle through a stack of poker chips..
All will show noises/artifacts that you've probably heard before but didn't know where they came from (or didn't know they were avoidable)

Jason


Yup the old key ring trick.  Cool  Lots of energy in the octave above 20kHz.

First what you are hearing is IMD (LF distortion caused by HF content we can't hear distorting) as the circuitry saturates from the combination of too much HF boost and compression.

Second: it is not impossible to deal with this in a well executed compander design (while most don't).

When properly executed the side chain for the  compander needs a similar amount of HF boost to the primary path so the the occasional HF input gets normal gain. Secondly a LPF (in side chain and compander) is needed to scrub out of band content, that won't pass over the wireless link and cause tracking errors.

Even when properly executed companding will still suffer from 2x the channel frequency response errors, and spot dynamic range will be similar to the unprocessed path.

Wire is under appreciated, but if the talent can't hear the difference good luck.      

JR
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