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[Tim McCulloch]

benjamin fisher wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 17:23

Rob Spence wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 17:21 benjamin fisher wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 16:43 Ok well I guess I will have to look for another option, as I dont want my amps clipping when I cant see them. And save the 266 for vocals or something With your system set up sometime, assuming you have your gain structure all set too, your clip lights on the amps should come on at about the same time as the ones on your mixer. If they don't, adjust your system so that it does. Now you don't need to see the amps. On the other hand I try to place my amp racks where I might be able to see them at shows where I have the space. Ok, but you said to not worry about the power conditioners on the amps....so what do I do with 5 amps?

You plug them in to something that ISNT a power conditioner.

If you search (there's that word again) on "power conditioner amplifier" or "surge protect amplifier" you will find out why it is unnecessary.

Power strips are also dubious because of their cheap-ass circuit breaker.  Mostly you'll see "quad boxes" that are 4 Edison outlets.  There are cheap ways to build them, but I like using  Leviton 21254E with 4254E back box.  More money, but I can put them together in 5 minutes.  The 15 amp version is about $7 cheaper.

Have fun, good luck.

Tim "Search Cop" Mc

[Dave Rickard]

benjamin fisher wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 16:41

I just saw and read part of Robs thread when he built his poor mans distro. Honestly, it is completely foreign to me. I dont know how it work, what it does, how its connect, etc.

Two different ideas.

http://www.whiskey-creek.net/pwrdist.html

http://srforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/mv/msg/10116/85383 /503/?SQ=e6ce501fb2647f64ac50b819173075ea

[(BJ) Benjamin Fisher]

ADAM - Thats a good deal that I would go for, but I dont have any kind of relationship with a dealer...


TIM - Maybe what confused me the most is that the one poor mans distro had speakon plugs instead of edisons. I still dont understand that.


DAVE - Good read, I'll study up

[Tim McCulloch]

benjamin fisher wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 08:29

ADAM - Thats a good deal that I would go for, but I dont have any kind of relationship with a dealer... TIM - Maybe what confused me the most is that the one poor mans distro had speakon plugs instead of edisons. I still dont understand that. DAVE - Good read, I'll study up

The "PMD" that Spence referred you to had PowerCon

[(BJ) Benjamin Fisher]

Thanks Tim, that helps a bit. I will research that diagram and see where it leads me.

[Rob Spence]

benjamin fisher wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 18:23

Ok, but you said to not worry about the power conditioners on the amps....so what do I do with 5 amps?

Ah, ok, I see where I confused you.

When I mentioned "Power Conditioner", I was talking about the innards of the box you have as a rack mount power strip. For power amps, all you NEED is the power strip function. The "conditioning" won't do anything for you and may actually hinder you should IT fail.

Often you will just see a couple of 4" square electric boxes bolted in the bottom of a rack with a couple of outlets in each.

In answer to why I used Powercon connectors? The are less likely to be "borrowed" at a gig and an inspector won't complain about public accessible outlets with them. All of my gear has Powercon power inputs. Oh, one other nice thing is they don't fall out.

[(BJ) Benjamin Fisher]

Rob Spence wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 16:52

benjamin fisher wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 18:23 Ok, but you said to not worry about the power conditioners on the amps....so what do I do with 5 amps? Ah, ok, I see where I confused you. When I mentioned "Power Conditioner", I was talking about the innards of the box you have as a rack mount power strip. For power amps, all you NEED is the power strip function. The "conditioning" won't do anything for you and may actually hinder you should IT fail. Often you will just see a couple of 4" square electric boxes bolted in the bottom of a rack with a couple of outlets in each. In answer to why I used Powercon connectors? The are less likely to be "borrowed" at a gig and an inspector won't complain about public accessible outlets with them. All of my gear has Powercon power inputs. Oh, one other nice thing is they don't fall out.

Got it Rob, now I get it.

BTW I dont have anything with Powercon power inputs, haha.

[Toby Mills]

Why do you have a crossover and a DRPA?

I would suggest 4 rack cases...

Rack 1
1sp Input panel with 2 XLRs inputs on it
DRPA
2sp FOH Amp
2sp Sub Amp

Rack 2
1sp Input panel with 2 XLRs inputs on it
DRPA (get yourself another one, they are cheap).
2sp FOH Amp
2sp Sub Amp

Rack 3
1sp Crossover (i assume this its for monitors)
4sp empty for future expansion
2sp Monitor Amp

Rack 4
(3) 1sp Compressors
1sp Power Conditioners (you don't need one of these in your amp rack)
1sp Effects Processor
2sp Dual 31 band EQ
1sp Recording Interface


Doing this gives you a lot more flexibility.
You can now either use your FOH amp racks on two seperate jobs, or you can put one on each side of the stage to avoid long speaker runs.

Having a DRPA in each rack either allows you to just send a single signal feed to each side of the stage, or you can do two jobs at once.

I would highly recommend making the amp rack cases extra deep (deeper than the amp) and putting rack rails on both the fron and back. Also, leave at least an extra 2 rack spaces for when you want to go to a 3 way system

It could be handy to have another space with XLR socket mounts for the inputs so the signal inputs are on the front of the rack.
On the back rails, you can put a permanently wired power input so you have no flat pin power points to come undone and also you could put some panel mount speakon outputs with both NL4 and NL2 options for flexibility.

Building your amp racks right is worth the investment and its worth thinking long term. It can save an awful lot of time in setup if they are well built and it also makes them more reliable.

Make your 3 amp rack cases the same size, one day you will want more monitor amps so having space in the monitor rack to add more amps later is a good idea.

[Rob Spence]

benjamin fisher wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 18:20

BTW I dont have anything with Powercon power inputs, haha.

I didn't either but I modified the rack mount power strips to have em so each rack has Powercon in and a pair of outputs. Each rack has a cord with a normal plug on it and a blue powercon on the other end which lives in one of the lids in the event I want to use the rack by itself.

[Tony Ly]

I included shipping in my comparison. (But I'm pretty close - so it may be less for my location.)
[/quote]
12 space shock rack case $260
shipping $120
oversize handling $40
total shipped $420

I can build one for about $300

dont get me wrong, the ewi cases are great. but shipping kills them if i'm able to build one[/quote]



If you are buy 4-5 cases plus other things, it will be cheaper to strap everything to a pallet and ship it freight. Picking it up at the dock/ freight yard is the best bet.

I ordered 3 cases plus alot of cables from Mark and shipping to Sacramento,Ca. The frieght was only $140.00. The weight was close to 300 lbs. You avoid the oversize UPS charges plus the time frame is pretty much the same.