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Author Topic: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?  (Read 31083 times)

Tim A Perry

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2009, 08:54:33 am »

>How about upgrading to a Heil PR-20, PR-35, or maybe a Shure Beta 87c? I just want a quality mic so that when I put one of my good singers on there, I can have that smirk of "wow, that sounds great" on my face. I'm definately up for suggestions outside those brands, too!


For the really good voices I pull out the Audix VX-10LO but after doing a show for another company this year I have a new favorite vocal mic... the Beyer M88.

I consider the OM-5 as my best overall go to mics.

OM-6 for female vox and high pitched males.

OM-7- heavy metal and other really loud rock stuff

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Duncan McLennan

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2009, 09:02:49 am »

+1 for the 935 and 945.  They are very smooth sounding mics, not that expensive, have a 10 year warranty, and have a well known recognizable name behind them.

I recently decided to bring my 935 into my house gig to replace the 58s/beta 58s the club has.  I swear half the people there came up to me and asked how I'd achieved such a silky vocal sound.

You should also check out the SM86 if you're not in situations where high stage volume is an issue.
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David Hoover

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2009, 09:49:54 am »

I would willingly pay up to around $250 for a great mic.  I heard a clip of the M88 just now and it sounds fantastic.  A little too expensive, though.

Dave Dermont wrote on Thu, 12 November 2009 08:24

Is there a budget restriction?

For an inexpensive dynamic I like the Sennheiser e835.

If you got the bucks, the beyerdynamic M88 is extremely versatile.

I don't use a great number of condenser vocal mics, but I do own a CAD C-195, and it's way better than an under $100.00 microphone ought to be.

The Neumann KMS105 has worked well for me, but I usually use that in situations where I have good singers on quiet stages. It is very much a "warts and all" kind of microphone.

The Heil mics are good, but the 'buzz' about them is mostly manufactured by the Heil Sound marketing department. A good mic, but I don't think they will cure cancer.

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Caleb Dick

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2009, 09:59:28 am »

We compared a number of mics a few months back, handful of male vocals, quiet stage (Aviom/shields around drums and amps or direct), Meyer system.  Rejection wasn't a concern for us.  Based on sound quality, here's the order of what we liked

-AE5400
-PR35

These two stood out to us; very different sounding (dynamic vs condenser), but depending on voice, both very nice.



-AE3300 (high mid peak)
-E945
-PR22

These were all good overall.



-B87A (thin/harsh)
-ND967 (inaccurate)

Didn't care for


And finally:
-SM58
-B58
I/we really don't like these.  Just because we all know where the nasties are and can EQ them in our sleep, doesn't mean they sound good.  This is the 21st century last I checked.  

Caleb
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Caleb Dick
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Lee Brenkman

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2009, 02:53:22 pm »

Dave Dermont wrote on Thu, 12 November 2009 05:24

Is there a budget restriction?

For an inexpensive dynamic I like the Sennheiser e835.

If you got the bucks, the beyerdynamic M88 is extremely versatile.

I don't use a great number of condenser vocal mics, but I do own a CAD C-195, and it's way better than an under $100.00 microphone ought to be.

The Neumann KMS105 has worked well for me, but I usually use that in situations where I have good singers on quiet stages. It is very much a "warts and all" kind of microphone.

The Heil mics are good, but the 'buzz' about them is mostly manufactured by the Heil Sound marketing department. A good mic, but I don't think they will cure cancer.


I have one Audix VX10  - I use it for singers who sing well with less than stupidly loud bands who might, if they could afford one, have a Neumann KMS105.

I also use it as a single overhead for nicely tuned jazz drum sets.

Most of the jazz vocalists I encounter who have invested in KMS105s sing loudly and well enough that it works for them.  For most of the "indie rock" singers that use them it doesn't work as well but they insist that anything that expensive must be the best thing to use.

I have two Beyer M88s.  One is dedicated to kick drum use and the other is brought out for vocalists willing to try it.   It should be noted that It does have more handling noise than a Shure SM58 but less than the Heil PR20.

I have a Heil PR35 which I really like on most, but all vocalists I've tried it on.  I do HATE the clip though.  It doesn't hold the microphone very firmly unless you jam the mic WAAAY far into it.  

I have one Beyer M500 which gets used for singers with edgy voices in situations where I can trust what is, unfortunately a lovely warm sounding microphone that is way too fragile for rock and roll.

I truly cringe whenever a female vocalist with a soft voice shows up with a Shure Beta 87 and whenever time allows try to let them try out the other options I have to offer them.

But for day in, day out, vocal usage I own a dozen Sennheiser  e835s and a single e935 for those lead singers who want to feel "special"

I also have a half dozen SM58s for those who insist on using them.

FWIW

The non profit music school where I work occasionally has a nice assortment of Audix OM series microphones OM2, OM3, OM5 & OM6.  

When selecting for themselves and singing on the low budget speaker on a stick systems in the classrooms, nearly all of the vocal students and their instructors prefer to use one of the really beat up Sennheiser MD825s that they've had for nearly ten years.
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Dick Rees

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2009, 03:10:22 pm »

You can give the "talent" whatever mic you like.  If they have poor technique any mic you choose will be to a greater or lesser extent wasted.  A cardioid pattern will be the most forgiving of poor mic technique.  As you tighten the pattern you increase the incidence of "off-axis" sound from poor technique.

These are basic facts.  As to what each of us prefers over and above this, many opinions exist.
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Jeff Wheeler

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2009, 03:52:18 pm »

Dave Dermont wrote on Thu, 12 November 2009 07:24

The Heil mics are good, but the 'buzz' about them is mostly manufactured by the Heil Sound marketing department. A good mic, but I don't think they will cure cancer.

Oh, that massive Heil marketing engine. Wink

Bob Leonard wrote on Thu, 12 November 2009 07:42

Anyway, this is not the place for this debate.

Sure it is, it's a thread about microphones.  I would like to put a PR22 on every vocalist if I could make it work.  When the stage gets loud, though, I need other mics, at least for the backing vocals if not for lead as well.

Bob Leonard and the Heil marketing machine

Call Heil and ask them about a price for a bulk upgrade. I think you'll find out it's a pretty good deal.

I may do this soon.  I don't own enough for "bulk" but I wouldn't mind trading in three PR20s for three more PR22s.
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Lee Brenkman

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2009, 04:11:53 pm »

Dick Rees wrote on Thu, 12 November 2009 12:10



These are basic facts.  As to what each of us prefers over and above this, many opinions exist.



Or, to simplify.  

On any stage the loudest thing at the microphone wins.
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Phil Lewandowski

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #18 on: November 12, 2009, 09:04:17 pm »

Duncan McLennan wrote on Thu, 12 November 2009 09:02

+1 for the 935 and 945.  They are very smooth sounding mics, not that expensive, have a 10 year warranty, and have a well known recognizable name behind them.

I recently decided to bring my 935 into my house gig to replace the 58s/beta 58s the club has.  I swear half the people there came up to me and asked how I'd achieved such a silky vocal sound.

You should also check out the SM86 if you're not in situations where high stage volume is an issue.


Another vote as the e945/e935 as a good "in the trenches" mic that still can sound good.   The e945 is a touch smoother in the 2-5kHz region but the e935 would be slightly more forgiving for "in the trenches" type moments, as was mentioned about the cardioid pattern.


Take Care,
Phil
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Robert Alan

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Re: Heil Sound PR Series or Shure Beta Series?
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2009, 07:03:34 pm »

i would also second the idea of looking into the sennheiser 900 series mics.fuller, smoother and more articulate than the shures IMO. the audio technica artist elite series is also very good. brighter sounding than the senns. very articulate and clear.


out of interest has anyone ever A/B´ed the Beyerdynamic TG-X60 with the PR 35? the TG-X60 has a massively full sound (gigantic bottom end when used up close)the 60 seems very flat and uncolured/natural sounding but also has very good GBF. might be an alternative to the  PR 35 where there are wash problems?
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