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Author Topic: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?  (Read 47391 times)

Dan Brown

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2009, 12:17:10 pm »

Jim Bowersox wrote on Sat, 07 November 2009 09:49


If they have BMS drivers, most likely they have polyester diaphragms.  Phenolic diaphragms are usually reserved for all-weather paging horns, and rarely do anything over about 6K!  Although, after hearing the KUDO, they very well may have phenolic diaphragms.. Rolling Eyes



Jim,
Really, do you really feel that way about Kudo.
I have never found this to be the case....


Jim Bowersox wrote on Sat, 07 November 2009 09:49


To the OP:  Comparing KUDO vs. J-Series is like bringing a knife to a gunfight.  The J's are in a whole 'nother league.  

-J



Are you one of those guys that thinks that the Q boxes can get louder than any other box out there, XLINE, VERTEC, GeoT, MILO

I am not sure where you D&B guys get it but I have not been able to get them(Q boxes) that loud.
I love the box but not that much

db
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The Guy

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2009, 01:51:50 pm »

Dan Brown wrote on Sat, 07 November 2009 12:17

Jim Bowersox wrote on Sat, 07 November 2009 09:49


If they have BMS drivers, most likely they have polyester diaphragms.  Phenolic diaphragms are usually reserved for all-weather paging horns, and rarely do anything over about 6K!  Although, after hearing the KUDO, they very well may have phenolic diaphragms.. Rolling Eyes



Jim,
Really, do you really feel that way about Kudo.
I have never found this to be the case....



I've heard the Kudo twice, and mixed on it once.  I thought that it was a mediocre product at best, and not at all in the same league with anything else that L'Acoustics made at the time.  It may be better now, but my initial experiences were all pretty poor.  

Dan Brown wrote on Sat, 07 November 2009 12:17

Jim Bowersox wrote on Sat, 07 November 2009 09:49


To the OP:  Comparing KUDO vs. J-Series is like bringing a knife to a gunfight.  The J's are in a whole 'nother league.  

-J



Are you one of those guys that thinks that the Q boxes can get louder than any other box out there, XLINE, VERTEC, GeoT, MILO

I am not sure where you D&B guys get it but I have not been able to get them(Q boxes) that loud.
I love the box but not that much

db


At which point did I make any comparison to Q Series?  Although, now that you brought it up, they would probably be a good alternative to KUDO.  

Again, to the OP, a proper L'Acoustic equivalent to the d&b J-series would be the K1 or V-DOSC.  

-J

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Adam Robinson

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2009, 02:38:32 pm »

]
Jim Bowersox wrote on Sat, 07 November 2009 09:49



I've heard the Kudo twice, and mixed on it once.  I thought that it was a mediocre product at best, and not at all in the same league with anything else that L'Acoustics made at the time.  It may be better now, but my initial experiences were all pretty poor.  



I've heard Kudo multiple times, mixed on it more, and one of the gigs had my hands on the entire process of its setup.  I agree with Jim in that it is no league with the rest of the L'Acoustics line - I've kinda felt it's like the box L'Acoustics forgot.  Maybe something has changed since I was on it last, but I'll take D&B J or Q before Kudo (and just about any other box out there) anyday.
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HarryBrillJr.

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2009, 04:07:52 pm »

Eytan Gidron wrote on Fri, 06 November 2009 09:48

Evan,

Have you mixed or listened to the KUDO with the new presets (on LA8 amps)? It's really good, much better than the older XTA/Lake presets. The system has more presence, it sounds louder and it retains the nice low mid that the old presets had.



I never heard the k1
I like the VDOSC, I like the DVDOSC< I like the ARCS.  I don't like the KUDO.

d&b, it's all top notch and "they get it".
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Dan Brown

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #14 on: November 07, 2009, 11:17:50 pm »

Jim Bowersox wrote on Sat, 07 November 2009 12:51


I've heard the Kudo twice, and mixed on it once.  I thought that it was a mediocre product at best, and not at all in the same league with anything else that L'Acoustics made at the time.  It may be better now, but my initial experiences were all pretty poor.


OK, well I guess otheres have had different experiences.
I do not have a lot of experience with them.
A local company uses them and when I have heard it, it has been good.  Of course they have good people, that always helps.
I have never set it up or rigged it so I have no opinion on that.
It does suprise me that several people have said they dont like it but yet Lacoustics is continuing to sell it.  From what I hear they are requiring K1 system buyers to also have a certain amount of KUDO boxes in their inventory.
I will listen more critically next time.

Jim Bowersox wrote on Sat, 07 November 2009 12:51




At which point did I make any comparison to Q Series?  Although, now that you brought it up, they would probably be a good alternative to KUDO.  

Again, to the OP, a proper L'Acoustic equivalent to the d&b J-series would be the K1 or V-DOSC.  

-J




I looked back to what I remembered and I guess you were not part of the Vdosc vs. D&B thread.
Evan did make a claim that the Q1 boxes were just as loud as the VDOSC boxes except below 80hz.  I would like to see how he came up with that information.
As I said D&B makes a great product.
If I were in the market, I would buy a J rig over any other large format box, of course I would have to have a LOT of money also

db
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Evan Kirkendall

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #15 on: November 09, 2009, 06:52:23 pm »

I mixed on a Kudo rig all summer... One of the stages at Warped Tour had Kudo for the main PA. Going from mixing on the main stage's v-dosc rig to mixing on the side stage Kudo rig was like going from driving a sports car, to driving a riding lawnmower. The Kudo needed a lot of EQ to sound "good" and really ran out of gas quickly. They were powered properly with Lab Gruppen amps, and had the latest DSP settings on the XTA driving them. They just didn't sound good. I spent 4 weeks of my summer fighting with them daily.

The Q series would blow Kudo out of the water, and in my experiences they do keep up with v-dosc. For a 600 watt passive box, you can't beat them. I did a bunch of outdoor shows over the summer with v-dosc, Q series, J series and a lot of other "big" rigs. I did 4,000 people with 6 Q1's a side(plus 4 a side for outfill), and could maintain 106dBA(peaks of 111dBA!) @ FOH with headroom to spare. The main stage at warped tour had 6 v-dosc a side(properly powered with Lab Gruppen amps), and I could also hit 106dBA before limit. The v-dosc had more get up and go in the low mids, but otherwise, the Q's could keep rig up. Not to mention, you can run 12 Q's with 3 amps!

Also, say you're limited to a single 1 ton fly point per side. You could fly 4 v-dosc from that point. You could fly 20! Q1's from that same point. So, even if the Q's didn't have everything that v-dosc has output wise, you can make up for it in # of boxes.

Alright, d&b fanboy hat off...

If I had to pick any other box to compete with Kudo, it would be:
-EV XLC127DVX - Affordable boxes that really pack a bunch
-EAW KF760- another nice sounding box
-JBL VT4888DP - good sounding, and less sucky then old vertec

Though, none of those options would give you quite what the d&b stuff has, they're nice affordable alternatives that would still sound better, and get louder then Kudo.



Evan
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Dan Brown

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #16 on: November 09, 2009, 09:06:09 pm »

Evan Kirkendall wrote on Mon, 09 November 2009 17:52

I mixed on a Kudo rig all summer... One of the stages at Warped Tour had Kudo for the main PA. Going from mixing on the main stage's v-dosc rig to mixing on the side stage Kudo rig was like going from driving a sports car, to driving a riding lawnmower. The Kudo needed a lot of EQ to sound "good" and really ran out of gas quickly. They were powered properly with Lab Gruppen amps, and had the latest DSP settings on the XTA driving them. They just didn't sound good. I spent 4 weeks of my summer fighting with them daily.

The Q series would blow Kudo out of the water, and in my experiences they do keep up with v-dosc. For a 600 watt passive box, you can't beat them. I did a bunch of outdoor shows over the summer with v-dosc, Q series, J series and a lot of other "big" rigs. I did 4,000 people with 6 Q1's a side(plus 4 a side for outfill), and could maintain 106dBA(peaks of 111dBA!) @ FOH with headroom to spare. The main stage at warped tour had 6 v-dosc a side(properly powered with Lab Gruppen amps), and I could also hit 106dBA before limit. The v-dosc had more get up and go in the low mids, but otherwise, the Q's could keep rig up. Not to mention, you can run 12 Q's with 3 amps!

Also, say you're limited to a single 1 ton fly point per side. You could fly 4 v-dosc from that point. You could fly 20! Q1's from that same point. So, even if the Q's didn't have everything that v-dosc has output wise, you can make up for it in # of boxes.

Alright, d&b fanboy hat off...

If I had to pick any other box to compete with Kudo, it would be:
-EV XLC127DVX - Affordable boxes that really pack a bunch
-EAW KF760- another nice sounding box
-JBL VT4888DP - good sounding, and less sucky then old vertec

Though, none of those options would give you quite what the d&b stuff has, they're nice affordable alternatives that would still sound better, and get louder then Kudo.



Evan


I will definately have to listen to the KUDO closer next time.
I have not been able to compare it closely to any other system like some of you.

Where was your mix position at for the 6+4 Q1 system? - How deep was the audience area.

FYI, you can run 3 cabs per amp channel on the D12 amps in "low SPL" settings according to D&B

The Q1 box is the current spl/output/size/weight winner for this type and size of box.  It is a great little package.
It does have some frequency things I do not like but this can generally be eq'ed to some degree.  The highs get crunchy faster than some other boxes I like.

The J8/J12 box is simply amazing and cannot be compared to anything but the biggest and highest output boxes from each manuf.

YMMV,

db
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Brad Ferguson

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #17 on: November 09, 2009, 10:29:11 pm »

I'd like to hear the difference in the Kudo between LA48/XTA and the LA8.  I bet there's quite a difference.
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Gabe Nahshon

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #18 on: November 10, 2009, 02:50:37 am »

Evan Kirkendall wrote on Mon, 09 November 2009 15:52

...

Also, say you're limited to a single 1 ton fly point per side. You could fly 4 v-dosc from that point. You could fly 20! Q1's from that same point. So, even if the Q's didn't have everything that v-dosc has output wise, you can make up for it in # of boxes.



Minor clarification,
    7 vdosc can be flown from a single, one ton motor.

Gabe
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Evan Kirkendall

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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #19 on: November 10, 2009, 02:58:07 am »

Gabe Nahshon wrote on Tue, 10 November 2009 02:50

Evan Kirkendall wrote on Mon, 09 November 2009 15:52

...

Also, say you're limited to a single 1 ton fly point per side. You could fly 4 v-dosc from that point. You could fly 20! Q1's from that same point. So, even if the Q's didn't have everything that v-dosc has output wise, you can make up for it in # of boxes.



Minor clarification,
    7 vdosc can be flown from a single, one ton motor.

Gabe


Woops, sorry! You're right. I was thinking a half ton(1000lbs).



Evan
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Re: What's your take? d&b J8, J12 or L-Acoustics KUDO?
« Reply #19 on: November 10, 2009, 02:58:07 am »


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