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Author Topic: LS9 nightmare  (Read 19390 times)

Gareth Hunt

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Re: LS9 nightmare
« Reply #30 on: March 07, 2011, 04:11:34 pm »

I donít like linking pairs of faders in general on a digital console because I always grab both faders and it seems that the motors fight each other when I am touching both. It feels like something is wrong they donít move smoothly.

That irritates me as well.
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Christian Tepfer

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Re: LS9 nightmare
« Reply #31 on: March 07, 2011, 04:53:43 pm »

That irritates me as well.
Yeah, but don't we link faders / channels just to leave one fader off the layer and have only one fader controlling the stereo channel?

At least I do so.
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Christian Tepfer
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Christian Tepfer

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Re: LS9 nightmare
« Reply #32 on: March 07, 2011, 05:01:26 pm »

Basically, the pairing works if the faders are at EXACTLY the same position. The only 2 places this will work is with both either at the top or the bottom of the fader track.
I avoid pairing in the bottom position as I never know about possible calibration errors.
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Jonathan Schroeder

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Re: LS9 nightmare
« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2011, 02:00:47 pm »

I was curious about a few of the circumstances raised in this thread, so I went and fired our M7 up to try a few things. 


I know this doesn't relate to the OP since scenes were not changed, but just for kicks I tried it anyway.


Senario: You have two scenes, one with 2 faders linked, and one without. With the faders recall safed, when you go from the unlinked scene to the linked scene, the fader offset is preserved, so if one is all the way closed, and the other is not, it will maintain the offset when the scene is called.  Makes sense I guess, but whenever you are running recall safe and linking, you need to be aware of this. 


The other thing I checked could have happened is much simpler.


Senario: As you are fading out the CD, you select the channel. You break the link until you let go of the button, so if you select the channel as you are fading it out near the bottom of the fader, it will create an offset.  Even with a brief break in the linking you could have a 30+ db offset. The next time you fade it in, you get the flying faders.  I assumed there was some forgiveness when you select the channel before it breaks the link (maybe if it wasn't already selected) but that is not the case. 


Again, this may or may not be the case for the OP, but it raised some questions in my mind if I want to use fader link on our M7.  I can see it's usefulness when you have layers, but for the M7 it may not be necessary.


Jon
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Dave Neale

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Re: LS9 nightmare
« Reply #34 on: April 12, 2011, 12:51:49 pm »

Hi all,
thought I would share something that happened on an LS9  last night.
I was doing a corporate show (about 1000 pax). A couple of pairs on the board ( CD's, Beta, powerpoint) and about 10 mono inputs
Everything was fine for most of the day until I had to fade in a paired channel ( CD) as I started to push up one of the faders, the other one (paired one) went flying all the way up to max and the audio came at a horrendous volume!!!!
I quickly muted the channel but the monster was out  :-[
Needless to say that everyone in the room jumped and complained about the super loud sound that came out of the system (12 dV Doscs and 4 dV subs) and  production gave me a look like what the f#@%k have I done.
Now I could not use those channels anymore and I had to repatch the CD payer to other intputs.
I kept the pair muted and everytime I moved the left fader the right one would jump all the to maximum. I finally unlinked the pair and relinked it and the problem went away. Was not able to reproduce the problem after wards.
Anybody run into something like that?
The console is about 1 year old with latest firmware and was in use in normal conditions (temp. humidity, etc)

Were you using the CentraLogic faders to do the fader move?  There is an M7CL48 in one of the houses I mix.  This console has this issue on the #9 input.  I "discovered" the issue while mixing a name artist, during the encore.  I pushed a vocal up a hair past unity on the CentraLogic fader and off it went, producing a really lovely peal of feedback.  Using the fader in the 9-16 fader bank worked normally after I recovered.

A call to Yamaha resulted in being told that this is a known issue, necessitating the 9-16 fader bank being swapped out, even though it is the CentraLogic fader that triggers the fault. The CentraLogic faders work normally on all other inputs on the desk.

Since having the experience I never touch the CetraLogic faders for input mixing on any M7CL I mix on.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2011, 12:54:13 pm by Dave Neale »
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Douglas R. Allen

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Re: LS9 nightmare
« Reply #35 on: April 13, 2011, 08:27:48 pm »

Not sure if this causes the problems but I noticed this 8 years ago on my 01v96.
Take 4 faders as an example.
Put 4 faders in a fader group.
Fader 1 at neg 10.
Fader 2 at 0 db.
Fader 3 at neg 10
Fader 4 at 0 db.
Move them around to be sure they are in the group and working correctly.
Bring all faders to full off or all the way down. Power down the board then reboot.
All 4 faders will now be in line. All 4 will now be in a row not the 10dbs apart you set them at.
If you power the desk off with them in their respected -10 , 0 db spot then power down , up they will remain the same
 -10,0db.
Now with 3 faders are in a group.
Channels 1,2 at 0db.
Channel 3 at - 50.
If you turn down 3 almost but not quite all the way 1,2 will show almost off as well. But cycle the board and just touch channel 3 and 1,2 will go full scale.

Bottom line. Don't bring grouped faders all the way down when you cycle the desk. (At least with an 01v96) as they will reset to flat line. If you have 1 channel even the slightest up it will peg the other faders.

I always leave my faders up when I turn the desk off when I have faders in a group. The relationship of the group will be maintained.

Douglas R. Allen
« Last Edit: April 13, 2011, 08:31:45 pm by Douglas R. Allen »
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Tim Lovell

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Re: LS9 nightmare
« Reply #36 on: April 17, 2011, 01:15:51 pm »

Hi all,
thought I would share something that happened on an LS9  last night.
I was doing a corporate show (about 1000 pax). A couple of pairs on the board ( CD's, Beta, powerpoint) and about 10 mono inputs
Everything was fine for most of the day until I had to fade in a paired channel ( CD) as I started to push up one of the faders, the other one (paired one) went flying all the way up to max and the audio came at a horrendous volume!!!!
I quickly muted the channel but the monster was out  :-[
Needless to say that everyone in the room jumped and complained about the super loud sound that came out of the system (12 dV Doscs and 4 dV subs) and  production gave me a look like what the f#@%k have I done.
Now I could not use those channels anymore and I had to repatch the CD payer to other intputs.
I kept the pair muted and everytime I moved the left fader the right one would jump all the to maximum. I finally unlinked the pair and relinked it and the problem went away. Was not able to reproduce the problem after wards.
Anybody run into something like that?
The console is about 1 year old with latest firmware and was in use in normal conditions (temp. humidity, etc)


Hi Ivan,

I've been on an LS9 for about 3/4 years and unfortunately I haven't come across this problem. I have seen the fader calibration issues and the fader offset issue that people have described, but this sounds different.

I would suggest this is as much mechanical as it is a software glitch. I could see a scenario where dust or a foreign object has fallen into the fader and this has screwed up the fader alignment to the point you have experienced. The muted test you performed may have cleared the physical issue, but the software misalignment has remained. The relink process you performed later has realigned the fader pairing and the issue is fixed but is not recreatable.
For example, I frequently get issues where an optical mouse pointer movement is corrupted by a single human hair or dust particle in the path of the laser. When this happens the pointer jumps to a completely random extremity or position on the screen.

A calibration of all faders and a comprehensive clean and service of the board is all I can really suggest as a best effort to reduce the reoccurance of the problem.

In any case I hope you get to the bottom of it.

Regards,
Tim
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Adam Ellsworth

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Re: LS9 nightmare
« Reply #37 on: April 18, 2011, 04:28:51 pm »

I've become rather intimate with the LS9 group functions on a data structure level and without loading a scene, or bumping a fader while holding SEL, I'm really skeptical the offsets would be affected.

BUT - imagine this: A dirty fader (which you wouldn't "hear" like in analog world) could be wiggling ever so slightly between the two bottom digital values while parked in the -oo range. If you simply pressed SEL at the same instant one TRANSITIONED between -oo and -137db... then it would reset the relative fader levels and you would get exactly what you describe.

I'm not sure you'd be able to duplicate this, but it'd be worth taking a few minutes to try parking the faders and see if you can find a spot where the values on-screen oscillate.
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: LS9 nightmare
¬ę Reply #37 on: April 18, 2011, 04:28:51 pm ¬Ľ


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