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Author Topic: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.  (Read 24008 times)

Tom Danley

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #20 on: August 19, 2008, 07:19:49 PM »

Oxymoron?

You mean that guy with the beard, Billy Mays?

Tom
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John Roberts {JR}

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #21 on: August 19, 2008, 07:30:27 PM »

I had already figured out which group you were in..  Laughing

I am not advocating amnesty or tolerating unlawful activity but we are way past playing catch up on all the water flowed over this dam unchecked. The last amnesty was supposed to be the only one, but they didn't finish that job, creating this new bigger problem.

Congress says this is illegal but then doesn't budget the money to enforce it widely. Spot enforcement is just disruptive to business. I would argue that they by not adequately funding enforcement, put the law in question. They are just posturing for voters without seriously addressing the issue.

To address the root problem here.. why are so many workers coming here..? lets help their government make jobs for them in their country (maybe a wall construction project?). Mexico has their hands full with criminally corrupt regional governments in parts of their country, but the do manage their southern border better than their northern.  

We need to figure how to stop the bleeding and get to a better place.. this won't be one simple fix.

JR
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Dick Rees

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #22 on: August 19, 2008, 07:45:04 PM »

John Roberts  {JR} wrote on Tue, 19 August 2008 18:30

Congress.....are just posturing for voters without seriously addressing the issue.

JR


I'm shocked!!!!!

Check this out:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/politic

It's not the 4 definitions that get me....it's the synonyms. Rolling Eyes
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Joseph Curran

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #23 on: August 19, 2008, 07:47:11 PM »

John Roberts  {JR} wrote on Wed, 20 August 2008 00:14

most western nations are reproducing at less than a replacement rate, their shrinking aging populations will be a major burden on their economies. Opening up immigration even more here would keep our economy growing and vital. More people are not necessarily a burden.

JR


Without the added citizens, there won't be enough workers paying into the tax system to allow us to collect Social Security in the future. Thank God for illegal aliens.
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Bob Leonard

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #24 on: August 19, 2008, 07:51:47 PM »

John Roberts  {JR} wrote on Tue, 19 August 2008 19:30

.

To address the root problem here.. why are so many workers coming here..? lets help their government make jobs for them in their country (maybe a wall construction project?). Mexico has their hands full with criminally corrupt regional governments in parts of their country, but the do manage their southern border better than their northern.  

We need to figure how to stop the bleeding and get to a better place.. this won't be one simple fix.

JR


We've already done that in a number of places. Japan, Taiwan, China, India....... Time to close the doors for a while.
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Charlie Zureki

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #25 on: August 19, 2008, 07:55:14 PM »

John Roberts  {JR} wrote on Tue, 19 August 2008 18:30

I had already figured out which group you were in..  Laughing

I am not advocating amnesty or tolerating unlawful activity but we are way past playing catch up on all the water flowed over this dam unchecked. The last amnesty was supposed to be the only one, but they didn't finish that job, creating this new bigger problem.

Congress says this is illegal but then doesn't budget the money to enforce it widely. Spot enforcement is just disruptive to business. I would argue that they by not adequately funding enforcement, put the law in question. They are just posturing for voters without seriously addressing the issue.

To address the root problem here.. why are so many workers coming here..? lets help their government make jobs for them in their country (maybe a wall construction project?). Mexico has their hands full with criminally corrupt regional governments in parts of their country, but the do manage their southern border better than their northern.  

We need to figure how to stop the bleeding and get to a better place.. this won't be one simple fix.

JR



   JR,

   I don't think I belong to any particular Group. I've paid close attention to all of the Facts delivered by both sides of the Argument and realize I'm  probably in the Minority, because of MY Reasons.

I just think that Fixing One Problem with another Problem in this case is not the Answer.

   I agree there are Problems in Mexico (as well as everywhere) but, the Mexican Citizens have to fix it, it's their Problem. Exactly as we must fix OUR Problems.

  America needs to tighten it's belt and get it's hands dirty. We forgot how to Work Hard, it's time to Work Hard AND Smart.

 Last thought... as a couple of Younger Sound Pros responded in the "How old are you?" Postings, their friends work X amount of hours per WEEK and they Worked that amount of Hours in three days. If the rest of America was as Passionate as Most Sound Pros., we wouldn't be in the Mess we're in.

 Reminds Me of a Tom Hanks Movie.....
 ____________________________________________________________ ___

 "Then Johnny Mo said.. Stagehands?  They can Out-Drink,Out-Eat, Out-Smoke, Out-Work, Out-Cuss, Out- $#^&, any Man!"

Cheers,
Hammer

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John Roberts {JR}

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #26 on: August 19, 2008, 08:09:17 PM »

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace...

J.L.
--------

Sorry, nothing personal, most of the rest of the world would die to have our problems. Some have.

Helping the rest of the world improve their lot will help us too. Directly, indirectly and good old Karma.

Mexico is better off than many countries, but not so well off, that our grass doesn't look greener. There is no reason why crossing a line on a map between San Diego and TJ justifies the quantum shift from wealth to poverty...

JR




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Jeff Knorr - Cobra Sound

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #27 on: August 19, 2008, 08:16:12 PM »

Joseph Curran wrote on Tue, 19 August 2008 19:47



Without the added citizens, there won't be enough workers paying into the tax system to allow us to collect Social Security in the future. Thank God for illegal aliens.


Except that many of the illegal aliens probably aren't paying any income taxes!

WARNING - RANT AHEAD!

My opinion is that if you're willing to commit any illegal activity, you should be willing to pay the consequences.  In the case of illegal immigration, I think it should mean immediate deportation.  If you'd like to apply for citizenship you should get put in the back of the line like everyone else.

I'm all for a diverse work force and culture but anyone here illegally often serves as a leech on the system.  Emergency Room visits, public primary education, and other Government services are all paid for by the legal citizens.  I think that we have enough of our own problems to solve without having the unnecessary burden of illegal aliens on our hands.

With that said, I firmly agree that we should help other countries improve their citizens quality of life. This may lead to a reduction in illegal immigration but that shouldn't be the priority.  As a World Super Power we should try to increase the prosperity of the World and act as a true leader/trendsetter.  We have the technology and experience to help reduce poverty and starvation we just need to start utilizing it.

I believe housing prices still have room to fall further.  I've been out of college for over four years now and have a better than average job but I'm still priced out of buying the median home in probably most of the urban markets in this country.  I think many Americans need to re-evaluate their sense of entitlement and understand the consequences of poor financial decisions.  I've come to realize that life isn't easy, nobody owes you a handout, and if you want to get ahead you should start working for it.  This puts me firmly in the NO bailout camp.

I also don't think that there's a shortage of workers (either skilled or unskilled) in America.  I do think there's a shortage of workers that are grounded in reality and their actual worth and employers willing to pay fair and reasonable wages.  One avenue to providing farm labor that I would love to see exploited is putting low security prisoners to work on the chain gang.  Start making prisoners earn their keep instead of watching HBO in an air conditioned cell at the tax payers expense.

Jeff "saving my $0.02 so that I maybe I'll be able to buy a house" Knorr

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Robert Sims

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #28 on: August 19, 2008, 09:55:57 PM »

I never knew Eve had red hair and the devil had a mullet.

There must be a different perspective from the east coast and midwest on the alien / immigration issues than the west coast. We have our fair share of alien haters, border protectors but John's idea plays out here more than you would think. Although there is no guarantee of citizenship we see non english speaking day laborers eventually work up through the system and become tax payers on a regular basis. Vegas is not by any means the norm since we have very low unemployment and lots of opportunities here. So you don't get a big population of haters, guess there all to busy working. What I have noticed is the the quality of jobs for those fortunate to be born in America has risen which means that we as a country are more technology and less production oriented. Bad thing is that this is increasing the gap between educated and uneducated, which translates to rich and poor. The Hispanic population is a very family oriented folk and send money back due their since of obligation to their families. Hard to argue with that logic. Keep in mind, as long as they are here they are buying American and increasing our economy. There is definitely no going back. I wouldn't know laws in a foreign country unless someone educates me on those laws. I think maybe we should translate the laws better.

Yes there are problems but there have also been benefits that we may not fully understand.

The housing market here tanked....but this was completely the doing of the lenders and shaky tactics. They told everyone.."everyone" that the housing would continue to appreciate and signed them to short term loans. In the case here, many Hispanics and locals are now foreclosing because they were given a bright sunny picture that turned out to be as bad as that snake above.


I came from NC pre-immigration explosion but the comments from there to to reflect the majority similar to what is posted here. Vegas seems to be the exception in that the there is a true appreciation of their citizenship and a feeling of belonging.


3 cents...

Robert



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Robert Sims

Bennett Prescott

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Re: solution for illegal immigrants and economy.
« Reply #29 on: August 19, 2008, 10:14:55 PM »

Joseph Curran wrote on Tue, 19 August 2008 19:47

Without the added citizens, there won't be enough workers paying into the tax system to allow us to collect Social Security in the future. Thank God for illegal aliens.

Oy. I like how our government run pension system is so fucked up that illegal aliens seem like a solution.

We need to be very careful that in our desire to be a progressive and advanced western society we do not give a free ride to law breakers, which would mean essentially punishing honest law abiding citizens (or hopeful citizens) for doing things the right way. The last thing we need are short sighted but seemingly helpful laws that make criminals of those who are doing the right thing.

Sorry I don't have a snazzy idea like JR's :/
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