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Author Topic: How not to get into a ceiling  (Read 13880 times)

Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #20 on: August 05, 2008, 01:40:35 pm »

Of course, it's ridiculous to be fired for refusing to risk life and limb, but it's pretty easy to come up with some "other" reason to fire someone.

Pretty silly arguement for doing something stupid. What would you rather be- crippled for life or maybe dead with your wife and kids without you or fired? My opinion is an employer that expects you to work like that is doing you a favor by firing you.

-Hal

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #21 on: August 05, 2008, 05:39:44 pm »

Hal,

Very humorous response. I totally agree. Hadn't looked at it that way.

I only say what I said because I was in a similar situation and understand what it feels like to be pressured into unsafe working conditions.
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Charlie Zureki

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #22 on: August 06, 2008, 02:38:51 am »

MattJones wrote on Tue, 05 August 2008 16:39

Hal,

Very humorous response. I totally agree. Hadn't looked at it that way.

I only say what I said because I was in a similar situation and understand what it feels like to be pressured into unsafe working conditions.



 Hello Matt,

   We've all been pressured into commencing or completing a task that would be considered unsafe.

  But, if we Know it's unsafe and we DO the task, then WE are to blame, not the Manager or the Company. You don't have a claim in most cases.

  If we are asked or pressured into an unsafe task and our response is NO!  Legally, we cannot be fired. If we have been threatened by Management of being fired, for not completing an unsafe task, it is Harassment.

  I won't elaborate on the He said/she said argument,only to say that, Occupational Health and Safety Codes have been written and it is fairly easy to obtain the truth in such arguments.

  These unsafe practices need to stop, it is not heroic or manly to do something that is clearly unsafe, it's just, plain, STUPID.
 
 Companies that insist on bending the Work codes, are usually short lived. Penny wise and Pound foolish.
 
Hammer
 
 
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Brad Weber

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #23 on: August 06, 2008, 11:42:23 am »

I may have had good employers but in my experience it was typically not employees being asked to work in an unsafe manner but rather supervisors or employees making the decision to work in that manner.  Unfortunately such actions put the employee at risk physically and the employer at risk legally and financially.  I think the actual firm ownership would have had a fit if they were aware of some of the practices I saw employed by techs and installers in the field.
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Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #24 on: August 06, 2008, 01:04:47 pm »

But, if we Know it's unsafe and we DO the task, then WE are to blame, not the Manager or the Company. You don't have a claim in most cases.

That's not true at all. The employer is responsible for the way it's employees work. If unsafe working conditions exist or unsafe methods are used the employer can't say that it was what the employees did on their own. Proper training and equipment is required to be provided by the employer as well as supervision to see that all policies are followed. If an employee is doing something unsafely it's at the least because of poor supervision which the employer can be held accountable for.

-Hal

Charlie Zureki

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #25 on: August 06, 2008, 02:20:18 pm »

Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC wrote on Wed, 06 August 2008 12:04

But, if we Know it's unsafe and we DO the task, then WE are to blame, not the Manager or the Company. You don't have a claim in most cases.

That's not true at all. The employer is responsible for the way it's employees work. If unsafe working conditions exist or unsafe methods are used the employer can't say that it was what the employees did on their own. Proper training and equipment is required to be provided by the employer as well as supervision to see that all policies are followed. If an employee is doing something unsafely it's at the least because of poor supervision which the employer can be held accountable for.

-Hal


 Hello Hal,
   I agree, (for the most part, as there are always an exception) It's true that Employers are responsible to maintain a safe work environment and to assure that the employees are trained in the proper safety procedures, and have proper safety equipment.

 But, If the safety policies and training requirements are met by the Company and the individual knowingly commits a transgression of the procedures, many States will find the Company free from any claims.

 In Michigan, most Companies require Safety Training and require you to sign the Training certificate, which they file in your Employee File.

 Legally it becomes a release of Liability for the Company; that you have accepted the Safety Procedures and agree to abide by them. The same is true for being Intoxicated on the Job, if you are hurt, because of your "State", the Company is not held Liable.

  This Law has been tested many times in Michigan.

 Cheers,

 Hammer


 
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Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #26 on: August 06, 2008, 04:01:38 pm »

Well, all I can say is that I agree an employer can't have a supervisor monitor every employee every minute they are on the job but there very well may be some liability even with the intoxicated employee scenario. This is probably the stuff high priced attorneys make their money on and much depends on the circumstances as to which side wins.

-Hal

Charlie Zureki

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #27 on: August 06, 2008, 04:08:21 pm »

 Hal,

  we do see the same legal points, and have the same safety concerns.

  That's what makes a Good Employer v.s. being a Bad Employer.

 Again, Penny wise and Pound Foolish

Cheers,

Hammer
 
 
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Cam Tardi

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #28 on: August 06, 2008, 11:56:24 pm »

Robert Sims wrote on Fri, 01 August 2008 20:35

I got a kick out of watching this guy.

index.php/fa/17213/0/


Could just be me...but I don't see anything wrong with that picture???
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Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC

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Re: How not to get into a ceiling
« Reply #29 on: August 07, 2008, 10:20:49 am »

The painter on the ladder is standing above where he should be on that ladder. The painter on the lift is working safely doing basically the same job.

That picture is a poster for how and how not to work safely.

-Hal
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