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Title: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Liam Flaherty on November 26, 2012, 07:16:02 PM
I'm looking to get some new clip-on tom mics and was just after some suggestions, so what are your favourite mics at the moment? I'll mainly be using them for louder rock/pop music but occasionally Jazz as well.

Also what are peoples opinion on the Sennheiser e604 vs. e904?? Worth the extra money?

Cheers!
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Ryan Tolzmann on November 26, 2012, 07:23:09 PM
I'm looking to get some new clip-on tom mics and was just after some suggestions, so what are your favourite mics at the moment? I'll mainly be using them for louder rock/pop music but occasionally Jazz as well.

Also what are peoples opinion on the Sennheiser e604 vs. e904?? Worth the extra money?

Cheers!


i'm a fan of the audix D series for toms. D2 for the racks, and D4 for the floor tom.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Tim McCulloch on November 26, 2012, 07:37:45 PM
I'm looking to get some new clip-on tom mics and was just after some suggestions, so what are your favourite mics at the moment? I'll mainly be using them for louder rock/pop music but occasionally Jazz as well.

Also what are peoples opinion on the Sennheiser e604 vs. e904?? Worth the extra money?

Cheers!

Audio Technica AT350 or their predecessor, the AT35.

The Senny 904 is reported to be more robust that the 604.  We have some 504 that have survived nicely but don't get requested much because of the funky mounting (we solved with Mic_Eze butterfly clips).
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: RYAN LOUDMUSIC JENKINS on November 26, 2012, 08:06:49 PM
I'm looking to get some new clip-on tom mics and was just after some suggestions, so what are your favourite mics at the moment? I'll mainly be using them for louder rock/pop music but occasionally Jazz as well.

Also what are peoples opinion on the Sennheiser e604 vs. e904?? Worth the extra money?

Cheers!

I would really look at the Beyer Dynamic Opus 88 mics.  I love 'em!  Sound awesome and have the best clamp system out there.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Greg_Cameron on November 26, 2012, 08:37:32 PM
I would really look at the Beyer Dynamic Opus 88 mics.  I love 'em!  Sound awesome and have the best clamp system out there.

Those Beyers are now apparently the TG-D58c (http://north-america.beyerdynamic.com/shop/mp/microphones/vocals-and-instruments/drums/tg-d58c.html).
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: David Simpson on November 26, 2012, 09:06:55 PM
what are peoples opinion on the Sennheiser e604 vs. e904?? Worth the extra money

I do think it is worth the extra money. I can really tell a difference.

I have picked up several Heil PR28 and really love them. I have also used the Heil PR31BW and like them (although they are a jump in price from the Sennheiser price range you originally mentioned).

~Dave
Title: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Samuel Rees on November 26, 2012, 10:39:54 PM
D2/D4 is my favorite as well, but the mounting system is certainly bigger than 604.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Bob Leonard on November 26, 2012, 11:40:05 PM
Heil PR-28, or 22.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Adam Robinson on November 27, 2012, 01:10:42 AM
I'm looking to get some new clip-on tom mics and was just after some suggestions, so what are your favourite mics at the moment? I'll mainly be using them for louder rock/pop music but occasionally Jazz as well.

Also what are peoples opinion on the Sennheiser e604 vs. e904?? Worth the extra money?

Cheers!

I own both 904s and 604s and I don't really see one as an upgrade from the other, they're just different flavors.  That being said, the 904s are more robust and are extremely rider-friendly. 
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Jim McKeveny on November 27, 2012, 07:20:36 AM
e604 is a "desert island" instrument mic. If that desert island has phantom power, the e904. Both are terrifically consistent and rugged and bargains in their categories.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Mark Long on November 27, 2012, 09:57:09 AM
e604 is a "desert island" instrument mic. If that desert island has phantom power, the e904. Both are terrifically consistent and rugged and bargains in their categories.
Phantom power? I thought the e904 was dynamic as well.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Tom Burgess on November 27, 2012, 11:38:51 AM
Shure Beta98AMP gets my vote.  We used them at a clinic with Jim Riley and a set of Ludwig maples last year.  I thought they sounded fantastic.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Lee Brenkman on November 27, 2012, 12:00:24 PM
e604 is a "desert island" instrument mic. If that desert island has phantom power, the e904. Both are terrifically consistent and rugged and bargains in their categories.

Wondering why the desert island has to have phantom power.  :o  Both the e604 and e904 are dynamic microphones.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Liam Flaherty on November 27, 2012, 02:38:53 PM
Many thanks for all the suggestions guys!

I do like the Audix mics but I find them a little too big. From a rider-friendly point of view, I'm drawn towards the e904s and I like their rugged design over the e604s. I've heard good things about the Beyer Opus/TG D58 mics but I've rarely seen them in use. I'll do some listening and hopefully that'll convince me one way or the other...

Cheers!
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Rick Earl on November 27, 2012, 03:11:44 PM

I have 904s and 604s, The 904 is more rugged and sounds a bit better in my opinion.  We shot out Audix D2, Shure Beta 56, Heil PR28 and the Sennheiser. They all were good sounding mics and worked, the Sennheiser was the most user friendly of the bunch, and we've been happy.   I will probably add some of the new Shure Beta98AMP next year, I am pleased with their performance too.  I've tried the Beyer Opus series and like them too, but I have had some issues with Beyer service.

On a side note, the show I am mixing tonight we are using 421s on the toms, the drummer wanted them but is complaining because he can't get his cymbals as tight as he wants them. He was the reason for the 904s.  Although the 421s are great and the tone of the drums carries through nicely, I am missing the punch I seem to get from the 904s,  we are getting ready to A?B them right now. 
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Jim McKeveny on November 27, 2012, 03:14:46 PM
Ooops.

I will, however, take a good drummer w/604's vs. bad drummer w/904's every time.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Robert Weston on November 27, 2012, 03:49:42 PM
We use the Audix D series mics w/gates.

Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Kirby Yarbrough on November 27, 2012, 04:07:33 PM
Shure Beta98AMP gets my vote.

And mine, with the A75M clamp.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: mark lonow on November 27, 2012, 06:39:53 PM
when i was shopin for new tom mics i was considring the audio technica  ae3000
not really a clip on but more has more uses

but i saved a few bucks and whent  with da 98amp 3pack deal for the size

less ur really budget tight id skip the 604 and get someting better then the average mic box
mics last a long time less there stolen
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Matt Vivlamore on November 28, 2012, 10:47:58 AM
I have the Audix D-series with Shure A56D clamps… I’d say they work well for 95% of the drum kits I come across.  I’ve had this set-up for the last 2-3 years, everything from the Bar band to National Acts and Wedding bands. 

I am looking at buying a 3 pack of the Shure Beta98AMP with A75M mounts this year for the Corp/Wedding band I work with.  The drummer’s tome have the full rim shock mounts and the A56D mounts don’t work and I can’t squeeze the e604 clamps on the rim as well.

Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: David Shriver on November 28, 2012, 11:18:42 AM
I've used the Sennheiser 604s and 904s, the MD421s, Audix and a variety of others.  My favorites are the DPA 4099s http://www.dpamicrophones.com/en/products.aspx?c=Item&category=118&item=24377 (http://www.dpamicrophones.com/en/products.aspx?c=Item&category=118&item=24377) and the Shure Beta 98.  The DPAs are nicer than the Shures but I've gotten great results with both.

If you need something on a lower budget then I'd go with the Sennheiser 604. 
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Tim Padrick on December 02, 2012, 04:48:19 AM
904 for snare and racks - sounds good, mounts fast on hoops or mounting rings (but have something else in the drawer if a kit shows up that has wooden hoops).  D4 for floor.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Ryan McLeod on December 02, 2012, 08:27:56 AM
904 for snare and racks - sounds good, mounts fast on hoops or mounting rings (but have something else in the drawer if a kit shows up that has wooden hoops).  D4 for floor.

+1
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Roland Clarke on December 03, 2012, 02:20:05 PM
D2's, D4's, Sennheiser 604's all great.  I love 421's, though you can't often get them on a kit these days as drummers mount their cymbals a lot close.  I had Beta 98's but sold them due to their fragile connector issues, not run with Beyer TG58's (like the old opus 88's) great condensor microphone, Sennheiser 904's a good alternative to 421's.  There are many other options out there, the TG 58's have a great mount system. You choose your poison and go with it!
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Al Rubio, Jr on December 03, 2012, 07:11:05 PM
We've gotten great results with our set of beyerdynamic Opus 88's on toms and snares.  Very clear and articulate with plenty of signal output!  What rare damage we've incurred (two occasions) came from sloppy, ham-handed drummers who slammed the mics repeatedly over the course of their set (not just the one or two stray stick hits).  In our experience, beyer's authorized service has always been thorough and fast!
Oh, and a big +1 on the integral mounting clamp!  The clamp itself is available for use with other mics... it's beyer model designation is the MKV87.
If we were using Audix or Sennheiser drum mics, we'd likely combine them with these handy-dandy little clamps!
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: George Dougherty on December 06, 2012, 01:53:29 AM
e904 definitely worth the money. The 604 has a slight plastic hollow resonance compared to the D series and 904. I prefer a 904 up a little and aimed down at the drum head. The broader cardioid pattern seems to capture a better representation of the drum than the D series though it also has a little more kit bleed. Not a problem as long as you've got gates. As others noted, the durability of the 904 is nice and the 10yr no questions warranty is also nice. That said, I have 2 of 3 I need to send back due to a minor internal rattle they developed. I've been using the D series at the moment and moved them to conga duty till I get a chance to mail them in.  It wasn't a problem live but was noticeable on some stuff I tracked. Probably a bad batch since I bought two at one time for percussion and then a third when I wanted them for drums.

I've played with the DPA and other mini condensers and prefer the response of the 904 without eq over the others without eq.  If you have limited capabilities available, the 904 starts with a strong tom sound.  If you do, most anything with a full frequency range can work on toms as evidenced by the albums done with a kit full of 57's.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Henrik Vaaben on December 06, 2012, 04:22:57 AM
+1
have something else in the drawer if a kit shows up that has wooden hoops).
but -1 on using 904 for snare - I have never been satisfied with neither 604 or 904 on snare. 2x SM57 for me (top/bottom)
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Mark Long on December 06, 2012, 09:04:53 AM
+1 but -1 on using 904 for snare - I have never been satisfied with neither 604 or 904 on snare. 2x SM57 for me (top/bottom)
I don't have any 904s, but I have used 604 on snare with great results.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Ole Marius Holden on December 17, 2012, 02:31:31 PM
I've used the Sennheiser 604s and 904s, the MD421s, Audix and a variety of others.  My favorites are the DPA 4099s http://www.dpamicrophones.com/en/products.aspx?c=Item&category=118&item=24377 (http://www.dpamicrophones.com/en/products.aspx?c=Item&category=118&item=24377) and the Shure Beta 98.  The DPAs are nicer than the Shures but I've gotten great results with both.


I was worried for a moment that I was the only one that love the DPAs. Excellent mics, shame about the cable which feels a bit flimsy....
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: George Dougherty on December 18, 2012, 12:19:38 AM
+1 but -1 on using 904 for snare - I have never been satisfied with neither 604 or 904 on snare. 2x SM57 for me (top/bottom)

Used the e905?  That's my go to on top and any decent sdc on the under mic.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Timo Beckman on December 18, 2012, 05:26:01 AM
For recording and live i've used next to the senheizer clip ons
4022 or 4099(sax clip on with a drum clip) . The 4099 is realy good for this so you might give it a try
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: James A. Griffin on December 18, 2012, 03:39:13 PM
I'm looking to get some new clip-on tom mics and was just after some suggestions, so what are your favourite mics at the moment? I'll mainly be using them for louder rock/pop music but occasionally Jazz as well.

Also what are peoples opinion on the Sennheiser e604 vs. e904?? Worth the extra money?

Cheers!

After  using them almost exclusively for about 3 years, I'm very happy with my e904's...   Can't imagine a situation where they won't give me what I need.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Kristo Kotkas on January 12, 2013, 07:33:17 PM
I think sometimes we need to step back and step out of the comfort zone and remind ourselves what other tools we did use once and have forgotten about sounded like and/or force ourselves to check what new stuff might be out there.

One day I thought what a hell and set up a tracking setup with my Avid Profile and Pro Tools rig. I put up some mics I had at hand, put them around a floor tom, and then around a snare. I recorded a series of dynamic hits from very easy to as loud as I could hit. I also set up a hihat next to the snare to compare how much bleed each mic would give me.

The results were pretty amusing. Many mics could not handle the dynamics, failing to show difference between the loudest hits. It's easy to see that on the waveform. All mics sound different, that we know, but for me, the biggest difference turned out not to be the sound between mics, but the actual placement we use. The e604 I had with the original clamp, versus e604 that was put up on a stand and 5cm closer to the center of the floor tom had a HUGE difference in sound! So big, that I probably never will use a standard holder again with 604 :D

Overall, for me, Shure Beta 57 was a clear winner of the bunch I tested that day. And I don't remeber last time I had those on my kit. Sm57 was the worst on snare for me, pretty much the only mic I have used on snare for years... well...

I shared the test recording with my friends, and I have no problem sharing it with you guys if you are interested. The preamp gain was set at the same level for all the mics in each test, so you can also compare sensitivity. It was couple of months ago I did the test, so I don't remember all the mics I had up there, but file names should include mics names in use.

here is a pic of mics I tested on the snare and I think I see sm57, beta57, i5, D2, Oktava, Stagg *something* and two e604's

http://sphotos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/6057_4552157048702_1858721139_n.jpg

On toms I had about the same mics + beta98, I think.

Here are the audio files, about 100mb download.

http://db.tt/6idSlKxX

EDIT:

I found the pics I did when tesing, I'll add them too. I completely forgot that I tested some kick mics too, like basic beta52, e602 and the Audix one.

Micing pics: http://db.tt/U3TmS62k
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: g'bye, Dick Rees on January 12, 2013, 07:51:09 PM

the biggest difference turned out not to be the sound between mics, but the actual placement we use.

Yup.  Unfortunately, placement becomes problematic when dealing with your average stick-wielder.  Yes, you can get better sound with the mic in just the right place.  Will it allow the player to work within his "comfort zone"?  Will the mic survive the stick hits?
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Kristo Kotkas on January 12, 2013, 08:03:34 PM
Yup.  Unfortunately, placement becomes problematic when dealing with your average stick-wielder.  Yes, you can get better sound with the mic in just the right place.  Will it allow the player to work within his "comfort zone"?  Will the mic survive the stick hits?

You are right, but now, looking at the pics I see the difference between e604 placement was even less than I remembered it being. I think the holder design of 604 could be better, it sits too much at the edge giving that timbale-like overtone sound that we need to go in and scoop out. If we would be able to have the mic just-a-bit more on the tom it would make a big difference. I see Audix has a pretty nice tom clamp if you buy a kit of mics, does it give a better control over where you can set the mic on a drum?
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: George Dougherty on January 13, 2013, 11:22:00 PM
You are right, but now, looking at the pics I see the difference between e604 placement was even less than I remembered it being. I think the holder design of 604 could be better, it sits too much at the edge giving that timbale-like overtone sound that we need to go in and scoop out. If we would be able to have the mic just-a-bit more on the tom it would make a big difference. I see Audix has a pretty nice tom clamp if you buy a kit of mics, does it give a better control over where you can set the mic on a drum?

You can buy those clips individually as well without the kit.  The newer ones are better than the old style.  The giveaway is the grip to tighten the swivel.  Old ones are smooth and circular, new ones have big gear teeth for easy grip.  It's my favorite standard drum rim mount clip.  On toms I like the e904 positioned about 3" up off the head and aimed down toward the center.

Oh, and for snare mic position, I got my favorite from an old studio cat.  Unorthodox and all the drummers seem to want to "fix" it for me, but it goes out on the edge of the rim, almost touching.  The mic aims straight across the head with the capsule split in half (top/bottom) by the top edge of the rim.  Seems to capture a near perfect snare sound without many of the funky resonances and it nicely balances the volume between stick hits and cross sticking.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Earl F Young on January 14, 2013, 01:04:07 AM
the only change i would make: a D3 on the bottom

Use the e905  That's my go to on top and any decent sdc on the under mic.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: George Dougherty on January 15, 2013, 02:27:15 AM
the only change i would make: a D3 on the bottom
What's the advantage of the D3?  Maybe I mix mine different, but I tend to HP my bottom mic higher and just accentuate the snare range to bring that sizzle into it. I haven't found that anything really special is necessary with that approach and the sdc presents a nice accurate picture of the top end.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Tim McCulloch on January 15, 2013, 08:32:58 AM

Oh, and for snare mic position, I got my favorite from an old studio cat.  Unorthodox and all the drummers seem to want to "fix" it for me, but it goes out on the edge of the rim, almost touching.  The mic aims straight across the head with the capsule split in half (top/bottom) by the top edge of the rim.  Seems to capture a near perfect snare sound without many of the funky resonances and it nicely balances the volume between stick hits and cross sticking.
That's a great place for a mic, and it's fairly easy to balance the top/bottom sounds.  I get odd looks from drummers, too....

It's amazing what can be discovered if one puts in ear plugs and listens to the kit while the drummer plays....
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: Henry Moreau on January 15, 2013, 11:24:49 AM
Usta use live Sennheiser 421, AT m25 or 35, Shure Beta 56a, Oktava MK219, CAD 179, Shure 57 and beta version. These are all dependent upon the artist and set up in the studio now a days but live use for a number of years now it's been the Sennheiser 604.
Title: Re: Recommend me some tom mics.
Post by: George Dougherty on January 15, 2013, 02:03:45 PM
That's a great place for a mic, and it's fairly easy to balance the top/bottom sounds.  I get odd looks from drummers, too....

It's amazing what can be discovered if one puts in ear plugs and listens to the kit while the drummer plays....

Definitely one of the advantages of studio work over live work.  You often have that time and are sometimes even expected to take it.  One I want to sit down and do is record a few different mics on toms at various placements.  I teach some intro level classes to church sound volunteers and it would be handy to have a comparison video showing position of the mic and the accompanying tone captured.