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Title: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Scott Olewiler on August 18, 2014, 02:21:10 PM
Sorry meant to put this on the lounge. Have reposted it there.
Title: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Scott Olewiler on August 18, 2014, 02:23:41 PM
Accidentally posted this on the big board.  Moving here:

When I was rocking in the 80s and 90s almost every band with a 100 mile radius was using a Peavey PA. Saw FH stacks everywhere and plenty of SP2s and SP3s as well. It was pretty much standard road gear back then.  Now I'd be afraid no one would hire me if I had Peavey gear. Is that justified?

I went to see some former band mates over the weekend and they were playing to an outdoor crowd of about 700-800 people. I was hovering in the back trying to get some food and the mix was absolutely incredible. It was one of tightest cleanest mixes I have ever heard from a local band doing their own sound Sounded like a CD. I would think anybody playing to this crowd size would have been pleased as punch to have this mix.

 I knew they were using a 32 channel A& H board just from phone conversations with the drummer but I could not tell from a distance what they were using for mains. So during their first break I walk up to say hi to everyone and then I see they're using Older Peavey SP4s over top of some Peavey subs (single 18s) that I did not immediately recognize( really not familiar with Peavey stuff).  I was shocked (perhaps unjustly) that this incredible sounding mix was coming out of these Peavey cabs.

Really got me thinking about how we've managed to go from everyone using  Peavey stuff to now writing it off as not being up to snuff.  How did the Peavey name get so trashed? 
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Tim McCulloch on August 18, 2014, 02:41:05 PM
Accidentally posted this on the big board.  Moving here:

When I was rocking in the 80s and 90s almost every band with a 100 mile radius was using a Peavey PA. Saw FH stacks everywhere and plenty of SP2s and SP3s as well. It was pretty much standard road gear back then.  Now I'd be afraid no one would hire me if I had Peavey gear. Is that justified?

I went to see some former band mates over the weekend and they were playing to an outdoor crowd of about 700-800 people. I was hovering in the back trying to get some food and the mix was absolutely incredible. It was one of tightest cleanest mixes I have ever heard from a local band doing their own sound Sounded like a CD. I would think anybody playing to this crowd size would have been pleased as punch to have this mix.

 I knew they were using a 32 channel A& H board just from phone conversations with the drummer but I could not tell from a distance what they were using for mains. So during their first break I walk up to say hi to everyone and then I see they're using Older Peavey SP4s over top of some Peavey subs (single 18s) that I did not immediately recognize( really not familiar with Peavey stuff).  I was shocked (perhaps unjustly) that this incredible sounding mix was coming out of these Peavey cabs.

Really got me thinking about how we've managed to go from everyone using  Peavey stuff to now writing it off as not being up to snuff.  How did the Peavey name get so trashed?

There has been some very serious R&D going on at Peavey for as long as the company has been around.  That the products perform well in their given classes is not really a surprise.

There are multiple reasons for the brand bashing, but most of them stem from a primary source:  the end user is clueless and blames the tools for his/her inadequacies.

At a level above the "band's PA" market, the price-value orientation of Peavey's products made more feature-laden products affordable to the equally clueless; this is where a rider's  "No Peavey, no Mackie, no ABC" probably came from.  The folks that bought a big pile of Peavey SP and a Mackie SR console and thought there were in the big time were unable to deliver the *service* needed to make the concert or event happen satisfactorily.  The brands became associated with buyers and excluding these brands (and their market relatives) is a way to weed out the low-performing owners.

As to how the Peavey brand has faltered with performing musicians, I can only speculate that the demise of smaller 'mom & pop' or 'dad and lad' music stores, the original backbone of Peavey's retail marketing, have taken a major hit from both big-box retailers and on-line shopping.  As the adds you are served and even the items or prices you are offered online can be (and are) manipulated in real time, brand preferences based on perceived value and actual price can be shifted.  It's the "invisible hand of the market".  Uh huh.... /sarcasm
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Tom Young on August 18, 2014, 02:59:28 PM
Really got me thinking about how we've managed to go from everyone using  Peavey stuff to now writing it off as not being up to snuff.  How did the Peavey name get so trashed?

Peavey has always been perplexing to me as far as their marketing schemes, short and long term. Let me say that I have observed Peavey to produce some decent stuff (a few well-designed and affordable models) over the decades and I have used this stuff. But they have always suffered from "rider snobbery" and it was fairly well-known that they were excluded from/by most riders. That is not new. And look at all the lower cost competition they now have. Look at the dumbing-down of the pro audio market, who no longer have a CLUE about who designs what and how well they do it and they have no sense of belonging to a community, supporting those who they have developed a relationship with, etc.

Peavey buys Crest Consoles and then does what with it ? They let it slowly die in value.

Same with Crest power amplifiers.

They buy Mediamatrix and although that brand has survived and continues to be engineered/developed by dedicated (outside ?) engineering..... what have they done to expand this and capitalize on a very well recognized, "real" pro audio brand name ?

They develop a decent line array system and do what to market it ? Look at what Bose is doing with their no more complex or innovative Room Match system.

Peavey has NO relationship with consultants and most contracting firms.

Peavey has no presence with AES including exhibiting, writing papers and/or supporting standards.

When was the last time they upgraded any of their loudspeaker drivers ?

Etc, etc.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on August 18, 2014, 03:16:40 PM
Since you don't mention where your 100 mile radius was I suspect you experience was a product of good local dealers. Over the decades since Mackie amped up the industry marketing practice to sell product directly to end users, while simultaneously making small mom and pop distribution superfluous to sales. This fueled the rise of super stores or chains, while that evolution has not completely finished. (I expect direct sales via web to gain share).

IMO brand image or brand value is a classic zero sum game, so every time one brand gains value in the market, other brands lose value. If you take a longer view of the market you can see the ebb and flow.

Another factor is too much success selling products to entry level consumers ends up tarring the brand, saddling it to those same entry level customers. Many musicians when they get a taste of success, abandon the gear that they only used because it was the best they could afford. Now they can afford more so surely they need to buy more expensive gear.

Of course this is just a glimpse into the world of brand management. I read at least one book on that subject and even that wasn't everything about it.

I have been outside the castle walls long enough that I can't speak intelligently about the modern Peavey. At the time I left my biggest arguments were over marketing, but I am no expert at that either.   8)

JR
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Alex Rigodanzo on August 18, 2014, 03:19:28 PM
From the standpoint of small bands in my small market, I did notice that after JBL SR stuff starting appearing on the used market, many guys upgraded to those.  Also, JBL started making bottom line stuff and people who didn't know better went "ooh, I can get JBL for the same price as that Peavey".   I've mixed on a couple Peavey consoles that did the job and I've heard plenty of Peavey boxes that sounded fine.

Like others, I firmly believe that poor operators are to blame for most of the crappy sound and not the gear itself.  Almost any boxes that are appropriately sized to the venue can be made to sound perfectly acceptable if properly tuned and fed something that sounds good to begin with.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Steve M Smith on August 18, 2014, 03:31:03 PM
I have done plenty of shows with SP2s, FH1s, CS amps and MK IV mixers in the past with no problems.   Often with Peavey graphics and reverb/delay units in the rack.

I don't really understand the snobbery involved with Peavey bashing as it all works fine (although I don't have much knowledge of their current equipment).

In fact, a friend still has some SP2s and FH1s in his shed.  I should organise a retro gig with 80s bands and equipment!

EDIT:  And another friend regularly gigs with Peavey UL15s and UL118s which sound good to me.


Steve.
Title: Re: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Seth Albaum on August 18, 2014, 03:51:59 PM
Well, I have a appr. 1979-80 Peavey Mark-something 16 channel with built-in spring reverb that's still fun to play with. Only thing wrong with it is foam rot in the case. Not sure if I can trust the meters, though.

I also had, briefly, 15" passive 2-ways with double horn-loaded piezo tweeters. They were good to stand on when I needed to reach things. Also, a CS400 amp.

I think the newer wave of discount brands just did them in? They still exist, though, whoever owns em..
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on August 18, 2014, 04:18:04 PM
Peavey has always been perplexing to me as far as their marketing schemes, short and long term. Let me say that I have observed Peavey to produce some decent stuff (a few well-designed and affordable models) over the decades and I have used this stuff. But they have always suffered from "rider snobbery" and it was fairly well-known that they were excluded from/by most riders. That is not new. And look at all the lower cost competition they now have. Look at the dumbing-down of the pro audio market, who no longer have a CLUE about who designs what and how well they do it and they have no sense of belonging to a community, supporting those who they have developed a relationship with, etc.

Peavey buys Crest Consoles and then does what with it ? They let it slowly die in value.

Same with Crest power amplifiers.

They buy Mediamatrix and although that brand has survived and continues to be engineered/developed by dedicated (outside ?) engineering..... what have they done to expand this and capitalize on a very well recognized, "real" pro audio brand name ?

They develop a decent line array system and do what to market it ? Look at what Bose is doing with their no more complex or innovative Room Match system.

Peavey has NO relationship with consultants and most contracting firms.

Peavey has no presence with AES including exhibiting, writing papers and/or supporting standards.

When was the last time they upgraded any of their loudspeaker drivers ?

Etc, etc.

I just deleted my long point by point response to your list of failings because I shared way too much inside information, and all my first hand information is almost 15 years old. 

Lets just say my recollection of back when I was working there does not completely agree with your characterization for here and now, while i agree with a few of your criticisms.

Not to harp on this but I did walk away, so I was disappointed years ago.

JR
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Jamin Lynch on August 18, 2014, 04:51:14 PM
I feel most of their problem is they only make OK gear....not great gear.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Richard Turner on August 18, 2014, 05:07:16 PM
First off I will speak to what happened in the frozen North of Canada.

Basically peavey abandoned the territory.  Essientially by shutting down the Peavey Canada stocking warehouse they may as well have said they were closing up shop here. Years ago when it was in operation you could have 3 day or less turn around for a blown driver, fried crossover cap, broken handle, amp transistors etc and at the time many of the mom and pop stores would have a 15 and 18 " basket and a couple 22XT HF kits on hand just because they disintegrated frequently enough and most of them were also warranty depots as well as retailers.

After that warehouse system was gone rumors through the grapevine was Peavey eanted the stores to basically order their years worth of PA in the fall along with their Holiday guitar stuff, eg 2 orders a year, minimum 10K before any talk of freight allowance let alone discounts those would be on deep 6 figure orders, of course all orders were on net 30 account.

Apparently now all orders for Canada are processed on day every 2 weeks and shipped together then skids broken down for courrier shipment once across the border. Or so said the service tech repairing a couple crest amps for me.

At the same time I thing a lot of their downfall came from putting the 1000 watt rating on the SP5 box and letting any idiot loose with them to do sound, they were actually a decent box to a certain volume, about 50 watts rms input

So a lot of mom and pop stores were courted by Yamaha, Carvin agressivly marked their factory direct sales model. A lot of peavey dealers just sold what they could to whoever wanted to buy it, "oh you cant afford what you actually need for the gig? buy the sp5 and lower end sub" rather than actually sell what should have been sold. Stuff blew up, Things got sticky for warranty claims, remember when any discoloration of a voice coil was operator abuse? They tried winning ppl back with the 5 year if powered by peavy amp warranty plan.

What else went on? Oh yeah the Mackie SRM450 and JBL EONG15 showed up, QSC came out with some amps that didnt fail as much... Long and McQuade music stores expanded and with the store owners having a stake in Yorkville any city they moved into had a drastic change in how Band lever MI grade rentals pricing was structured plus they had the TX system on tap......

as for Peavey they certainly have had some things well ahead of the times. The FLS feedback EQ, the HDH system Had one many years ago, with the processor controller you could get a pile of full range sound using small amplifiers  It was big and nasty to move but once set up it was an excellent full range system (not a ton of bass unless you added subs below it) but still would run all day and night without distorting unless you really abused it.


What was the question again . I'm rambling.......


Oh yes there also was the focus on architectural acoustics and the sanctuary series....paint it white charge twice as much
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Rick Scofield on August 18, 2014, 05:08:40 PM
I can speak to my experience with Peavey.  Always performed very well, and any damage that I caused from missuse was easily repaired for very little money.

All "upgrades" away from Peavey for me were due to weight and size for my smallish set up, essentially:

Years ago I bought a brand new pair of SP2X, biamped them with a PV2600 and PV260, complete with crossover and input/output panel in the rack.  They sounded really good, but they are HUGE and pretty heavy boxes, and the amp rack still makes my back hurt just thinking about it.

I found that I could get very similar performance from a simpler set up of Yamaha SM12IV run passive off a QSC PLX2402.

Shaved off more than half the weight of the Peavey system, so easier on the load in and out, less space in the truck/car/trailer, and less space to store.

Now I've moved away from that system by going with JBL PRX612 mains, and no amp rack.  Yamahas were used as monitors, until I moved to all IEMs.

Could Peavey offer similar packages along my upgrade path?  Sure, but I did most if not all of my research here at PSW, and followed the advice of many of the folks here. 

It's PSW's fault...

-Rick

Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Lee Douglas on August 18, 2014, 05:37:27 PM
From my speculative and first hand experience- In the early eighties, when I first started doing this, Peavey made it possible for a rookie/inexperienced guy like my to get his feet wet and get a taste of what was possible.  They offered gear that was damn near indestructible and easy enough to fix should you manage to do so.  Then it happened as it is so often prone to do on this end of the scale: Somebody lowered the bar.  A plethora of companies whose names we all know and loath started churning out gear through the overseas grinder that was more disposable than repairable, and at a lower price point.  I always thought that Peavey seemed torn at that point.  Not wanting to join the race to the bottom and not really being in a position to join the upper echelon of manufacturers of high end gear.

I started putting the "No Peavey" etc. lines on my riders not out of gear snobbery, but because much of the gear I was seeing was getting extremely long in the tooth and the people that were getting a hold of that gear at this point were generally not very experienced and this was a way of precluding them from providing.  It's not necessarily the gear.  I own eight SP118X subs that have made a great scalable low end part of a mid sized system for years.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Steve M Smith on August 18, 2014, 06:00:01 PM
the HDH system Had one many years ago, with the processor controller you could get a pile of full range sound using small amplifiers  It was big and nasty to move but once set up it was an excellent full range system (not a ton of bass unless you added subs below it) but still would run all day and night without distorting unless you really abused it.

I have mentioned this before so apologies for boring people, but all of my sound engineering in the 80s and early 90s was done for our local music shop which, together with the other two shops they owned on the south coast of England, sold more Peavey gear than any other seller in the UK.
Because of this, Peavey let us take a truck up to their Corby (UK) factory and fill it up with HDH system (including subs and the HDH processed monitors) which we then used for a one week yachting regatta's evening entertainment (Cowes Week).

The HDH system was great,  At the time we were using either SP2s on FH1s or a mis-matched pile of JBL 4560s, Martin Ws and other unwanted cabs.

It was a pity when we had to take it back as we could have got a lot of use out of that system.


Steve.
Title: Re: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Stu McDoniel on August 18, 2014, 08:54:13 PM
Sorry meant to put this on the lounge. Have reposted it there.
Quite actually...yes of course the newer Peavy boxes for
sound reinforcement are way better sounding "schtuff".
There is an ex Peavy Engineer that lives just north of here that makes
killer guitar pedals and boutique type amps.
Remember Peavy "Earth" amps?
;)
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on August 18, 2014, 09:03:55 PM
First off I will speak to what happened in the frozen North of Canada.

Basically peavey abandoned the territory.  Essientially by shutting down the Peavey Canada stocking warehouse they may as well have said they were closing up shop here. Years ago when it was in operation you could have 3 day or less turn around for a blown driver, fried crossover cap, broken handle, amp transistors etc and at the time many of the mom and pop stores would have a 15 and 18 " basket and a couple 22XT HF kits on hand just because they disintegrated frequently enough and most of them were also warranty depots as well as retailers.
Since I appear to still be the Peavey answer man some 15 years after quitting please allow me to share some perspective. How many international companies not based in Canada do you know that have company run stocking warehouses in Canada? It cost money to sit on inventory and I recall the frustration from having inventory in Canada that US customers wanted and vice versa. I remember back when Peavey had factory direct reps in Canada, and even recall the top guy for Canada (Alan S), but international distribution was not my area of responsibility so I do not know the details surrounding the dealings, but it probably went something like this. The top guy was ready to retire, and/or his special deal contract was expiring. The US pencil pushers were well aware of the huge cost to support a warehouse in the great white north, then there were probably distributors with their mouths watering to get the Peavey business. The math was pretty simple for Peavey. Free up a bunch of capital formally sunk in inventory, eliminate the overhead from maintaining distant buildings and personnel in Canada, finally just get paid to sell product to canada in bulk so the distributor can distribute it.

It sounds like a no-brainer from a business perspective. Trying to manage canada from a distance could never be done as well as locally, but apparently it wasn't in your opinion. I suspect the distributor did not stock product as deeply nor support the market as well as Peavey did even from a distance.   
Quote
After that warehouse system was gone rumors through the grapevine was Peavey eanted the stores to basically order their years worth of PA in the fall along with their Holiday guitar stuff, eg 2 orders a year, minimum 10K before any talk of freight allowance let alone discounts those would be on deep 6 figure orders, of course all orders were on net 30 account.
Probably not Peavey but more likely the new improved Canadian distributor who did not have Peavey's deep pockets. Just like they want ice water in hell, distributors want dealers to fund the inventory not them. 
Quote
Apparently now all orders for Canada are processed on day every 2 weeks and shipped together then skids broken down for courrier shipment once across the border. Or so said the service tech repairing a couple crest amps for me.
And how do you think it works? Orders to most intl distributors are aggregated into full container loads to ship efficiently. I guarantee you if the cost for shipping skus individually, then clearing customs with all the paper work handled individually, with that cost added to the price before mark up for retail sale Peavey would not be a value product any more.  Shipping to Canada LTL is an accommodation most distributors don't get (probably). Shipping every two weeks is better than once a month.   
Quote
At the same time I thing a lot of their downfall came from putting the 1000 watt rating on the SP5 box and letting any idiot loose with them to do sound, they were actually a decent box to a certain volume, about 50 watts rms input
?? I'll take you word for that...  8)
Quote
So a lot of mom and pop stores were courted by Yamaha, Carvin agressivly marked their factory direct sales model. A lot of peavey dealers just sold what they could to whoever wanted to buy it, "oh you cant afford what you actually need for the gig? buy the sp5 and lower end sub" rather than actually sell what should have been sold. Stuff blew up, Things got sticky for warranty claims, remember when any discoloration of a voice coil was operator abuse? They tried winning ppl back with the 5 year if powered by peavy amp warranty plan.
The 5 year warranty was done by Peavey US, but if Canada had their own distribution warranty claims were the distributors responsibility. As i recall international distributors pay a cheaper price when they purchase the original product to cover later warranty claims. I was involved in the review when we extended the warranty to 5 years and that decision was pretty easy.
Quote
What else went on? Oh yeah the Mackie SRM450 and JBL EONG15 showed up, QSC came out with some amps that didnt fail as much... Long and McQuade music stores expanded and with the store owners having a stake in Yorkville any city they moved into had a drastic change in how Band lever MI grade rentals pricing was structured plus they had the TX system on tap......
yes it is not a secret that Yorkville started with Long and Mcquade. Their first store was on Yorkville street.  8)
Quote
as for Peavey they certainly have had some things well ahead of the times. The FLS feedback EQ, the HDH system Had one many years ago, with the processor controller you could get a pile of full range sound using small amplifiers  It was big and nasty to move but once set up it was an excellent full range system (not a ton of bass unless you added subs below it) but still would run all day and night without distorting unless you really abused it.


What was the question again . I'm rambling.......


Oh yes there also was the focus on architectural acoustics and the sanctuary series....paint it white charge twice as much
The question was about what has happened to Peavey.

JR
Title: Re: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Ivan Beaver on August 18, 2014, 09:05:12 PM
Quite actually...yes of course the newer Peavy boxes for
sound reinforcement are way better sounding "schtuff".
There is an ex Peavy Engineer that lives just north of here that makes
killer guitar pedals and boutique type amps.
Remember Peavy "Earth" amps?
;)
Peavey never made Earth amps.  Earth was a DIRECT copy of the Peaveys-down to some "errors" in the designs.

Even the catalogs of the time were almost direct copies.  Yes I have some of them.  Even the pencil drawings/style etc.

If you want the schematic of an "Earth" amp-just find the Peavey like it and get a copy-you will have what you need.

That was NOT a happy chapter in the Peavey family album.
Title: Re: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on August 18, 2014, 09:13:08 PM
Quite actually...yes of course the newer Peavy boxes for
sound reinforcement are way better sounding "schtuff".
There is an ex Peavy Engineer that lives just north of here that makes
killer guitar pedals and boutique type amps.
Remember Peavy "Earth" amps?
;)

It's spelled Peavey and I got to know James Brown very well... He is a serious guitar amp designer (did the 5150 with EVH) and now has his own guitar pedal company that doesn't suck.  (amptweaker any players lurking here could do a lot worse)

JR

PS: Earth amps were not Peavey, but the inspiration is apparent.
Title: Re: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Russ Davis on August 18, 2014, 10:01:36 PM
PS: Earth amps were not Peavey, but the inspiration is apparent.

Decades ago (late '70s), my Peavey dealer told me he'd had a factory tour in Meridian, and along the way he saw a display of a cutaway Peavey amp head with its Earth counterpart beside it.   He said they may have been identical cosmetically, but there were MAJOR differences inside the boxes, with the Peavey obviously being better built.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Richard Turner on August 18, 2014, 10:09:30 PM
never take anythign I say on the internet too seriously

But If I knew up front a warranty claim for any brand would be held up for an additional possible 2 weeks before a parts order was picked let alone shipped it would influence the purchase decision. Could mean over a month for even a simple repair if it required a proprietary part, or someone elses unit was ahead of me in line and used up the last in stock part at the service depot.

I forget what ownership stake Jack Long has in Yorkville sound. Rumour had it at 15-25% a few years back.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on August 18, 2014, 10:48:03 PM
never take anythign I say on the internet too seriously

But If I knew up front a warranty claim for any brand would be held up for an additional possible 2 weeks before a parts order was picked let alone shipped it would influence the purchase decision. Could mean over a month for even a simple repair if it required a proprietary part, or someone elses unit was ahead of me in line and used up the last in stock part at the service depot.

I forget what ownership stake Jack Long has in Yorkville sound. Rumour had it at 15-25% a few years back.
Yorkville product was pretty well respected by Peavey. IIRC their early business model involved supporting a lot of rental programs and that is where a product's ruggedness really gets tested. If you can survive rentals you can survive weekend warriors who aren't trying to blow you up for fun.

JR
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Richard Turner on August 19, 2014, 12:40:38 AM
Actually several products come to mind so far as designed to rent and retail sales being a by product so far as Yorkville. And I did push the point with a couple of the sales reps one day at a demo.

The Lighting systems are a key example, most certainly the LPLED-4 . it retails at abot $1500 per bar, and the small pedal board controller was about 350 and it ships in a plain cardboard box with a photo copied instruction sheet.

But those 3 pieces plus a sturdy set of stands (SKS-50T I've never seen a set on offer used, they never come up because they never break) consistantly rent for $75 a day $115 a weekend and the local store cant keep them on hand in the rental dept but the local manager said head office wont put in a 4th system for rent here so I bought a set and its been a profitable piece for me just from their overflow.

Add in the fact 2 year even if someone spills drinks on it or drops it warranty plus loaner gear when its off for repair.... no wonder they freeze out a lot of locals when they ove to town. All I can say is when they moved in I quit rentals the next week. Its their gravy money and they tend to it. 6 years later and I'm just slowly seeing some rentals at their level of gear come back. I'm just glad they rent it as a pile o stuff, nothing goes out ready to go, as opposed to my  rental, everythign wired up and cased. There are some mid level ones who seem to appreciate a rolling rack ready to go

But just like all brands they have had hits and misses.

I had the Peavey HDH244T/118sub HC as well as the HDH3/4 boxes before picking up my EF508/LS808 yorkville and honestly it was a lateral move.

I had the EF500p/LS800p as well and sold them and kept the passive stuff. the 800p was a grand slam home run but the 500p top was a lame dog

I had the crest branded peavey system, forget the model number but the sub was what became the triflex sub unit, 15" lo-rider driver on an amp module that could use half its power to run passive tops, it was ok for pre recorded stuff but wimped out at live bands. I had the crest branded plastic box powered tops, same as impulse line with odd grilles, had them for a very short time

had the yorkie nx55p, was a decent generic box and far easier to service than the eon15 g2 but the 55 was in need of some eq to be useable

What else peavy have I had the "pleasure" of owning

cs800 boat anchor
cs800x
cs1200x
cs800s
pv12c?
pv8.5c
pv2600
gps3500
2000h

118hc
sp2 original wigh big kiss horn
sp2xt
sp2g
sp4 (xt)
sp5xt
sp5g
112tls
forget the model 4505m was a 45degree monitor black widow plus 22 horn sealed box
Project5--------those were a decent box but bi amp required was ok with the aps in a rack using crossover cans well ahead of its time but I was alwas terrified of blowing the special midrange speaker as it was obsolete by the time I owned them
hdh3
hdh4
hdh244T
HDH processor
VRC? 2/3 way crossover
Cosmos subsonic processor/crossover
some reverb thingy

many many of the eq's both with and without FLS

theres likely more I have erased from my mind

It was decent gear for making noise with at the time was inexpensive to buy as mostly when sold used it had a problem and I had a friendly dealer at that time (pre internet proliferation) who knew answering my call was mostly a short conversation ending in selling a couple hundred in parts to someone who called and ordered by part number.

But again I think a number of factors rallied against Peavey at the time. Folding the Canadian  warehouse however it went down, Key staff retirement, bean counters, new blood thinking short term profits makes little difference now after the fact. Internet sales swiftly undercut the mom and pop outfits who saw a PA sale as a direct compete to their rental fleet. I had somewhere a confidential copy of Yamaha's "how to sucessfully rent PA" booklet they used to pass to new stores taking on the line. I vagely recall some cut throat info in there. Other things like basically only appearing to change the grilles on the MI range of stuff every couple years didnt really generate the wow factor.  I get that there were actual improvments but at first blush it just looked like the same old thing wth new sheet metal.

I get that the QW series is more than semi pro grade but its so similar looking to the sp series who would know from 50 feet on looks?
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Mike Hedden on August 19, 2014, 10:20:18 AM
I personally have never understood the snobbery.  As an example Behringer starts out as an innovative German manufacturer then moves all manufacturing to China and proceeds to make disposable products at ridiculously low prices  including at least a few blatant copies (lots of litigation which is a fact not an opinion) and the market laps them up like crazy.  At least in the US their customer service is almost nonexistent yet  regardless whether its pro Behringer Midas apologist posts or just folks buying their product, they seem to get a free pass.  Same thing can be said of Mackie, a company founded on innovative US based manufacturing yet post acquisition the corporate suits move off shore and its not the same company. Remember the SR48/56 debacle!
There's a long list of similar companies and I know its not just in audio, some of it is just a sad reality of once the pioneer is gone the soul tends to leave the company as well.   I'm not saying Peavey is perfect at all but there's no doubt they are measured with a different set of scales.

Mike Hedden
Danley Sound Labs, Inc.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Tim McCulloch on August 19, 2014, 10:38:24 AM
There's a long list of similar companies and I know its not just in audio, some of it is just a sad reality of once the pioneer is gone the soul tends to leave the company as well.   I'm not saying Peavey is perfect at all but there's no doubt they are measured with a different set of scales.

Mike Hedden
Danley Sound Labs, Inc.

Peavey only has to answer to Hartley, for the most part.  He's 73 or thereabouts so probably has a few more years being the boss, the open question is what happens when he retires (which will probably happen only when he passes away).

For all the reported crankiness, Hartley pretty much did something nobody thought could be done:  create an international musical instrument (and related stuff like PA) manufacturer in the deep south that built products that typically represented great value for the money spent.  Some products were better than others, but on the whole Peavey showed a willingness to stick the company neck out, both in public release and in private R&D.

Based on what I know these days, if I were going back to being a "guy with a van full of PA" that PA would probably have a fair amount of Peavey product and zero Mackie content.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on August 19, 2014, 12:12:06 PM
I personally have never understood the snobbery.  As an example Behringer starts out as an innovative German manufacturer then moves all manufacturing to China and proceeds to make disposable products at ridiculously low prices  including at least a few blatant copies (lots of litigation which is a fact not an opinion) and the market laps them up like crazy.  At least in the US their customer service is almost nonexistent yet  regardless whether its pro Behringer Midas apologist posts or just folks buying their product, they seem to get a free pass. 
Behringer has not exactly gotten a free pass from older experienced industry professionals but for most customers it is all about what have you done for me lately, and lately Behringer has been well behaved. Uli has personally participated in a charm offensive to reposition the brand, and the X-32 is a remarkable achievement that changes how even us old timers look at the company. 
Quote

Same thing can be said of Mackie, a company founded on innovative US based manufacturing yet post acquisition the corporate suits move off shore and its not the same company. Remember the SR48/56 debacle!
I'm afraid I see that history a little differently. Mackie moved manufacturing offshore because their only other choice was to suffer significantly lower sales as most customers did not care where the products were built. While they did care a lot about what they cost. Mackie's remarkable initial growth was fueled by an outsized one SKU ad budget that when spread across multiple SKUs had less impact. 
Quote

There's a long list of similar companies and I know its not just in audio, some of it is just a sad reality of once the pioneer is gone the soul tends to leave the company as well.   I'm not saying Peavey is perfect at all but there's no doubt they are measured with a different set of scales.

Mike Hedden
Danley Sound Labs, Inc.
Since I have been outside the walls for over a decade I have little more than speculation about today's Peavey. I'd rather not speculate too much about things I do not know.

JR
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: lindsay Dean on August 19, 2014, 01:42:16 PM
Behringer has not exactly gotten a free pass from older experienced industry professionals but for most customers it is all about what have you done for me lately, and lately Behringer has been well behaved. Uli has personally participated in a charm offensive to reposition the brand, and the X-32 is a remarkable achievement that changes how even us old timers look at the company.  I'm afraid I see that history a little differently. Mackie moved manufacturing offshore because their only other choice was to suffer significantly lower sales as most customers did not care where the products were built. While they did care a lot about what they cost. Mackie's remarkable initial growth was fueled by an outsized one SKU ad budget that when spread across multiple SKUs had less impact.  Since I have been outside the walls for over a decade I have little more than speculation about today's Peavey. I'd rather not speculate too much about things I do not know.

JR

I know this is veering but,
On the x32 console comment, making the brand look better overall is much like saying one steak sandwich on a plate makes all the turd sandwiches taste better.......not
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Tim McCulloch on August 19, 2014, 01:58:24 PM
I know this is veering but,
On the x32 console comment, making the brand look better overall is much like saying one steak sandwich on a plate makes all the turd sandwiches taste better.......not

Well to the folks that weren't around 20 years ago the current "charm offensive" is effective, and for those of us who were, we are watching to see if it's smoke and mirrors or if B has really changed their behavior across all model lines.  It would do them little good, as a brand, to do well with the X32 and continue the previous service levels for other products... OTOH, bringing that level of service to bare for the entire company would be very expensive.

Time will tell.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on August 19, 2014, 04:56:59 PM
I know this is veering but,
On the x32 console comment, making the brand look better overall is much like saying one steak sandwich on a plate makes all the turd sandwiches taste better.......not
I wouldn't know I never tried to eat a turd sandwich. :-(

But yes, that is kind of how it works for brand management, break through products can raise the image for the entire brand. 

JR

PS: Unprofessional comments about Behringer or any brand makes me inclined to defend them. I really dislike defending Behringer so please give me a break.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Steve M Smith on August 19, 2014, 05:22:22 PM
PS: Unprofessional comments about Behringer or any brand makes me inclined to defend them. I really dislike defending Behringer so please give me a break.

When the X32 was released, the internet was full of negative comments by people who had never used one, telling us how bad it was based on it having a Behringer logo.  I commented at the time that if it had a Midas logo instead, there would be comments from people who had never used one, telling us how good it was.

Now that there is an M32 version, I hope those people are suitably confused!


Steve.
Title: Re: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Stu McDoniel on August 19, 2014, 08:31:00 PM
It's spelled Peavey and I got to know James Brown very well... He is a serious guitar amp designer (did the 5150 with EVH) and now has his own guitar pedal company that doesn't suck.  (amptweaker any players lurking here could do a lot worse)

JR

PS: Earth amps were not Peavey, but the inspiration is apparent.
Peavey never made Earth amps.  Earth was a DIRECT copy of the Peaveys-down to some "errors" in the designs.

Even the catalogs of the time were almost direct copies.  Yes I have some of them.  Even the pencil drawings/style etc.

If you want the schematic of an "Earth" amp-just find the Peavey like it and get a copy-you will have what you need.

That was NOT a happy chapter in the Peavey family album.
Sorry about the spelling.   Tim Jauernig is his handle.
Title: Re: Re Post: Whatever happened to the Peavey name?
Post by: Tim McCulloch on August 20, 2014, 12:05:03 AM
When the X32 was released, the internet was full of negative comments by people who had never used one, telling us how bad it was based on it having a Behringer logo.  I commented at the time that if it had a Midas logo instead, there would be comments from people who had never used one, telling us how good it was.

Now that there is an M32 version, I hope those people are suitably confused!


Steve.

There is, in fact a small group over at SFN doing exactly that - postulating about the superiority of the M32 - for 2 months.  Until 2 days ago, nobody contributing had one to listen to.