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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => LAB: The Classic Live Audio Board => Topic started by: Ivan Feder on March 12, 2014, 08:18:55 AM

Title: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Ivan Feder on March 12, 2014, 08:18:55 AM
Heard Yamaha is announcing a V2 for CL consoles in May. I would love to see a new UDK function that recalls fader combinations ( ie: channels 1 through 32 or 33 through 64 ) instead of having to push multiple custom keys.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Justice C. Bigler on March 12, 2014, 01:34:15 PM
It damn well better include the Dugan auto mixing software that the QL line is getting.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Leland Green on March 12, 2014, 01:56:22 PM
Heard Yamaha is announcing a V2 for CL consoles in May. I would love to see a new UDK function that recalls fader combinations ( ie: channels 1 through 32 or 33 through 64 ) instead of having to push multiple custom keys.

Hi Ivan,

The fader panels are in "Recall Safe" mode by default.  If you would like the fader panel to display a particular fader bank when a scene is recalled, please disable "Recall Safe" for the desired panels in the "Channel Job" / "Recall Safe" menu.  Then select the fader banks you would like to display and save your scene.

Regards,

Leland
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Justice C. Bigler on March 12, 2014, 02:17:42 PM
It damn well better include the Dugan auto mixing software that the QL line is getting.


According to this press release: http://yamahacommercialaudiosystems.com/news_detail.php?newsID=362


The CL will be getting the Dugan auto mixing in a later software version... :-\
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Milt Hathaway on March 12, 2014, 02:29:01 PM

According to this press release: http://yamahacommercialaudiosystems.com/news_detail.php?newsID=362


The CL will be getting the Dugan auto mixing in a later software version... :-\

Maybe that means a fire sale on Dugan MY-cards real soon. I could handle that.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Ivan Feder on March 12, 2014, 03:01:03 PM
Hi Ivan,

The fader panels are in "Recall Safe" mode by default.  If you would like the fader panel to display a particular fader bank when a scene is recalled, please disable "Recall Safe" for the desired panels in the "Channel Job" / "Recall Safe" menu.  Then select the fader banks you would like to display and save your scene.

Regards,

Leland
Hi Leland,
That's not really what is was talking about. Like many users  I like to have 32 inputs visible on one layer (1st fader bank 1-16, 2nd fader bank 17-24 and 3rd fader bank 25-32) but let's say I have selected on fader bank 2, DCAs and on fader bank 3, mixes 1-8,  it takes the push of 2 buttons to get back to the 1-32 view ( 3 pushes for channels 33 to 64 view). Would be nice to be able to do that hitting one button. A " fader snapshot view " of all 32 faders programmable either on a custom button ( maybe C6 and C7) or a UDK would really be great.
Thanks!

Ivan
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: John Penkala on March 12, 2014, 03:08:59 PM
It damn well better include the Dugan auto mixing software that the QL line is getting.

 That would be unfortunate for me. I am in the process of putting together a CL5/ 2x RIO3224/ Fiber networking package with a Dugan card for a client. The gear is already in!
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Justice C. Bigler on March 12, 2014, 03:16:28 PM
That would be unfortunate for me. I am in the process of putting together a CL5/ 2x RIO3224/ Fiber networking package with a Dugan card for a client. The gear is already in!


Read my last response. It's going to be included in a Version 2+ software release.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Ric Arnold on March 12, 2014, 06:36:43 PM
On V2 (or sooner!) I'd love to have the Display show the channel bank selected (8 channel view) when I press the SEL key on the left bank of faders. This was a god send on the M7, to ensure users were adjusting the correct channels.

Currently the only way to see the selected 8 channel view is via the Centra section buttons.
This means to see the overview of the left bank I have to: Press the Centra button for the correct 8 channel bank, THEN press SEL on the channel I want. 2 pushes, and room for error :-(
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Leland Green on March 13, 2014, 12:48:30 AM
Hi Leland,
That's not really what is was talking about. Like many users  I like to have 32 inputs visible on one layer (1st fader bank 1-16, 2nd fader bank 17-24 and 3rd fader bank 25-32) but let's say I have selected on fader bank 2, DCAs and on fader bank 3, mixes 1-8,  it takes the push of 2 buttons to get back to the 1-32 view ( 3 pushes for channels 33 to 64 view). Would be nice to be able to do that hitting one button. A " fader snapshot view " of all 32 faders programmable either on a custom button ( maybe C6 and C7) or a UDK would really be great.
Thanks!

Ivan

Ahh...ok.  You'd like to have a function similar to "Layer Snapshot", which is available on the PM5D console.  Yes, this is not available on the CL Series at this time.  However, I have a workaround for you using scenes and "Recall Focus" which could be useful.  This method will require a little practice before using on a show as you will have to keep track of which scenes contain your "show" data and which are only being used as a "Layer Snapshot".


I created a document with more details and some pictures to help with the setup.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/e812uvff0wsu6cz/Layer%20Snapshot%20Alternative.pdf  (https://www.dropbox.com/s/e812uvff0wsu6cz/Layer%20Snapshot%20Alternative.pdf)

I hope this helps for now!  I will let the development team know about your request.

Regards,

Leland
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Ivan Feder on March 13, 2014, 06:28:19 AM
On V2 (or sooner!) I'd love to have the Display show the channel bank selected (8 channel view) when I press the SEL key on the left bank of faders. This was a god send on the M7, to ensure users were adjusting the correct channels.

Currently the only way to see the selected 8 channel view is via the Centra section buttons.
This means to see the overview of the left bank I have to: Press the Centra button for the correct 8 channel bank, THEN press SEL on the channel I want. 2 pushes, and room for error :-(

nice one Ric!
 Forgot that feature was availalable on the M7
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Mac Kerr on March 13, 2014, 08:22:06 AM
Ahh...ok.  You'd like to have a function similar to "Layer Snapshot", which is available on the PM5D console.  Yes, this is not available on the CL Series at this time.  However, I have a workaround for you using scenes and "Recall Focus" which could be useful.  This method will require a little practice before using on a show as you will have to keep track of which scenes contain your "show" data and which are only being used as a "Layer Snapshot".

  • Disable Recall Safe for the Fader Banks
  • Store your "Layer Snapshot" scenes (might be a good idea to store them in the upper numbers and lock them)
  • Enable "Recall Focus" on just the fader banks for each "Layer Snapshot" scene
  • Create User Defined Keys to "Direct Recall" each "Layer Snapshot" scene

I created a document with more details and some pictures to help with the setup.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/e812uvff0wsu6cz/Layer%20Snapshot%20Alternative.pdf  (https://www.dropbox.com/s/e812uvff0wsu6cz/Layer%20Snapshot%20Alternative.pdf)

I hope this helps for now!  I will let the development team know about your request.

Regards,

Leland

Leland,

As a corollary to that, I would like to see a better way to handle moving faders to the Centralogic section when you are using custom fader layers. Once you are using custom layers, the old way of looking at inputs 1-8, 9-16 etc, doesn't make much sense. It's too late for this generation, but I think it is time to abandon that metaphor. Let there be a standard setup in scene 000 that has the faders assigned that way for those that want to use the console that way, but have only custom fader layers that can be set up in other ways for those that want to. At that point, the Centralogic banks should be the way the custom layers are set up rather than the completely arbitrary 1-8 etc.

My 2p

Mac
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Riley Casey on March 13, 2014, 09:26:58 AM
I'm still looking for that most mundane but vital of functions in the editor app for all of the Yamaha consoles since the 5d. A printable version of the patch windows and / or the option to export them as tab text.   Also , when making patch changes, if a channel has a user entered name then the "steal patch " confirmation pop up should display that name as well as the default name to make patching faster and more reliable.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Andrew Broughton on March 13, 2014, 10:30:55 AM
I'm still looking for that most mundane but vital of functions in the editor app for all of the Yamaha consoles since the 5d. A printable version of the patch windows and / or the option to export them as tab text.
http://www.checkcheckonetwo.com/forum/showthread.php?1028-OMT-new-version
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Josh Hana on March 13, 2014, 10:44:06 AM
Maybe that means a fire sale on Dugan MY-cards real soon. I could handle that.

Ahh I haven't considered this. One can only hope
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Riley Casey on March 16, 2014, 03:05:06 PM
Stereo matrices.  This is something that the old analog PM3500 had, its something that the Digico's have and it would be a real value add.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Frederik Rosenkjær on March 16, 2014, 06:17:11 PM
Stereo matrices.  This is something that the old analog PM3500 had, its something that the Digico's have and it would be a real value add.

They have that?

Pairing the matrixes gives you up to 4 stereo matrixes. True, it does decimate the number of matrixes but the functionality is there.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Riley Casey on March 16, 2014, 06:30:34 PM
Stereo matrices as in I wish the CL5 had them and they should go on the the wish list.  I NEVER have enough matrices and wish that instead of turning matrices into mix busses as the new QL touts as a big feature that I could instead turn mixes into matrices.  I max out my matrix count 100 times more often than the mix count. Post fade mixes just don't do what I want more often than not.

They have that?

Pairing the matrixes gives you up to 4 stereo matrixes. True, it does decimate the number of matrixes but the functionality is there.
Title: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Andrew Broughton on March 16, 2014, 07:27:45 PM
Stereo matrices.  This is something that the old analog PM3500 had, its something that the Digico's have and it would be a real value add.
I wish console manufacturers would once and for all stop designing consoles as though they were still analogue when it comes to buses.
There should be Inputs and outputs.
No auxes, groups, matrices, or masters.
Every input and bus can be sent to any other bus pre or post anywhere.
It's even more ridiculous on consoles like the DiGiCo (and I think Avid) that you have to decide before you build a show file what your buses will be.
It's high time they stop thinking in analogue terms and allow maximum flexibility.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: kristianjohnsen on March 16, 2014, 08:22:07 PM
Stereo matrices as in I wish they had them and they should go on the the wish list.  I NEVER have enough matrices and wish that instead of turning matrices into mix busses as the new QL touts as a big feature that I could instead turn mixes into matrices.  I max out my matrix count 100 times more often than the mix count. Post fade mixes just don't do what I want more often than not.

Depending on what it is that you want to feed into your matrices, here's one workaround I have used:

Take the LR-master(for instance) out of the console, via SPDIF out would be typical.  Feed back into SPDIF in and patch that to a spare stereo channel.

Use unused mixes to distribute the contents of that channel to various physical outputs.

Obviously, you want to make sure you don't assign that channel directly to L/R...
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Justice C. Bigler on March 16, 2014, 10:38:13 PM
I wish console manufacturers would once and for all stop designing consoles as though they were still analogue when it comes to buses.
There should be Inputs and outputs.
No auxes, groups, matrices, or masters.
Every input and bus can be sent to any other bus pre or post anywhere.
It's even more ridiculous on consoles like the DiGiCo (and I think Avid) that you have to decide before you build a show file what your buses will be.
It's high time they stop thinking in analogue terms and allow maximum flexibility.


D-Mitri.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Mac Kerr on March 16, 2014, 10:53:35 PM

D-Mitri.

Can you change  the D-Mitri bus structure in the middle of rehearsals? I don't remember. Studer Vista is another large format console that you can fairly freely configure, but it is a little touch and go to rebuild after the fact. It can be done, but I don't do it.

Mac
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Chris Johnson [UK] on March 17, 2014, 06:16:50 AM
Studer Vista is another large format console that you can fairly freely configure, but it is a little touch and go to rebuild after the fact. It can be done, but I don't do it.

Mac

True.

That said though, I have mixed some gigs on a 5SR, and although it is a great sounding board with a ton of functionality, there have been many times when I have longed for a Vi6 while I'm trying to set something up in a hurry!

This ultimately is the tradeoff. I love Digicos, but I hate walking up to them cold without a show file 15 mins before a soundcheck, because the increased flexibility also means more configuration required to go.

The M7 is the opposite end of this scale. It is what it is, but you can go from power on to soundcheck in about 5 mins!
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Philip Roberts on March 17, 2014, 11:49:48 AM
My church just installed our second CL5. Lots of the things for V2 look really nice including DCA roll out. We are also looking forward to having the Dugan automixer built in.

While it's probably too late for V2 here's 5 things I'd like to see added:

- A button to copy the CL channel name from the Dante channel name. Ideally I'd also like a per channel option to update the CL channel name as the Dante channel is changed. I think the button should be on this screen.

- A way to toggle the Input/Output selection of the centralogic section by pressing the bank select keys. Perhaps a double press of the selected back to switch you to the "opposite" side. (ex. If Input is selected a single press of the top button brings up In 1-8. Double pressing the same button brings up DCA 1-8.) I'm not sure if a double press is the right option. I'm open to other ways to do this.

- Relocate the Custom fader assignment menu so it's not 3 layers deep. Perhaps have it directly linked from the Setup or Channel Job menu. (Yes I know you can bookmark it)

- When you go into the Custom Fader Assignment for a bank that's partly full the default starting position should be the next avaiable empty fader slot rather than the first fader slot.

- To be able to assign a UDK to select a specific meter pick point. (Pre GC, Pre Digital Gain, ....)

Any thoughts from the rest of the forum?
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Chris Hindle on March 17, 2014, 12:07:16 PM
Any thoughts from the rest of the forum?

I can't comment, I don't have a horse in this race.
But, from the picture, I thought you were in Australia.... :o
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Tim McCulloch on March 17, 2014, 12:13:07 PM
I can't comment, I don't have a horse in this race.
But, from the picture, I thought you were in Australia.... :o

Phillip mixes standing on his head.... it's all good.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Philip Roberts on March 17, 2014, 01:31:59 PM
Phillip mixes standing on his head.... it's all good.
Not any more, its more like Apple thinks I hold my phone upside down.

Philip
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Tim McCulloch on March 17, 2014, 01:36:13 PM
Not any more, its more like Apple thinks I hold my phone upside down.

Philip

Glad you're right-side up, Philip. Mix on!
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Rob Spence on March 17, 2014, 03:11:46 PM
I like the way the GLD does it's layers. Any input, output, bus master, send, return or DCA can be on any layer in any location, or not - I have a couple of DCAs I use that don't appear on the surface.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Andrew Broughton on March 17, 2014, 03:30:34 PM
Can you change  the D-Mitri bus structure in the middle of rehearsals? I don't remember. Studer Vista is another large format console that you can fairly freely configure, but it is a little touch and go to rebuild after the fact. It can be done, but I don't do it.

Mac
My point is why should you have to configure anything? Select your input or bus, select the bus you want it to go to, select the pick-off point and turn up the send. Maybe a button beside the send which turns the send on and and up to 0 for traditional "fixed/groups/matrix" use. Simple, completely flexible and no re-configuring.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Riley Casey on March 17, 2014, 04:11:56 PM
I'm perfectly happy with groups and auxes and matrices, they make excellent paradigms for thinking of signal path structure.  I'd just like console makers to realize that its no longer done with ribbon cables and build out resistors, its just software.  Lets treat it accordingly and let the user change the configurations to meet the needs of the moment.

Then there is this from the press release : "states Marc Lopez, Marketing Manager, Yamaha Commercial Audio Systems, Inc. “Future plans include built-in Dugan automatic mixing similar to the new QL Series".  First, does this mean the Dugan software is going to be a part of V2 firmware or still in the future plans?  More to the point is Yamaha really about to give away for free what they currently get more than two grand for?  That is so unYamaha-like that I gotta think there is a gotcha there somewhere.

I wish console manufacturers would once and for all stop designing consoles as though they were still analogue when it comes to buses.
There should be Inputs and outputs.
No auxes, groups, matrices, or masters.
Every input and bus can be sent to any other bus pre or post anywhere.
It's even more ridiculous on consoles like the DiGiCo (and I think Avid) that you have to decide before you build a show file what your buses will be.
It's high time they stop thinking in analogue terms and allow maximum flexibility.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Andrew Broughton on March 17, 2014, 04:34:47 PM
I'm perfectly happy with groups and auxes and matrices, they make excellent paradigms for thinking of signal path structure.
Unfortunately, this sort of thinking and no push to change this paradigm just helps support manufacturers building in limitations in their consoles. Real change for the better comes when people stop saying "well, that's just the way it's always been done." I see no reason to cling to the old "analogue-esq" except as a crutch for those that are easily confused.
See here (http://hereandnow.wbur.org/2014/03/14/spritz-speed-reading) as an example of what can be done when people throw away the "old ways" and think outside the box.

However, in thinking about this more, the console software could be set up with presets that build sends as though they are groups or auxes, but only as a preset or macro, so that you can change anything manually afterwards if you change your mind, but without any reconfiguring.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: kristianjohnsen on March 17, 2014, 06:50:42 PM
Then there is this from the press release : "states Marc Lopez, Marketing Manager, Yamaha Commercial Audio Systems, Inc. “Future plans include built-in Dugan automatic mixing similar to the new QL Series".  First, does this mean the Dugan software is going to be a part of V2 firmware or still in the future plans?  More to the point is Yamaha really about to give away for free what they currently get more than two grand for?  That is so unYamaha-like that I gotta think there is a gotcha there somewhere.

Perhaps they "gave it away" on QL to get more mid-level users to want the Dugan functionality, then they'll sell it as an upgrade to CL, etc, costing less than the card (plus you don't lose a card slot) - similar to the VCM effects upgrades to previous mixers.

The cards will still be usable in DMEs and DM2Ks, etc, for some time to come.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Tim Padrick on March 18, 2014, 02:31:25 AM
I'm perfectly happy with groups and auxes and matrices, they make excellent paradigms for thinking of signal path structure.  I'd just like console makers to realize that its no longer done with ribbon cables and build out resistors, its just software.

But alas, it isn't just software - at least according to the Midas folks who told us that their digital consoles cannot have the option of pre-eq/dynamics bus sends added via a firmware upgrade.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: kristianjohnsen on March 18, 2014, 04:13:56 AM
But alas, it isn't just software - at least according to the Midas folks who told us that their digital consoles cannot have the option of pre-eq/dynamics bus sends added via a firmware upgrade.

On the other hand, Digico allows you to sacifice mixes to get moe input channels, so...
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Mark McFarlane on March 20, 2014, 04:42:50 AM
I like the way the GLD does it's layers. Any input, output, bus master, send, return or DCA can be on any layer in any location, or not - I have a couple of DCAs I use that don't appear on the surface.

+1.  Now that I've had my GLD for a few months I can confidently say the ergonomics are awesome  Any fader anywhere, or hide it (like when a DCA is used for a mute group that has been assigned to a soft key).

Move faders around the console by swiping them on the touch screen,... I can change fader locations mid show based on what is really getting used, in a second, great for festivals... An intuitive way to assign channels to axes, busses,... 

After operating an 01V96 for a decade, and still needing a laptop to efficiently setup up routing, my laptop is no longer needed.


(EDIT: Retraction, operator error, the iPad app isn't as bad as I thought...).
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Chris Johnson [UK] on March 20, 2014, 07:39:43 AM
On the other hand, Digico allows you to sacifice mixes to get moe input channels, so...

You've inadvertently stumbled on one of the key differences between older DSP-style processing (as found on the Midas Pro series, pre-Neutron) and newer FPGA style processing. using pre-configured DSP chips is very cost effective, and so a lot of lower-end digital consoles have been made that way for years (pretty much every live console is lower-end as compared to the spectrum of consoles accross the market). The tradeoff here is that you configure the chips with functionality when you manufacture the boards. So you are fixing limits in place early on.

The FPGA (field programmable gate array) is an IC that is designed to be re-programmable by the designers after manufacture. This what allows companies like Digico who are using this technology to divvy up the available processing power however they like. The SD7 represents the limit of their current architecture by providing 256 full-processing paths (a path being a channel, either input or output, featuring their EQ, dynamics, etc...).

I believe the Yamaha's still use a slightly older-style architecture (I could be wrong), and even the new Neutron DSP is a hybrid product.

For example, when the CL came out, I spoke with some people at Yamaha and complained that there weren't 2 solo buses. This is a big deal for those of us dealing with big monitor rigs featuring both IEMs and wedges. They told me that it wasn't physically possible to just add another buss with their architecture, but they could potentiall look at a software revision where a pair of matrices could become a second solo buss...

Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Tommy Peel on March 20, 2014, 11:32:21 AM

+1.  Now that I've had my GLD for a few months I can confidently say the ergonomics are awesome (except for the iPad app which currently sucks).  Any fader anywhere, or hide it (like when a DCA is used for a mute group that has been assigned to a soft key).


Move faders around the console by swiping them on the touch screen,... I can change fader locations mid show based on what is really getting used, in a second, great for festivals... An intuitive way to assign channels to axes, busses,...  .

This is how all digital consoles should be..... IMO. Give me a group of faders with scribble strips and let me put whatever I want on each layer.

Sent from my Nexus 4 running OmniROM 4.4 KitKat using Tapatalk Pro

Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: kristianjohnsen on March 20, 2014, 12:02:45 PM
You've inadvertently stumbled on one of the key differences between older DSP-style processing (as found on the Midas Pro series, pre-Neutron) and newer FPGA style processing. using pre-configured DSP chips is very cost effective, and so a lot of lower-end digital consoles have been made that way for years (pretty much every live console is lower-end as compared to the spectrum of consoles accross the market). The tradeoff here is that you configure the chips with functionality when you manufacture the boards. So you are fixing limits in place early on.

The FPGA (field programmable gate array) is an IC that is designed to be re-programmable by the designers after manufacture. This what allows companies like Digico who are using this technology to divvy up the available processing power however they like. The SD7 represents the limit of their current architecture by providing 256 full-processing paths (a path being a channel, either input or output, featuring their EQ, dynamics, etc...).

I believe the Yamaha's still use a slightly older-style architecture (I could be wrong), and even the new Neutron DSP is a hybrid product.

For example, when the CL came out, I spoke with some people at Yamaha and complained that there weren't 2 solo buses. This is a big deal for those of us dealing with big monitor rigs featuring both IEMs and wedges. They told me that it wasn't physically possible to just add another buss with their architecture, but they could potentiall look at a software revision where a pair of matrices could become a second solo buss...

Thank you, that is most interesting!
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Scott Helmke on March 20, 2014, 12:03:02 PM
Perhaps they "gave it away" on QL to get more mid-level users to want the Dugan functionality, then they'll sell it as an upgrade to CL, etc, costing less than the card (plus you don't lose a card slot) - similar to the VCM effects upgrades to previous mixers.

My guess would be that automixing does come to CL V2, for free. Maybe not V2.0, our rep isn't sure about that yet either.

As soon as event planners starting asking for Dugan as well as a line array all the companies still sending an LS9 will have to go buy the MY-Dugan card. Meanwhile companies buying new for that market will start putting Dugan on the feature checklist. So it's  a win either way.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Philip Roberts on March 20, 2014, 12:09:28 PM
This is how all digital consoles should be..... IMO. Give me a group of faders with scribble strips and let me put whatever I want on each layer.
I see both sides of this. I've had significant time on a iLive T80 as well as the CL5 and M7CL.

One thing that's bit me several times on the iLive is that you can have channels, DCA's, group's, ... that are active but not on the surface which makes it very hard to find and fix mid program.

I think the CL series has a good implementation for this. There are fixed layers where every channel occurs so you can always get to any channel but they also several custom fader layer in each bank of faders so you can lay out how ever you like. I think the CL3 may actually have a bit better setup for Custom layers than the CL5. The reason I say this is the CL3 has 3 custom layers in the "A" bank vs only 2 for the CL5 which gives you more flexibility.

Philip
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Chris Johnson [UK] on March 20, 2014, 02:32:03 PM
Yeah, I know what you mean.

On Digicos, which I use a lot and also have a completely free console layout, My default is to assign all the inputs and outputs, in order, to the banks on layer A, and then setup my own stuff on the layer B banks.

This way I can have my custom layouts, but can also get to everything on the console in only a couple of button presses in a hurry if I need to!
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Samuel Rees on March 20, 2014, 03:23:15 PM

Yeah, I know what you mean.

On Digicos, which I use a lot and also have a completely free console layout, My default is to assign all the inputs and outputs, in order, to the banks on layer A, and then setup my own stuff on the layer B banks.

This way I can have my custom layouts, but can also get to everything on the console in only a couple of button presses in a hurry if I need to!

I'm wish the SD9 had a layer B. I don't user layer B much in the workflow even on sd8/10 because I'm SD9 a lot.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Tommy Peel on March 20, 2014, 04:43:01 PM
I see both sides of this. I've had significant time on a iLive T80 as well as the CL5 and M7CL.

One thing that's bit me several times on the iLive is that you can have channels, DCA's, group's, ... that are active but not on the surface which makes it very hard to find and fix mid program.

I think the CL series has a good implementation for this. There are fixed layers where every channel occurs so you can always get to any channel but they also several custom fader layer in each bank of faders so you can lay out how ever you like. I think the CL3 may actually have a bit better setup for Custom layers than the CL5. The reason I say this is the CL3 has 3 custom layers in the "A" bank vs only 2 for the CL5 which gives you more flexibility.

Philip

It does make good sense to have everything on some layer all the time so it can be found. Pretty much all of my digital time as been on an x32 and I've found myself wishing for a custom layer on it; I imagine it's even more helpful on higher channel count boards. I do over 90% of my mixing right now on various(small) analog mixers, but it's very interesting to read about these "high end" digital boards in hope of getting to use them someday.  :D
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Mark McFarlane on March 20, 2014, 05:05:26 PM
I see both sides of this. I've had significant time on a iLive T80 as well as the CL5 and M7CL.

One thing that's bit me several times on the iLive is that you can have channels, DCA's, group's, ... that are active but not on the surface which makes it very hard to find and fix mid program....

FWIW, On the GLD I have a bank of faders where I put the 'hidden stuff' like DCAs used only for mute groups, the 'hidden side' of ganged stereo channels,... just in case I need to get to them.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Ric Arnold on March 20, 2014, 08:05:04 PM
Another feature on the CLs I'd like to see is the ability to set a User Defined Key to recall ALL fader banks as custom pages/faders setup. (this may already exist; I'll hit the Yamaha rep up this afternoon when he's here to find out if I've overlooked it.)
In a roundabout way I may be able to do this using scenes but it would be messy, and not work if I'm using scenes during a musical.

an example:

Fader Bank 'Set 1' - (UDK list chooses from Sets, at least 4 would be great, but as many sets as are possible)
Set fader bank A to channels 1-16, set Fader bank B to channels 17-24, set fader bank C to channels 25-32

Fader Bank 'Set 2'
Set fader bank A to custom A1, set Fader bank B to channels 1-8, set fader bank C to Custom C6

etc.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Ivan Feder on March 21, 2014, 04:34:54 AM
Another feature on the CLs I'd like to see is the ability to set a User Defined Key to recall ALL fader banks as custom pages/faders setup. (this may already exist; I'll hit the Yamaha rep up this afternoon when he's here to find out if I've overlooked it.)
In a roundabout way I may be able to do this using scenes but it would be messy, and not work if I'm using scenes during a musical.

an example:

Fader Bank 'Set 1' - (UDK list chooses from Sets, at least 4 would be great, but as many sets as are possible)
Set fader bank A to channels 1-16, set Fader bank B to channels 17-24, set fader bank C to channels 25-32

Fader Bank 'Set 2'
Set fader bank A to custom A1, set Fader bank B to channels 1-8, set fader bank C to Custom C6

etc.
Hi Ric,
That was the first "wish" in this thread!
"Heard Yamaha is announcing a V2 for CL consoles in May. I would love to see a new UDK function that recalls fader combinations ( ie: channels 1 through 32 or 33 through 64 ) instead of having to push multiple custom keys."

« Last Edit: March 12, 2014, 08:21:50 am by Ivan Feder » Report to moderator     92.151.22.163
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Ric Arnold on March 21, 2014, 11:56:25 PM
Hi Ric,
That was the first "wish" in this thread!
"Heard Yamaha is announcing a V2 for CL consoles in May. I would love to see a new UDK function that recalls fader combinations ( ie: channels 1 through 32 or 33 through 64 ) instead of having to push multiple custom keys."

« Last Edit: March 12, 2014, 08:21:50 am by Ivan Feder » Report to moderator     92.151.22.163
Sorry Ivan, I mis-read your comment as something else.
well at least they now know it's a highly wanted feature  ;)
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Dave Wallingford on April 08, 2014, 04:54:05 PM
More matrices. Option to make all mixes and matrices into auxes, groups, or matrices. Direct outputs on stereo channels. More flexibility with scene recall - spreadsheet style like DigiCo would be great (musicals)! More intuitive Dante patching.
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Frederik Rosenkjær on April 08, 2014, 05:18:16 PM
More flexibility with scene recall - spreadsheet style like DigiCo would be great (musicals)!

What specifically are you missing with the current Scene Focus?
Title: Re: Yamaha CL V2 wish list
Post by: Ivan Feder on April 11, 2014, 08:41:33 AM
A "clear output patch" would be nice. Very tedious to do this manually.