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[kristianjohnsen]

-Communicational habits have changed.  We might as well face it.  Due to text messages and the price of calls going down phone communication is moving towards a more informal status.  The same with emails.  It used to be that if someone actually went to the trouble and expense of reaching you via phone or letter your really paid attention, whereas now it's moving along to a "I swung by your house just to see if you were in" kind of thing.  I't not that people are blowing you off to be rude, it's just that the general habits regarding returning calls and emails are starting to change.
Kristian

If you speak to someone face to face and they don't reply to you I would guess that you would feel slighted and could very well be considered to be rude. 

So how is it less rude when someone addresses you via phone or another message and you don't respond?

It's still common courtesy to reply.  If common courtesy is no longer common then we are all losers in the long run.

I'm with Hammer on this.

What I hate is when I'm talking to someone's face and they have to keep turning their attention to the phone that keeps on ringing, like in a store.  I also hate calling a store and not getting an answe because the people there are busy talking to someone's face. 

I was merely offering an explanation as to why the protocols of phone courtesy seem to have changed over just a few decades.  Remote realtime communication is still fairly modern, who's to say the protocols we have had until now are the correct ones, when we look back a 100 years from now?

I, too have felt Hammer's frustration, again, just offering an explanation as to why it's not a personal thing.  I'm still a little  surprised by customers who text me asking for quotes or availability and expect them returned right away via text message.  But I play along and get their business

[Tim McCulloch]

I, too have felt Hammer's frustration, again, just offering an explanation as to why it's not a personal thing.  I'm still a little  surprised by customers who text me asking for quotes or availability and expect them returned right away via text message.  But I play along and get their business

There is also a difference in the corporate culture regarding instant communication and it's nomenclature.  I fault RIM's Blackberry for it....

Blackberry Enterprise email is used in the same basic way that Yahoo Instant Messenger or A.I.M. (or SMS text) is used - to send a message that is answered as quickly as a phone call was answered in ages past.  However, today's protocol is to answer the Blackberry email before anything else.  I have seen a person receive an email, followed by another email from the same sender about 90 seconds later; neither were answered and in a couple more minutes her Blackberry received a VOICE calll... from the email sender, wanting to know why the original email hadn't been answered and why the 2nd email (about no reply to the first) was unacknowledged.  All this in under 5 minutes.

Perhaps I'm old-fashioned, but I prioritize communications this way:  voice calls first (immediate answering situation permitting); SMS text; email; instant messages from Yahoo, AIM, or social networking.

- Voice calls are either business or family emergencies.  If I'm in a situation where I can't answer, they go to voice mail and I check the message at the first reasonable opportunity (caller ID helps prioritize this).

- SMS texts are a mixed bag of business and personal, but they can wait if need be.

- Email, same as texting.  Tends to wait because many require research or additional writing before replying.

- Instant messages are almost all social.  If I'm working they can wait.

I expect others to have different priorities based on how they use their communications modes.  All I ask is a reply within 24 hours to any non-voice communication, and I try to reply in 24 hours or less to such things.

And really, this isn't about the amount of time involved or anything else.  It's the courtesy of responding to someone who thought enough of you, professionally, to consider recommendation and a display of professional gratitude to whomever is making the offer.

Perhaps courtesy and gratitude have change moreso than the communications media.

[Brad Gibson]

   Hello Brad,

   While I respect your enthusiasm and your professional outlook in regards to returning someone's call/contact.... I only recommend people that I have experienced either directly working with, or, had previously working for me.

    Where are you located? 

   Cheers,
   Hammer

Im in Savannah, Ga. 

I was making a point more than I was looking for work, but I am always hungry.  No matter how busy we are I always return calls.  Even if I am calling back to let the caller know i'm just to busy. 

There are several "audio guys" here in town.  Some of which I call often some I don't call at all.  The ones I don't call are the same ones that complain when I bring in guys from Atlanta to work my bigger shows. 

I have let them all know.  Its simple, don't complain, don't show up late, do your job, don't show up hung over, treat my gear like its yours, be a pro.  Some get it, some don't. 

Brad

[Charlie Zureki]

Im in Savannah, Ga. 

I was making a point more than I was looking for work, but I am always hungry.  No matter how busy we are I always return calls.  Even if I am calling back to let the caller know i'm just to busy. 

There are several "audio guys" here in town.  Some of which I call often some I don't call at all.  The ones I don't call are the same ones that complain when I bring in guys from Atlanta to work my bigger shows. 

I have let them all know.  Its simple, don't complain, don't show up late, do your job, don't show up hung over, treat my gear like its yours, be a pro.  Some get it, some don't. 

Brad

   Hello Brad,

   Then, you are a Professional!

   Next time I get to Savannah.... the dinner tab will be mine.

  Cheers,
  Hammer

[Jonathan Johnson]

Blackberry Enterprise email is used in the same basic way that Yahoo Instant Messenger or A.I.M. (or SMS text) is used - to send a message that is answered as quickly as a phone call was answered in ages past.  However, today's protocol is to answer the Blackberry email before anything else.  I have seen a person receive an email, followed by another email from the same sender about 90 seconds later; neither were answered and in a couple more minutes her Blackberry received a VOICE calll... from the email sender, wanting to know why the original email hadn't been answered and why the 2nd email (about no reply to the first) was unacknowledged.  All this in under 5 minutes.

As a network admin in my day job (I work for a firm that does IT for probably 200 businesses in my area), I have had to deal with this "email is instant messaging" mindset many times. The problem is that the de facto protocol for email is that a 48-hour delivery window is allowed.

This stems from before always-on, unlimited Internet access was considered a utility. Many companies had Internet email available, but they did not have broadband Internet access, and they were charged by the kilobyte (remember those? they were small) for dialup access. Their systems would dial up to their service provider every so often to check for email; some companies only did this once a day, in the evening when long-distance rates were lower. Since you couldn't be assured that your message would be received by the recipient's mail server in less than 24 hours, a 48 hour window was specified. If the message wasn't delivered at the end of 48 hours, you'd get an NDR (non-delivery receipt).

Flash forward to today. Business person sends out an email with time-sensitive information. 15 minutes later, they haven't received a response from the recipient, and they're calling me convinced that I've somehow screwed up their email system. There are a few possible scenarios:

• You mistyped the domain part of the email. If you try to send a message to some place that doesn't exist, your mail server will keep trying for 48 hours, on the off-chance that the mistyped domain suddenly appears on the Internet.
• Your mail server really is having a problem. I'll be more than happy to check it out, and fix it if it isn't working, but don't blame me when you lose out on that million dollar contract because you were depending on an "I'll get it there when I can sometime in the next day or two" system to make split-second decisions.
• Your IP address has been blacklisted because you plugged your spambot-infested personal laptop into the company's network. I'll do what I can to clean things up, but because many places cache the blacklist info, it can take a while before you'll get that message through. (This is why I usually block outbound port 25 on the firewall.)
• The recipient's mail server is having problems, or their spam filter is screwed up so tight email squeaks when it goes through. Much as I'd like to help you, there isn't a single thing I can do about it.

I think the 48-hour window is unreasonably long now that nearly every mail server has an always-on Internet connection, but most email server software still has it as the default setting. Four hours would be much more reasonable; most network problems that would delay a message are resolved in this time period. On the systems of my customers who insist on using email for time-sensitive work, I have turned down the timeout to a few hours. I gently explain to them that email is not suitable for time-sensitive communication, that once the email leaves their system it is completely out of my control, and some intermediate system may have a longer delay before sending an NDR. Most of them understand, but I still have to repeat it every so often.

* * *

I know this is a pro audio forum, not a networking forum. But since this thread is about communication, I wanted to get this off my chest. Bottom line is, know the limitations of the communication medium you choose.


P.S. -- That 48 hours? It's not truly 48 hours from when you send it that it lands in the recipient's inbox. It means that it could be 48 hours from when a server receives it until it passes it on to the next hop. In the old days, it could be possible for a message to take 4 or more days to reach the recipient, even if all the servers were set to 48 hours!

If you really need to know that the recipient got the message, send it with a delivery receipt. Most email programs allow you to do this, though many webmail programs might not. When the recipient reads the message, they will be given the option of returning a delivery receipt.

[boburtz]

Hammer.

First of all, I fully understand your frustration.  I have been in similar situations and have thought a great deal about this subject and, although frustrating, have come to the following conclusions to put my mind at ease:

-Communicational habits have changed.  We might as well face it.  Due to text messages and the price of calls going down phone communication is moving towards a more informal status.  The same with emails.  It used to be that if someone actually went to the trouble and expense of reaching you via phone or letter your really paid attention, whereas now it's moving along to a "I swung by your house just to see if you were in" kind of thing.  I't not that people are blowing you off to be rude, it's just that the general habits regarding returning calls and emails are starting to change.

-We are all more available.  If we didn't start to think differently about the "importance" of an incoming call, we'd all be on the phone all the time - including when we should have been sleeping or working (isn't that last one a whole 'nother rant about hired help?).

-Most human beings are selfish creatures:  We call when we ourselves need something.  That's the source of so many bad gig advances and last minute notifications about gig changes.  Most people don't place the call before it's important for them to do so.  Most people have very little consideration for when it would have been nice for the other end to receivce the call.  This means that many people start thinking differently about incoming calls and their real importance to them.  Even if I'm calling to offer a job - if one really analyzes it, I'm calling because I need someone to fill a slot I need filled.  I'm not REALLY calling to be nice and offer the "gift of work".



I like to think about the subject in the following manner:

If people are doing it to me, they're doing it to everybody else.  This means the same frustrations apply to everyone else, so it's a level playing field with regards to the competition.  It's like a new universal tax or something, we can moan and groan about it - but at the end of the day it needs to just be dealt with - and it's how well we deal with it that sets us apart from the competition.

I have fairly simple routines in place that very rarely allows a missed call or email to "slip through the cracks" and go unanswered.  This puts me in the "those two guys who called you back"-category.  Just because people are too lazy to implement the same simple call-back routines I have really easily outcompeted 41 out of 43 candidates. 
Being that the caller is basically calling because he/she needs to get a hold of someone (see above) - calling me is a positive experience as compared to 41 other people - clients notice this - and it's good for business. 
I suspect you are in the same category with me, meaning that the general lack of attentivenes to incoming phone requests in society is a great competitional advantage you have when the shoe is on the other foot and someone needs to get a hold of somelike you! 

Remember, the glass is always half-full

Best regards.

Kristian

There once was a day when the only form of long distance communication was a written letter. In those days, people not only took the time to write, but they had a thing called "penmanship" which was to take pride in ones own ability to print neatly, even impressively. I am agreeing with you that all things eventually change, and it's how we deal with it (one cannot control the social masses) that sets us apart. I will always offer more gravity to a person who has the respect to offer real communication versus the modern convenience communication that seems to be becoming the norm. It does make it easier to cherry pick dedicated help...

[Chris Carpenter]

Ill start out with saying, In this industry, I'm about as young as they get.

I would first like to address some of the ageist comments. We can all agree that there are young people out there who are unprofessional in their communication. However, I have had just as much trouble communicating with older clients and professionals as the younger ones. I would go so far as to say older people tend to be less professional to me because they fail to take me seriously. I won't go into detail on this one, but I find it ridiculous when clients twice my age act immature, especially about the dirty work (planning, negotiations, payment).

As for my system of communication, everything goes to my blackberry. Calls, emails, texts, sms, and social networking all arrive at the same place. I give each means of communication equal weight, prioritizing business. If I don't have a complete response for an inquiry immediately, I wont respond until I do. I'm not going to waste your time telling you I'll get back to you; Ill check my schedule, and let you know in an hour or so if I can do your gig.

[Bob Charest]

Ill start out with saying, In this industry, I'm about as young as they get.

I would first like to address some of the ageist comments. We can all agree that there are young people out there who are unprofessional in their communication. However, I have had just as much trouble communicating with older clients and professionals as the younger ones. I would go so far as to say older people tend to be less professional to me because they fail to take me seriously. I won't go into detail on this one, but I find it ridiculous when clients twice my age act immature, especially about the dirty work (planning, negotiations, payment).

As for my system of communication, everything goes to my blackberry. Calls, emails, texts, sms, and social networking all arrive at the same place. I give each means of communication equal weight, prioritizing business. If I don't have a complete response for an inquiry immediately, I wont respond until I do. I'm not going to waste your time telling you I'll get back to you; Ill check my schedule, and let you know in an hour or so if I can do your gig.

Agreed about age & professionalism. The one thing that comes with "time in grade" is experience, but we've all encountered situations where that experience doesn't seem to have been put to the best use 
I've found my BlackBerry very helpful as well. Clients and colleagues want to be replied to as soon as possible. When I get a communication, and I'm about to leave for the day on location, I reply informing that I got the email/SMS, whatever and telling then that I'll reply fully when I'm back in the office the next morning. I agree with Chris, that an open-ended "I'll get back to you" isn't ideal, and I've found that setting the expectation of when you'll reply and following through is the only way to go.

Best regards,
Bob Charest

[James Feenstra]

I *wish* people were calling me for tours...

I'm flooded with local work, but I'd rather be on the bus

That being said, I always return phone calls/emails even if I'm too busy, because in the event of me not being too busy I'd like to be able to call whoever has called me in the past to pick up some extra work

[Dave Bigelow]

Funny to read this thread, I just had to turn down a tour due to the fact that it would overlap another I had committed to. I did however at least call back and passed along contact info of a couple others that may be able to do it. Not really that hard to return calls or answer emails.

[ProSoundWeb Community]