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Author Topic: What's new in the world of radios?  (Read 2092 times)

Andrew Broughton

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What's new in the world of radios?
« on: August 20, 2018, 02:45:25 PM »

So, still pining for my DTR radios and wondering if anyone had heard of any manufacturer that's come up with a replacement.
Even though the features were some of the best I've found, I had to unload them due to a few show-stoppers:
1. Latency
2. Shoulder mic low volume
3. No good in high ambient noise environments


The range, features, programmability, battery life, size, durability, license-free functionality, etc. were the best, but it seems analog is still the only way to go for production radios.


Still keeping my eyes out for anything that doesn't have the show-stoppers, other than the usual suspects (e.g. not interested in renting CP200s).


Now, if someone would just make a 900mhz analog, user-programmable radio with the build quality of a Moto or Kenwood, I'd be all over it. Maybe it exists? That's why I'm throwing this post out there...
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-Andy

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Scott Holtzman

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Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2018, 10:19:21 PM »

So, still pining for my DTR radios and wondering if anyone had heard of any manufacturer that's come up with a replacement.
Even though the features were some of the best I've found, I had to unload them due to a few show-stoppers:
1. Latency
2. Shoulder mic low volume
3. No good in high ambient noise environments


The range, features, programmability, battery life, size, durability, license-free functionality, etc. were the best, but it seems analog is still the only way to go for production radios.


Still keeping my eyes out for anything that doesn't have the show-stoppers, other than the usual suspects (e.g. not interested in renting CP200s).


Now, if someone would just make a 900mhz analog, user-programmable radio with the build quality of a Moto or Kenwood, I'd be all over it. Maybe it exists? That's why I'm throwing this post out there...

Andrew,  A quick look on Henry Cohen's site didn't jog my memory.  He brought digital radios to the Republican Convention that used distributed base stations with Ethernet backhaul. They worked very well and the recovered audio held together in some fairly high BER situations.

I am sure Henry will chime in and bootstrap my highly deficient synapses.

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Scott AKA "Skyking" Holtzman

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augie propersi

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Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2018, 09:56:20 AM »

I been looking at Motorola VX-454 to replace my HT1250

Did Moto buy vertex?
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Henry Cohen

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Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2018, 06:52:31 PM »

So, still pining for my DTR radios and wondering if anyone had heard of any manufacturer that's come up with a replacement.
Even though the features were some of the best I've found, I had to unload them due to a few show-stoppers:
1. Latency
2. Shoulder mic low volume
3. No good in high ambient noise environments


The range, features, programmability, battery life, size, durability, license-free functionality, etc. were the best, but it seems analog is still the only way to go for production radios.


Still keeping my eyes out for anything that doesn't have the show-stoppers, other than the usual suspects (e.g. not interested in renting CP200s).


Now, if someone would just make a 900mhz analog, user-programmable radio with the build quality of a Moto or Kenwood, I'd be all over it. Maybe it exists? That's why I'm throwing this post out there...

First, FCC rules no longer permit analog operations in 902-928MHz, so you will not find analog radios in that band.

Second, when you say "shoulder mic volume is low" do you mean talking on the spkr-mic is low to other listeners, or the speaker volume for listening is too low? If you can discern the difference, I believe there is a mic gain adjustment buried in the utility menu, and in the PC software if you have. It may also be an issue of the quality of that particular make/model of speaker-mic (even if it is Motorola). Third party vendors may have better offerings (uses same connector as CP200).

Most of the major manufacturers still make analog only radios, as well as digital models that can operate in analog mode, but only in licensed LMR bands, so you'll need to obtain a license to operate lawfully. Also keep in mind an analog radio, or a digital radio operating in analog mode, will not provide the same range and battery life as digital operations, especially that of a frequency hopper.
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Henry Cohen

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Henry Cohen

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Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2018, 06:53:38 PM »

Andrew,  A quick look on Henry Cohen's site didn't jog my memory.  He brought digital radios to the Republican Convention that used distributed base stations with Ethernet backhaul. They worked very well and the recovered audio held together in some fairly high BER situations.

I am sure Henry will chime in and bootstrap my highly deficient synapses.

Hytera, specifically the RD982 repeater.

I should have your "deficient synapses".
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Henry Cohen

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Henry Cohen

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Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2018, 06:55:04 PM »

I been looking at Motorola VX-454 to replace my HT1250

Did Moto buy vertex?

Lock, stock and barrel. Several years ago.
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Henry Cohen

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Andrew Broughton

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Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2018, 09:02:05 PM »

Thanks, Henry.

First, FCC rules no longer permit analog operations in 902-928MHz, so you will not find analog radios in that band.
but the DTR FHSS digital radios are still allowed? Odd!

Quote
Second, when you say "shoulder mic volume is low" do you mean talking on the spkr-mic is low to other listeners, or the speaker volume for listening is too low? If you can discern the difference, I believe there is a mic gain adjustment buried in the utility menu, and in the PC software if you have. It may also be an issue of the quality of that particular make/model of speaker-mic (even if it is Motorola). Third party vendors may have better offerings (uses same connector as CP200).
It's the volume of the speaker in the speaker/mic that's too low. The volume of the speaker on the radio when used without the speaker/mic is hella loud, but for some reason the speaker on the shoulder mic is not. I purchased EVERY compatible Motorola shoulder mic they make, and many 3rd party ones and I can say pretty confidently it's not the speaker/mic, it's something in the radio. No amount of programming or hacking or anything could fix it, believe me I tried, short of wiring the internal speaker to the external jack.
Moot point though, since nobody will accept the latency of these things (over a second) in a production environment.
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-Andy

"Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle..."

http://www.checkcheckonetwo.com
Saving lives through Digital Audio, Programming and Electronics.

Henry Cohen

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Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2018, 09:29:29 PM »

but the DTR FHSS digital radios are still allowed? Odd!

Why is that odd?
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Henry Cohen

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Andrew Broughton

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Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #8 on: August 21, 2018, 09:45:07 PM »

Why is that odd?
I thought transmitting RF at a particular frequency, regardless of whether it's analog or digital would cause interference. Does that mean 900mhz cordless phones and DECT stuff are also not legal?
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-Andy

"Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle..."

http://www.checkcheckonetwo.com
Saving lives through Digital Audio, Programming and Electronics.

Henry Cohen

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Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2018, 09:57:41 PM »

I thought transmitting RF at a particular frequency, regardless of whether it's analog or digital would cause interference. Does that mean 900mhz cordless phones and DECT stuff are also not legal?

Carrier frequency and transmission scheme/modulation are separate and mutually exclusive factors. Virtually all digital products have a defined carrier frequency, whether wideband (hundreds of kHz to hundreds of MHz, or narrowband for only a defined [very short] period of time (FHSS), ultrabroadband the exception. The rules only require a digital transmission scheme, of which there are several types.
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Henry Cohen

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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: What's new in the world of radios?
« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2018, 09:57:41 PM »


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