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Author Topic: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system  (Read 2486 times)

Jean-Pierre Coetzee

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #30 on: June 17, 2018, 11:58:09 am »

Those pictures scare me man. Maybe get a rigger out there as well. I see some things there I wouldn't be happy with if it was my install.

I can imagine you wouldn't have too many issues with the actual sound and the speakers have been up there for a long time but it would be a good time to check all the rigging that nothing is worn up there and to take some of the stuff out that shouldn't be there.

I don't know much about those boxes but I don't think that the angle on those eye bolts are within spec.
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Simon_Barrett

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #31 on: June 17, 2018, 03:34:14 pm »

Do loler inspections have to happen in the US too?


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Ken Webster

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #32 on: June 28, 2018, 04:40:03 am »

When you do get up there Paul, maybe a good opportunity for some preventative maintenance.  Clean and condition all the cable terminations.  Possibly do the cabinet internals as well, anywhere subject to oxidation.  Being passive, your sound is very subject to connection impedance which only gets worse with time and who knows when there will be another opportunity.

PS. I have used a rolled up pair of winter socks to locate physical vibrations, just keep touching things till it stops.
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Tim Weaver

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #33 on: June 28, 2018, 04:37:41 pm »

I would definately take the JBL's down if you aren't using them. It looks like they don't have flyware and were jerry-rigged into place with unistrut.  If they do have flyware, I bet it wasn't made to be used upside down like that.

Anyways, they need to come down. If you need coverage in those areas, just get a 2" horn and a flare to point wherever they are covering. You'll have plenty of low and mids coming off the main hang, so just having a bit of (for example) 800-and-up will cover those spots nicely.



Maybe hiring a consultant to advise you on the difficiencies in the current rig would be prudent?
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Paul Reedy

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #34 on: July 06, 2018, 12:40:58 am »

Thanks for the advice Tim.  As it is now, we can't get to the cluster unless we use a cherry picker, the lift can't get under it.  I have suggested to bring them down, and I'll mention it again due to safety concerns. 

In the meantime, I've asked them to call the original company to come in and evaluate the system.
I took my DBX reverence mic connected to my XR12 mixer, and the response measured was flat.. don't remember the resolution it was set to.  I also walked around the room, and it measured 86db on the edges and 87.5 to 88 in the center, so coverage is within 2db across the center of the arc.

I would definately take the JBL's down if you aren't using them. It looks like they don't have flyware and were jerry-rigged into place with unistrut.  If they do have flyware, I bet it wasn't made to be used upside down like that.

Anyways, they need to come down. If you need coverage in those areas, just get a 2" horn and a flare to point wherever they are covering. You'll have plenty of low and mids coming off the main hang, so just having a bit of (for example) 800-and-up will cover those spots nicely.



Maybe hiring a consultant to advise you on the difficiencies in the current rig would be prudent?
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Paul Reedy

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #35 on: August 21, 2018, 08:53:27 am »

We had another company come in to evaluate.  He suggested altering the chairs in the auditorium and adding some front fills on the stage using a QSC PLD4.3 amp with DSP.

My only concern here, and one other company did the same thing.  Specing QSC amps in a rack full of Crown. 

My issue is not with quality of either brand, or even brand loyalty.
My issue is the fact that Crown amps pull in air from the front to the back, and QSC is opposite. 

It doesn't seem like good design... unless maybe put a shelf under the qsc that goes full length of the rack, but still.  Am i wrong for thinking this?  If not, how can people with years of experience miss this important detail?
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #36 on: August 21, 2018, 09:40:17 am »


Touchť and point well made. That would be a much better use of the money!


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I have to admit this was my first thought. I get it if the current PA is totally deficient but it doesn't sound like it is.
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Tim Weaver

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #37 on: August 21, 2018, 12:35:37 pm »

We had another company come in to evaluate.  He suggested altering the chairs in the auditorium and adding some front fills on the stage using a QSC PLD4.3 amp with DSP.

My only concern here, and one other company did the same thing.  Specing QSC amps in a rack full of Crown. 

My issue is not with quality of either brand, or even brand loyalty.
My issue is the fact that Crown amps pull in air from the front to the back, and QSC is opposite. 

It doesn't seem like good design... unless maybe put a shelf under the qsc that goes full length of the rack, but still.  Am i wrong for thinking this?  If not, how can people with years of experience miss this important detail?


You're not wrong, but it's often done. You likely aren't running the whole system hard enough to generate a bunch of heat anyway. Chances are it will be fine, BUT it's not "right".

Crown has some dsp amps that are reasonbly priced as well, although they are not 4 channel units. Frankly I would also question why they suggested the PLD4.3 for a Church Front Fill setup when the much cheaper PLD4.1 would be sufficient.
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Simon_Barrett

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #38 on: August 22, 2018, 04:35:21 pm »

Paul,

Looking at the photos of your current rig, do those speakers really have to be so high up?

Just a thought, but I canít see the whole auditorium so itís not possible to tell. But I personally wouldnít fly speakers right up as far as they could go, itís just not cricket.


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Dave Pluke

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Re: Large donation - Music leader wants new speaker system
« Reply #39 on: August 22, 2018, 09:06:54 pm »


My issue is the fact that Crown amps pull in air from the front to the back, and QSC is opposite. 

It doesn't seem like good design... unless maybe put a shelf under the qsc that goes full length of the rack, but still.  Am i wrong for thinking this?  If not, how can people with years of experience miss this important detail?

That is something I don't do personally, but have seen others do.

Are there back rails?  Can the QSC be mounted on those (air flowing the same direction)?

Otherwise, getting some physical separation and space between units would be a compromise.  Definitely not right atop each other.

Dave
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