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Author Topic: Dante Multitracking Issues  (Read 3025 times)

Derek Toews

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Dante Multitracking Issues
« on: March 30, 2018, 11:55:56 am »

I've tried troubleshooting this with Audinate multiple times but we haven't been able to figure out what's going on so any help would be greatly appreciated!

Iíve got a Cisco SG300 (Audinateís recommended switch) and I went through all the settings per the Yamaha manual so itís setup properly (Been over all kinds of other settings beyond Yamahaís manual with Audinate).

Running 2 Yamaha CL5ís, 2 RIOís, 3 ULXD units, X32 rack, and some computers with DVS. Everything is updated to latest Dante firmware, latest DVS software, etc.

- Basically the problem is that the computers on the network will get glitches of high latency (above 20ms) but itís only for a split second, and it only happens every once in a while (very random). And depending on how much data is being received by the computer depends on how much of a latency glitch there will be. (Only 5 multicast flows to a computer - it gets about 6-8 msec of latency; 20 multicast flows - 20+ msec of latency).

When multi tracking and it gets a latency ďglitch" - it causes the computer to lose sync (even though Dante doesnít show any sync errors or packet errors). When it loses sync, the multitrack also glitches pretty bad till it sync's up again (only a few seconds typically). Occasionally a computer will even act as if it was kicked off the Dante network (it will still receive flows from all the other computers on the network - but it stops receiving flows from Consoles / RIOís / ULXDs). DVS shows it's still working though and there's no errors anywhere.

I've swapped all ethernet cables to computers, RIOs, CL5's. Purchased another Cisco SG300 switch. Everything is on a redundant network and both switches are the same Cisco SG300-28.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
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Tim Weaver

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Re: Dante Multitracking Issues
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2018, 12:06:32 pm »

What else is on the neywork? Iím talking about non-dante stuff. Wireless APís, computers, other switches, fiber hops, etc.

We just went throught something similar and it was our new WAPís that were installed. They couldnít deal with the multicast traffic and basically shut down the network.
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Derek Toews

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Re: Dante Multitracking Issues
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2018, 12:56:44 pm »

Nothing else is on the network - its all a completely closed Dante network. Iíve tried hooking it into our main network on a separate VLan and Meraki switches but had the same issue.

What else is on the neywork? Iím talking about non-dante stuff. Wireless APís, computers, other switches, fiber hops, etc.

We just went throught something similar and it was our new WAPís that were installed. They couldnít deal with the multicast traffic and basically shut down the network.
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Tim Weaver

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Re: Dante Multitracking Issues
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2018, 01:25:33 pm »

In dante controller is there a device or two that are checked as ďpreferred clock masterĒ?

I know Dante is good about doing this itself, but I still want a console to be the clock master. If nothing else, I know the console has a pretty robist power supply and shouldnít be effected by power anomalies. 
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Lee Buckalew

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Re: Dante Multitracking Issues
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2018, 02:04:15 pm »

I've tried troubleshooting this with Audinate multiple times but we haven't been able to figure out what's going on so any help would be greatly appreciated!

Iíve got a Cisco SG300 (Audinateís recommended switch) and I went through all the settings per the Yamaha manual so itís setup properly (Been over all kinds of other settings beyond Yamahaís manual with Audinate).

Running 2 Yamaha CL5ís, 2 RIOís, 3 ULXD units, X32 rack, and some computers with DVS. Everything is updated to latest Dante firmware, latest DVS software, etc.

- Basically the problem is that the computers on the network will get glitches of high latency (above 20ms) but itís only for a split second, and it only happens every once in a while (very random). And depending on how much data is being received by the computer depends on how much of a latency glitch there will be. (Only 5 multicast flows to a computer - it gets about 6-8 msec of latency; 20 multicast flows - 20+ msec of latency).

When multi tracking and it gets a latency ďglitch" - it causes the computer to lose sync (even though Dante doesnít show any sync errors or packet errors). When it loses sync, the multitrack also glitches pretty bad till it sync's up again (only a few seconds typically). Occasionally a computer will even act as if it was kicked off the Dante network (it will still receive flows from all the other computers on the network - but it stops receiving flows from Consoles / RIOís / ULXDs). DVS shows it's still working though and there's no errors anywhere.

I've swapped all ethernet cables to computers, RIOs, CL5's. Purchased another Cisco SG300 switch. Everything is on a redundant network and both switches are the same Cisco SG300-28.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

I certainly can not be sure if this is your problem but I wanted to make people aware.

There were SG300's that required a Cisco update or mod of some type due to a problem that caused glitching with QLan from QSYS (the reason the SG300 was not approved by QSC).  This glitch did not go back to the beggining of Yamaha's recommendating the SG300 series but started to occur in some units just a few years ago.  Cisco was unable or unwilling to put out any information on a version/revision/lot number, etc., to help identify potential problem units but they did accept the problem units back and performed some type of update or service that corrected the problem.  This was done by Cisco on a unit by unit basis. 

I do not know if this glitch also affected Dante traffic.  That said, I have not had an SG300 that has exhibited this problem.

Lee
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David Sturzenbecher

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Re: Dante Multitracking Issues
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2018, 02:21:54 pm »

I certainly can not be sure if this is your problem but I wanted to make people aware.

There were SG300's that required a Cisco update or mod of some type due to a problem that caused glitching with QLan from QSYS (the reason the SG300 was not approved by QSC).  This glitch did not go back to the beggining of Yamaha's recommendating the SG300 series but started to occur in some units just a few years ago.  Cisco was unable or unwilling to put out any information on a version/revision/lot number, etc., to help identify potential problem units but they did accept the problem units back and performed some type of update or service that corrected the problem.  This was done by Cisco on a unit by unit basis. 

I do not know if this glitch also affected Dante traffic.  That said, I have not had an SG300 that has exhibited this problem.

Lee

The issues with the SG-300 and Q-lan were limited to the Rev B units, which occurred at temperature extremes.
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Lee Buckalew

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Re: Dante Multitracking Issues
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2018, 02:32:07 pm »

The issues with the SG-300 and Q-lan were limited to the Rev B units, which occurred at temperature extremes.

Thanks David!
I could not get that info out of folks at Cisco or QSC.

Lee
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David Sturzenbecher

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Re: Dante Multitracking Issues
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2018, 02:32:52 pm »

I've tried troubleshooting this with Audinate multiple times but we haven't been able to figure out what's going on so any help would be greatly appreciated!

Iíve got a Cisco SG300 (Audinateís recommended switch) and I went through all the settings per the Yamaha manual so itís setup properly (Been over all kinds of other settings beyond Yamahaís manual with Audinate).

Running 2 Yamaha CL5ís, 2 RIOís, 3 ULXD units, X32 rack, and some computers with DVS. Everything is updated to latest Dante firmware, latest DVS software, etc.

- Basically the problem is that the computers on the network will get glitches of high latency (above 20ms) but itís only for a split second, and it only happens every once in a while (very random). And depending on how much data is being received by the computer depends on how much of a latency glitch there will be. (Only 5 multicast flows to a computer - it gets about 6-8 msec of latency; 20 multicast flows - 20+ msec of latency).

When multi tracking and it gets a latency ďglitch" - it causes the computer to lose sync (even though Dante doesnít show any sync errors or packet errors). When it loses sync, the multitrack also glitches pretty bad till it sync's up again (only a few seconds typically). Occasionally a computer will even act as if it was kicked off the Dante network (it will still receive flows from all the other computers on the network - but it stops receiving flows from Consoles / RIOís / ULXDs). DVS shows it's still working though and there's no errors anywhere.

I've swapped all ethernet cables to computers, RIOs, CL5's. Purchased another Cisco SG300 switch. Everything is on a redundant network and both switches are the same Cisco SG300-28.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Have you tried a different computer?  Some computers just don't get along with DVS.  My x230's work great, about 75% of the time.  The other 25% of the time I need to reboot (after a fresh boot) just to get clear audio.   That said my mac mini has been flawless for years.

You didn't say what type of computer you are using...but there is always this...
Tune Windows PC for Best Audio Performance

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Robert Lofgren

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Re: Dante Multitracking Issues
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2018, 04:38:25 pm »

And have you tried to isolate the issue by removing devices one after eachother?

If dvs is on mac you need to check your network settings.
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Derek Toews

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Re: Dante Multitracking Issues
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2018, 09:49:33 pm »

That is one thing I havenít tried to do but I probably should and see if I come up with anything. To answer some of the other questions -
When I was troubleshooting with Audinate, they suggested putting one CL5 as preferred Master and Sync to External and set that CL5 to internal sync - not Dante. Hasnít helped.

And to answer David - Iíve tried multitracking on at least 5 different computers (Mac Mini, IMac, MacBook Pro - all fully upgraded new machines) and have the same issues on all of them. Which makes me think it canít be a computer thing.

What network settings (since all we use are Macs) are you referring to?

And have you tried to isolate the issue by removing devices one after eachother?

If dvs is on mac you need to check your network settings.
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