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Author Topic: How well would this work?  (Read 4057 times)

scottstephens

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How well would this work?
« on: March 16, 2018, 09:52:28 AM »

Hi Guys.

  I'm pretty sure this has come up before, but I couldn't find it. Maybe I didn't look in the correct place.

Anyway,  I went to a local church that was having a few problems which I was able to fix quickly and they posed a question.  Can they RELIABLY use a mireless mic made by Seenheiser ( 865 condenser)with a receiver made by Audio-Technica? (3000 series). I guess over the years of upgrading these are leftovers, they don't really know.

I turned them both on, set the frequencies to the same channel and it worked ok. I told them that it would probably just go through batteries more quickly and maybe not have the long distance stability but I would "ask the experts".

So, am I correct?   Thanks.

Scott
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Scott Helmke

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Re: How well would this work?
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2018, 10:10:02 AM »

Battery consumption shouldn't be affected by a different receiver.  How would the transmitter know?

Likely there are some differences in the companding, resulting in weird behavior with respect to dynamics. But hey, if it worked it worked and they're happier than they were.
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Keith Broughton

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Re: How well would this work?
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2018, 10:45:02 AM »

Hi Guys.

  I'm pretty sure this has come up before, but I couldn't find it. Maybe I didn't look in the correct place.

Anyway,  I went to a local church that was having a few problems which I was able to fix quickly and they posed a question.  Can they RELIABLY use a mireless mic made by Seenheiser ( 865 condenser)with a receiver made by Audio-Technica? (3000 series). I guess over the years of upgrading these are leftovers, they don't really know.

I turned them both on, set the frequencies to the same channel and it worked ok. I told them that it would probably just go through batteries more quickly and maybe not have the long distance stability but I would "ask the experts".

So, am I correct?   Thanks.

Scott
While it "worked" I would be hesitant to suggest it would work RELIABLY
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: How well would this work?
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2018, 11:55:17 AM »

Hi Guys.

  I'm pretty sure this has come up before, but I couldn't find it. Maybe I didn't look in the correct place.

Anyway,  I went to a local church that was having a few problems which I was able to fix quickly and they posed a question.  Can they RELIABLY use a mireless mic made by Seenheiser ( 865 condenser)with a receiver made by Audio-Technica? (3000 series). I guess over the years of upgrading these are leftovers, they don't really know.

I turned them both on, set the frequencies to the same channel and it worked ok. I told them that it would probably just go through batteries more quickly and maybe not have the long distance stability but I would "ask the experts".

So, am I correct?   Thanks.

Scott

It's about the audio and the (likely) different companding schemes.

RF is brand-agnostic; the waves don't care who made the antennas, transmitter or receiver... but the audio companding is another matter.

The quick answer is NO, don't do it.  But churches mistake being cheap with "good stewardship" so I wouldn't expect them to abandon this.
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Russell Ault

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Re: How well would this work?
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2018, 03:37:05 PM »

It's about the audio and the (likely) different companding schemes.

I've never tried mixing and matching companders, but I'd be curious to hear what it sounded like. My guess would have been that less aggressive companders could probably be tolerably mix-and-matched for spoken word, but the more aggressive ones might not produce usable results if mismatched. Not sure what the A-T is using, but the Sennheiser HDX always seemed fairly benign to me (at least as compared to HiDyn+, anyway).

Two questions for the OP: did you have to disable the pilot tone detection on the receiver to get it to work with that transmitter, and how does the combination sound?

-Russ
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scottstephens

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Re: How well would this work?
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2018, 11:36:24 AM »

Russ,

  I did not have to disable anything, but the result of mixing and matching of components makes the audio sound "VERY" Compressed.  Tim is correct in stating that using this combo for the church is "good stewardship."  I told them not to do it and put it in writing, but what do I know.

Scott
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Russell Ault

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Re: How well would this work?
« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2018, 01:30:55 PM »

I did not have to disable anything, but the result of mixing and matching of components makes the audio sound "VERY" Compressed.  Tim is correct in stating that using this combo for the church is "good stewardship."  I told them not to do it and put it in writing, but what do I know.

Huh, sounds like the two units use the same pilot tone. Interesting. The very compressed sound is no great surprise.

I guess in my mind, for spoken word and a cost-conscious client, there's probably nothing wrong with this setup, per se. (Heck, sometimes a lot of compression on a talking mic can be a useful thing, although obviously this one lacks any control.) Compression aside, it will probably work just as stably as a matched system (especially if the receiver is still able to use pilot tone squeltch), and if it serves the needs of the client, I just don't see the harm.

-Russ
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Karl Winkler

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Re: How well would this work?
« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2018, 04:48:55 PM »

I've never tried mixing and matching companders, but I'd be curious to hear what it sounded like. My guess would have been that less aggressive companders could probably be tolerably mix-and-matched for spoken word, but the more aggressive ones might not produce usable results if mismatched. Not sure what the A-T is using, but the Sennheiser HDX always seemed fairly benign to me (at least as compared to HiDyn+, anyway).

Two questions for the OP: did you have to disable the pilot tone detection on the receiver to get it to work with that transmitter, and how does the combination sound?

-Russ

Russ caught it before I did - yes, RF is RF, and it is true that many companders are fairly similar in their response, but this is the reason that all the different wireless manufacturer's products are not compatible with each other. Even different series from the same manufacturers are not compatible. Scott's description of the audio sounding compressed is very likely due to compander mismatch.

But with most modern wireless mic systems, there is also the pilot tone squelch. It appears from Scott's comments that it works, that in this case the two systems have the same pilot tone, but of course this is not the case with all wireless mic systems.
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: How well would this work?
« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2018, 04:48:55 PM »


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