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[Diogo Nunes Pereira]

It's not about more then 4 consoles controlling the same preamps, its about more then 4 consoles on the same network having preamp control period.

Exactly.

With this idea, FOH console could control ALL preamps from every Rio on the net as ID#1
Every STAGE console would ONLY control pres from ONE Rio - each. Meaning each would need an ID , lets say ID#2.

Again, if you can have multiple identical console IDs on the same network, and preamp control is not affected... cool.

That's what we're on the quest to figure out.

If any of you guys hapen to have 3 CL/QL consoles and 2 RIO units on the shop and want to give it shot, please go ahead. You might beat local Yamaha guys here in Spain to it tomorrow. I don't really have access to that gear right now as I'm in between gigs.

What Yamaha tech told us today was that assigning an ID to a console is actually a Fixed-IP assigment (under the hood) to the control portion of the console - the one that speaks Gain/HPF/Phantom to the Rio - not the Dante portion, wich still is anything you want: fixed, DHCP, link-local, whatever...)

So... multiple similar IDs might produce IP conflicts on the control portion of the net. So, if you're about to test this out, add Wireshark to the toolkit.

[brian maddox]

Turn console id off and use R-Remote for headamp control for mixer 5 on?

Given the parameters of the gig, this is totally what i would do.  I've used RIO boxes with non-Yamaha consoles many times [heresy i know].  The RIO Remote is actually quite intuitive and easy to use.  In this use case you're only gonna need to set HeadAmps once, and then everyone has plenty of digital trim to play with if they need it.  Easy Peasy...

I never patch anything inside the Yamaha Consoles anyway.  I find it clunky and confusing.  I always do all my patching Dante Controller.  The only reason i mount anything is so the little boxes on my screen actually have device names on them.   

I've put more than one CL/QL on a dante network with the same Device ID before.  I don't remember what happened exactly, but i do recall it was not pleasant....

[Diogo Nunes Pereira]

The RIO Remote is actually quite intuitive and easy to use.

Multiple similar IDs plan not working this is how we'll end up...

The only reason i mount anything is so the little boxes on my screen actually have device names on them.   

Better than a bunch of question marks for sure

I've put more than one CL/QL on a dante network with the same Device ID before.  I don't what happened exactly, but i do recall it was not pleasant....

My hope here is since all same ID consoles do not share Rio boxes among them it would work, but how do Yamaha manages control stuff underneath is yet to be understood

[Nathan Salt]

Having the same console ID would only conflict if they were trying to mount the same rio. Should work since you won't be. Don't know though, have not used more then 2 consoles on the same network myself. Would make patching in DC difficult as you wouldn't have a good naming convention.

[Milt Hathaway]

There shouldn't be no preamp limitations...

Every stage has it's Rio and control of it's own head amps. It's engineer takes care of the small-PA, monitors and stems-mix to FOH/elsewhere.

Every other stage is the same...

FOH receives all sub-mixes from all stages, plus has access to ALL headamps if needed.

I don't know why FOH needs headamp control. And if it really doesn't, then why make it one big network? I see 9 networks here: 8 independent stage networks and a main mix network. It would work like this:

• Each of the eight stage QL5 would need an added Dante MY card. This card would be on the main mix network. Yes, the console and the card can be connected to completely different isolated Dante networks.
• Each stage does their own mixing, and feeds stems (patched to that add-on MY card) for the main mix.
• The main mixer doesn't need an add-on MY card, as it is only on one Dante network (the "main mix). Through that network it receives stems from the stage consoles, and it can send those on to other stages via this same network.
• Of course the other stages can receive audio from that 'main mix' network, so stage-to-stage audio links are possible leaving the main mix operator to worry about other things.

Now, of course I can understand that there might be worries about the stage mixer operators ability to properly mix those stems. But even then there's not an apparent reason (to me) why the FOH mixer would need headamp control. What have I missed?

[David Sturzenbecher]

I don't know why FOH needs headamp control. And if it really doesn't, then why make it one big network? I see 9 networks here: 8 independent stage networks and a main mix network. It would work like this:

• Each of the eight stage QL5 would need an added Dante MY card. This card would be on the main mix network. Yes, the console and the card can be connected to completely different isolated Dante networks.
• Each stage does their own mixing, and feeds stems (patched to that add-on MY card) for the main mix.
• The main mixer doesn't need an add-on MY card, as it is only on one Dante network (the "main mix). Through that network it receives stems from the stage consoles, and it can send those on to other stages via this same network.
• Of course the other stages can receive audio from that 'main mix' network, so stage-to-stage audio links are possible leaving the main mix operator to worry about other things.

Now, of course I can understand that there might be worries about the stage mixer operators ability to properly mix those stems. But even then there's not an apparent reason (to me) why the FOH mixer would need headamp control. What have I missed?

Sounds a lot like post #6 no?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[David Sturzenbecher]

Would make patching in DC difficult as you wouldn't have a good naming convention.

Nathan,
You can rename things in Dante controller without messing up the Yamaha side.

[Milt Hathaway]

Sounds a lot like post #6 no?

Sure does. Sorry I missed that.

[Benjamin Krumholz]

The Dante Card in every console is a great idea.. Every console has control of its own RIO... (every console is ID1 and every rio is ID1)..

You obviously plan to get every one in the network pool.. You can put all the dante cards on the network rather than the Rios and the Console Dante..
You can isolate the FOH console dante to receive only from the cards and not the RIOs..

Then each mix site would have 16 x out to send to the Main FOH Console.. Since you said you had 8 stages and only 64 dante channels to play with at FOH.. Each site has 8 sends.. Create subgroups that are the same for each stage/ parts... THE FOH mixer can mix the 8 subs from each stage and the stage mixers have HA control of their own inputs.

The strange part to me is that you will have 8 PA systems fighting with each other. Yikes.. You could just put a mic on each pa system!!

[Oliver Ettlin "Gemini"]

Hi Everybody

Multiple ID's is possible.
Main FOH Stadium: ID #1
Local FOH Consoles: ID #2
Local MON Consoles: ID #3

Rios: ID's according to Stage.

In the Dante Controller you can Rename Devices. First label al the consoles like: (Y001= ID1)
Y001-ConsoleMainFOH
Y002-ConsoleLocalFOH1 (... to 8 )
Y003-ConsoleLocalMON1 (... to 8 )

Rios:
Y001-RioStage1
Y002-RioStage2
.....
Y008-RioStage8

then: Every Stage mounts his own Rio. MainFOH mounts all of them. (PS: You can mount up to 16 Rios, not 8 )
then: Somebody (and only one Person) opens the Dante Controller and does the patches. No other Engineer is allowed to open the Dante Controller.

It will work just fine. it will give you much more flexibility like stage 8 wants to hear clicktrack vom stage 1....
Everyconsole controls his own Rio. MainConsole can control all. After the soundcheck you can enable GainCompensation globally on all Rios.


Greets from switzerland

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