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[Debbie Dunkley]

Debbie I used V2 and switched to V3 a couple of years ago.  At the time I did not notice any "lag" problems.  But there are a lot of variables here.  I was, and still do use an iPad 2 and iPad 3 for these programs.  Sometimes with mix32 running and sometimes not.  So I might have been slow all along!


A lot of functionality has been added in V3 and you have to expect some program bloat along with that.  The EFX functions, if you start using those, add a lot of processor overhead.  I  typically have about 60 scenes in a project, almost always use sequences to run them, use a fair amount of efx.  With all that on those old beater iPads I don't feel I have excessive lag.  When I don't get instant response it is usually due to poor "touch" technique on my part. 



Updating IOS actually seemed to slow down my devices more than V3.  I do what I can to limit what the devices are doing.  For example they stay   in airplane mode, not connected to any internet, all notifications, location services, auto updates, etc. turned off.  Anything I can turn off or disable, I do.


I suppose your projects have not really changed between version so that would not cause the lag.  You are comparing apples to apples.  But if there was also an operating system update, that might be a factor.

Thanks Mike.

I am definitely leaning toward the fact that V3 simply requires a bit more processing speed - basically what you are saying here - and therefor is more dependent on device/processor used.
My old iPad is not as fast as my new retina or even my iPad mini and this was what I was using to run V3 at first. The difference between V2 and V3 in terms of lag is much more noticeable on that iPad than when I run the program from one of the other 2 tablets.

I used V3 at the weekend and it was fine. Band was using in house PA so I brought my lights and could concentrate on just those.
I had to remember to use my workarounds and I used my retina iPad (the one I usually use for sound) and there was no lag.

Thank you everyone for your help and support.

[Debbie Dunkley]

Over the weekend I finally downloaded the current iOS platform on my iPad mini. I had been avoiding doing this so I could use Luminair V2 on it till I had checked out V3 on my iPad retina. Laminair V3 will not work on older iOS platforms.
I set everything up and sadly I can still notice a difference in lag.
I literally went from V2 to V3 in the same device (iPad mini) rebooting the router in between ( I found if I didn't do that, it all got confused moving from one to the other).
I am able to still use the sequence side of Luminair V2 but now I can no longer program any scenes - which is because V2 does not function fully on current iOS platform.

There is quite a difference from one version to the other in my iPad mini also - even though I had hoped there wouldn't be so I am stuck with using my iPad retina for lights from now on - what a pain!.....
Need another iPad now ....AAAAAAAHHHHHH.
Although I said before there was no lag at the show, I should have said there is a subtle lag using my iPad retina on V3 compared to V2 BUT it is much harder to tell and I can live with it.

I wrote to Synthe AGAIN to tell them of my disappointment.
Seems they took my money and ran!

[Debbie Dunkley]

I finally had Ryan respond - he said my emails got missed because I was using an old case thread- even though he responded to my first email.
Anyway I opened a new conversation.
He said he wasn't seeing any noticeable lag and asked what devices and IOS platforms i was using etc. He said although V3 does use more resources, it should not create any lag.
I responded at the weekend  and also sent him a video clearly showing the difference in response time between the 2 versions. I haven't heard back.

My conclusion is that Version 3 is definitely more dependent on the processing speed of the device used than V2.
I borrowed an iPad Air from a friend and set up my ipad2, my iPad mini, the ipad Air and my iPad Pro.
I went from one to the other and the result was exactly as you would expect using the theory that Luminair V3 is FAR more dependent on device processing speed.
The iPad 2 and iPad mini both use A5 processors which although adequate to run Luminair V2 , simply don't have the capability to run V3 effectively.
Ipad Air uses A7 and was a bit better but there was still some lag and the Pro has A10X which had the best response time - not quite as fast as before on V2 but usable.

I did try V3 on my iPad Pro at the weekend and did OK. I didn't notice the lag too much. The master fader issue is still there but Ryan insists he can't see it. The other change regarding scenes in sequences  is something I have to get used to and change the way I access them - just getting out of one habit and into another.

I believe I have exhausted this and I have my conclusion.
It is somewhat frustrating to have paid $100 and - for my purposes - have a lesser product.
I think if I had not been using V2 for 3 - 1/2 years hundreds of times and been so used to its functioning capabilities, I would never have noticed the lag and been quite happy with version 3.

[Steve Garris]

I finally had Ryan respond - he said my emails got missed because I was using an old case thread- even though he responded to my first email.
Anyway I opened a new conversation.
He said he wasn't seeing any noticeable lag and asked what devices and IOS platforms i was using etc. He said although V3 does use more resources, it should not create any lag.
I responded at the weekend  and also sent him a video clearly showing the difference in response time between the 2 versions. I haven't heard back.

My conclusion is that Version 3 is definitely more dependent on the processing speed of the device used than V2.
I borrowed an iPad Air from a friend and set up my ipad2, my iPad mini, the ipad Air and my iPad Pro.
I went from one to the other and the result was exactly as you would expect using the theory that Luminair V3 is FAR more dependent on device processing speed.
The iPad 2 and iPad mini both use A5 processors which although adequate to run Luminair V2 , simply don't have the capability to run V3 effectively.
Ipad Air uses A7 and was a bit better but there was still some lag and the Pro has A10X which had the best response time - not quite as fast as before on V2 but usable.

I did try V3 on my iPad Pro at the weekend and did OK. I didn't notice the lag too much. The master fader issue is still there but Ryan insists he can't see it. The other change regarding scenes in sequences  is something I have to get used to and change the way I access them - just getting out of one habit and into another.

I believe I have exhausted this and I have my conclusion.
It is somewhat frustrating to have paid $100 and - for my purposes - have a lesser product.
I think if I had not been using V2 for 3 - 1/2 years hundreds of times and been so used to its functioning capabilities, I would never have noticed the lag and been quite happy with version 3.

Is there a way to roll back to Ver 2?

I have V3 and use an iPad mini. I have not yet set up any scenes so I can't speak to any lag times. I noticed a huge improvement with my Mackie DL mixer when I purchased a new iPad (gen 7), both in processing speed and wifi connection. At $330 they work really well.

[Debbie Dunkley]

Is there a way to roll back to Ver 2?

I have V3 and use an iPad mini. I have not yet set up any scenes so I can't speak to any lag times. I noticed a huge improvement with my Mackie DL mixer when I purchased a new iPad (gen 7), both in processing speed and wifi connection. At $330 they work really well.

I still have V2 on my 2 older iPads - so that isn't the issue Steve.  The issue is that I have upgraded the IOS platform now on both of them ( I did this before I knew of the lag problem) and V2 does not work properly on IOS9 and newer and I cannot wind back the IOS update.
I can actually use the sequencing page ( that is how I am able to compare V2 with V3 so easily) BUT I will never be able to program the scenes or add a fixture as moving from one page to the next causes it to crash - the result of not being compatible.
I am going to try the iPad Air at a show because my friend is selling it - he hardly ever used it.
So I have to decide between getting an iPad 2017 at $299 (uses A9 processor) and is a great deal and almost as fast as my iPad Pro OR purchasing the Air (A7 processor) from my friend which is a bit slower but hardly noticeable for presumably a steal....

[Mike Karseboom]

One other thing I just remembered that seemed to have a huge impact after upgrade to 3 on the older iPads - turn automatic backup OFF.  This causes random long delays when it decides to backup. 


I have stripped down iPad 2 and 3 with just 16Gig of memory.

Also I think I also had some problems with crashing that went away after turning this off.  The crashes were when I was adding fixtures, moving scenes around, etc.  I think it just did not have enough memory to keep track of the changes and make a backup in the background.


Here are  few other settings I use that might or might not impact your situation.  These are assuming you are dedicating your iPad to lights and sound.  Also, I am not an apple guy so some of these settings might be redundant or not effective, so take them for what they are worth.


ON   Prevent device sleep
ON   Always run in background
OFF  Auto update universe
OFF  iCloud
OFF  screensaver


Some iPad IOS settings that might be worth looking at:


Airplane mode    ON


WiFi    Tell it to forget all the networks you are not actively using, prevents random changes


Bluetooth OFF


Notifications ALL OFF


Do Not Disturb - 7:00AM to 7:00AM (continuous)


Software update OFF OFF OFF!


Location services OFF


iCloud  - undefine / delete, go away.  iCloud in particular can screw you. If you don't have internet access at a gig iOS might prevent you from even using Luminair all together.  Some sort of licensing check or ?  This has happened to me and i had to leave the venue and drive to coffee shop to to get on the internet long enough to turn iCloud back off.  I guess these days you could probably use a phone as a hotspot to do this.


iTune app Store - automatic downloads - all OFF


Mail - Fetch New Data OFF


Reminders - delete


Messages - disable (no iCloud)


In general turn off anything you can that looks like it might run in the background or do anything automatically.
 

[Debbie Dunkley]

One other thing I just remembered that seemed to have a huge impact after upgrade to 3 on the older iPads - turn automatic backup OFF.  This causes random long delays when it decides to backup. 


I have stripped down iPad 2 and 3 with just 16Gig of memory.

Also I think I also had some problems with crashing that went away after turning this off.  The crashes were when I was adding fixtures, moving scenes around, etc.  I think it just did not have enough memory to keep track of the changes and make a backup in the background.


Here are  few other settings I use that might or might not impact your situation.  These are assuming you are dedicating your iPad to lights and sound.  Also, I am not an apple guy so some of these settings might be redundant or not effective, so take them for what they are worth.


ON   Prevent device sleep
ON   Always run in background
OFF  Auto update universe
OFF  iCloud
OFF  screensaver


Some iPad IOS settings that might be worth looking at:


Airplane mode    ON


WiFi    Tell it to forget all the networks you are not actively using, prevents random changes


Bluetooth OFF


Notifications ALL OFF


Do Not Disturb - 7:00AM to 7:00AM (continuous)


Software update OFF OFF OFF!


Location services OFF


iCloud  - undefine / delete, go away.  iCloud in particular can screw you. If you don't have internet access at a gig iOS might prevent you from even using Luminair all together.  Some sort of licensing check or ?  This has happened to me and i had to leave the venue and drive to coffee shop to to get on the internet long enough to turn iCloud back off.  I guess these days you could probably use a phone as a hotspot to do this.


iTune app Store - automatic downloads - all OFF


Mail - Fetch New Data OFF


Reminders - delete


Messages - disable (no iCloud)


In general turn off anything you can that looks like it might run in the background or do anything automatically.

Thanks Mike - all good things to consider.

I have played with every setting to try to get better results.
I did compare V2 to V3 settings so I could compare response time fairly - apples to apples as it were (no pun intended).
In fact I downloaded V3 to a factory restored iPad Air (A7 processor) that I have since purchased from my friend.  It has nothing in it other than the usual pre-installed stuff and now Luminair.  There is still some lag but it is better than my old iPads - not quite as responsive as my pro- but good enough so I am using this for my lights and so far its working out OK.
I'll go through the settings again paying attention to your suggestions and see if it makes a difference.

[Debbie Dunkley]

Also - as I purchased my iPad 2 to use with my QU mixer and my iPad mini to use only with my lights, I have been careful NOT to load them up with unnecessary stuff so they are no where near capacity - I believe I kept the iPad 2 at less than 50% and iPad mini is even less than that.
However, now I have retired the ipad2 from remote mixing- iPad mini is my back up for shows,  I have been loading the iPad 2 with some fun stuff.
I am noticing it glitches quite a lot and is struggling a bit. Not always responsive to commands. Funny because it responded perfectly when used with the QU mixers before I replaced it with the PRO a few months ago.
It owes me nothing though and has been fantastic so I can't retire it completely.....it is worth about $50 resale now...

[Debbie Dunkley]

Mike ... I just set up some lights to check this.
Apart from a  couple of settings, my iPad mini was set up the same as yours. I made those few extra changes on the iPad and the Luminair settings and tried V2 compared to V3 again and no change in response time at all. I think it is what it is and the slower processor makes all the difference.
I think anyone who wasn't used to using V2 or doesn't require instant responses, wouldn't notice the lag but to me it is obvious.
No worries - the iPad air is sufficient so I'll just continue using that instead.

[ProSoundWeb Community]