ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: Completely Wireless System Tuning - Theory???  (Read 2854 times)

Casey Sharp

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 12
Completely Wireless System Tuning - Theory???
« on: January 16, 2018, 02:35:36 am »

Disclaimer
***I realize that what I am about to propose will sound absurd, but let me explain my situation.  I am currently working as a mix engineer with a band that does primarily international touring.  I very rarely (almost never) have access to a tuning rig, much less the time to set it up... and even if I did I don't typically have access to any of the system processing anyway. Despite this situation I would still like to grow in my tuning skills and understanding.***

So here is what is rattling through my brain.  Basically what I want is a Smaart rig on my iPad with no wires attached to the system.  I'd like to utilize a dual channel transfer function as well as view the coherence, impulse response, delay time, phase, etc... of whatever it is I'm measuring..... again, with no wires attached. 

I just described every audio guys dream... and like I said, I know it sounds absurd. But my question is have you actually put a lot of thought in how this can be accomplished? I believe with technology the way it is now days that it will someday be possible.  I've been thinking about it a lot lately and am wondering if there could be a jerry-rigged way about doing it.  In theory, I could create a internal loop of pink noise in an iPad and have that be a "reference" signal and then run a separate signal of pink noise through the PA and attach a measurement mic direct to the iPad (usb mic or something) and have the software compare the two.  Obviously the problem lies in having the same exact pink noise played through both signal paths.

I know the tools themselves exist, but can any of you think of a way to make this work?  Obviously there would be limitations, but that's why I'm here.  Is there a way to make apps like AudioTools or ioScope accomplish this?

I know this sounds crazy, but hey... innovation :)
Logged

Casey Sharp

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 12
Completely Wireless System Tuning - Theory???
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2018, 02:38:54 am »

Disclaimer
***I realize that what I am about to propose will sound absurd, but let me explain my situation.  I am currently working as a mix engineer with a band that does primarily international touring.  I very rarely (almost never) have access to a tuning rig, much less the time to set it up... and even if I did I don't typically have access to any of the system processing anyway. Despite this situation I would still like to grow in my tuning skills and understanding.***

So here is what is rattling through my brain.  Basically what I want is a Smaart rig on my iPad with no wires attached to the system.  I'd like to utilize a dual channel transfer function as well as view the coherence, impulse response, delay time, phase, etc... of whatever it is I'm measuring..... again, with no wires attached. 

I just described every audio guys dream... and like I said, I know it sounds absurd. But my question is have you actually put a lot of thought in how this can be accomplished? I believe with technology the way it is now days that it will someday be possible.  I've been thinking about it a lot lately and am wondering if there could be a jerry-rigged way about doing it.  In theory, I could create a internal loop of pink noise in an iPad and have that be a "reference" signal and then run a separate signal of pink noise through the PA and attach a measurement mic direct to the iPad (usb mic or something) and have the software compare the two.  Obviously the problem lies in having the same exact pink noise played through both signal paths.

I know the tools themselves exist, but can any of you think of a way to make this work?  Obviously there would be limitations, but that's why I'm here.  Is there a way to make apps like AudioTools or ioScope accomplish this?

I know this sounds crazy, but hey... innovation :)
Logged

Justice C. Bigler

  • SR Forums
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1949
  • Tulsa, Oklahoma
    • My homepage
Re: Completely Wireless System Tuning - Theory???
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2018, 03:06:30 am »

As far as I know, there is no way to get a wireless mic like the Lectrosonics unit into the iPad without first connecting to a USB/Lighting audio interface. There are a couple of iOS mics that attach directly to the iPad, but no dual channel version that I know of.

And forget about getting more than two traces. the iPad doesn't have enough CPU power for more than two.

You can get a two channel USB interface and use the lighting camera kit, or an audio interface specifically build for iOS connection and connect that to your iPad and use the dual chanel FFT version of the Smaart Tools by Studio Six. That's about as light eight a a measurement rig you can get.
Logged
Justice C. Bigler
www.justicebigler.com

Lyle Williams

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 1396
Re: Completely Wireless System Tuning - Theory???
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2018, 05:32:55 am »

Audiotools transfer function does this.

Line 6 wireless like XD-V55 or -V75 work for measurement.

Maybe you need to start planning for multichannel with proper Smaart - isn't large venue tuning sbout getting ok sound everywhere rather than awesome sound in one place?
Logged

David Sturzenbecher

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1408
    • Sturz Audio
Re: Completely Wireless System Tuning - Theory???
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2018, 06:32:33 am »

Or just VNC into a real computer and interface.... look ma! No wires!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Logged
CTS-D, CTS-I
AES Full Member

Geert Friedhof

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 386
Re: Completely Wireless System Tuning - Theory???
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2018, 06:53:17 am »

My guess is that if you show up at the gig with your measurement equipment, and start running test sounds through the system, the system engineer and/or promoter will not be amused. At that level one can/should trust the system engineer to do a proper job.

If you wanna play with smaart, bring your own soundsystem, and do it in your own time.

I once had a fool BE who wanted to run pink noise through the system at a festival with several thousand people... The system had been running for 2 days with no complaints, but he insisted on it, and really made a big scene about it. Needless to say he didn't get to use the Klark DN60...
« Last Edit: January 16, 2018, 07:00:37 am by Geert Friedhof »
Logged

Jean-Pierre Coetzee

  • Classic LAB
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 687
  • Gauteng, South Africa
Re: Completely Wireless System Tuning - Theory???
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2018, 06:57:45 am »

Buy an interface and any of the actual good wireless microphone units that is recommended for use in measurements.

Run Smaart during the play out music using a console feed as one input of the transfer function and the mic as another. You can probably use a wireless solution to have the console feed sent wirelessly and you just carry the mic and a laptop around with you while you move around the venue to save time.

There are solutions, an iPad is probably not one unless you are screen sharing to it.

The nature of transfer function is that you don't need to use pink noise as the input although it helps.
Logged
Audio Technician
Word & Life Church

"If you want "loud", then run a piece of sheet metal through a table saw------

If you want "watts"-then plug in a toaster"
- Ivan Beaver

Peter Morris

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1178
Re: Completely Wireless System Tuning - Theory???
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2018, 09:13:55 am »

Disclaimer
***I realize that what I am about to propose will sound absurd, but let me explain my situation.  I am currently working as a mix engineer with a band that does primarily international touring.  I very rarely (almost never) have access to a tuning rig, much less the time to set it up... and even if I did I don't typically have access to any of the system processing anyway. Despite this situation I would still like to grow in my tuning skills and understanding.***

So here is what is rattling through my brain.  Basically what I want is a Smaart rig on my iPad with no wires attached to the system.  I'd like to utilize a dual channel transfer function as well as view the coherence, impulse response, delay time, phase, etc... of whatever it is I'm measuring..... again, with no wires attached. 

I just described every audio guys dream... and like I said, I know it sounds absurd. But my question is have you actually put a lot of thought in how this can be accomplished? I believe with technology the way it is now days that it will someday be possible.  I've been thinking about it a lot lately and am wondering if there could be a jerry-rigged way about doing it.  In theory, I could create a internal loop of pink noise in an iPad and have that be a "reference" signal and then run a separate signal of pink noise through the PA and attach a measurement mic direct to the iPad (usb mic or something) and have the software compare the two. Obviously the problem lies in having the same exact pink noise played through both signal paths.

I know the tools themselves exist, but can any of you think of a way to make this work?  Obviously there would be limitations, but that's why I'm here.  Is there a way to make apps like AudioTools or ioScope accomplish this?

I know this sounds crazy, but hey... innovation :)


No ... if you do that the two inputs for the FFT will not be correlated, you will just have a single channel FFT or an RTA ... and that's easy to do on your iPad.


« Last Edit: January 16, 2018, 05:16:13 pm by Peter Morris »
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
 


Page created in 0.033 seconds with 16 queries.