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[Joe Nane]

Hey guys,

Looking for some help on an IEM setup as my bands are currently looking to move away from wedges. I'm a studio engineer, and I've been somewhat sheltered from most aspects of live sound so I've been doing lots of reading on this, and although I have the grasp of it, i'm still puzzled by parts.

Basically, we are a four piece band and we would like to feed two stereo mixes to the stage - the drummer will have his own mix, and the bass and two guitarists will share the same mix.

We are going with a wired system, and would like something we can place on our our pedal boards to accept the stereo signal from the desk, ideally with a monitor control and limiter. My friend can make us custom dual guitar / headphone extension cable, so I'm thinking of something (like a headphone amp?) we can place on our pedal boards and plug IEMs into, whilst running the guitar end into our pedal chain. This will get rid of cable clutter as it will essentially be like running one cable to (roughly) the same place

Questions

1. Does anyone know of a relatively hassle free stereo setup that could do what I'm after? Equip models would be great.

2. How would this be set up (ie - running the same mix to three people) I would like to keep stage equipment for this as minimal as possible.

3. I know how we can run an extremely easy mono system (with UE soundtaps) so is stereo worth all the extra hassle I assume it will bring?

It's worth bearing in mind that we're a touring band that will be relying on different engineers every night. Would setting up two stereo mixes be a pain for a lot of live engineers?

Cheers in advance
J

[Simon Lewis]

I think that if I were in your position, I'd consider getting one of the lower cost digital desks (e.g. X Air) some simple XLR splitters (so you can choose which inputs of the house stagebox to 'copy') and some personal monitor systems (like the P16 if using the X Air). OK - so there are better products out there, but the overall goal would be to have your own monitor system which stays constant, predictable and controllable, independent of the FOH engineer - who has never heard or mixed you before...

[David Simpson]

I second the thought of your own mixer and splitter for consistency. Relying on the house engineer de Jure each and every day will probably only be frustrating in the long run. Plus, you have to hope they have enough spare outputs and cabling to feed your exact set up. Too many variables to be considered consistent. There are many great products at good prices that make this easy.

I think sharing an IEM mix is setting yourself up for failure. An IEM mix is such a personal and subjective thing that agreeing on a final mix would be difficult for event the most flexible of performers. If you are going to invest that much money, another hardwired system would not add that much more to the cost.


The Behringer hardwired units are good, and a very good price.

Stereo mixes do offer a great deal more flexibility, and fine tuning. That being said, I would settle for 2 mono mixes over sharing a single stereo mix.

~Dave

[Dave Garoutte]

If you go the P16 route, you will be able to have individual stereo mixes

[Peter Kowalczyk]

My band recently made the jump to wired IEMs like you describe, and we love 'em.  We were already invested in the X32 rack system.  I bought a P16, but it is limited to 16 channels and requires different (Cat5) cabling; while the X32-Q app doesn't require additional hardware (assuming you've all got smartphones) and allows access to all 32 input channels.  Any of the current generation of tablet-controlled rack mixers would work great I'm sure.

We have P1 headphone preamps on our respective pedalboards, and I made some custom combo 1/4" instrument + headphone extension cables like you described (our sax player has an XLR version) - works great.  We bought some dual XLR snakes to connect the mixer's outputs to each P1.  We're a 5 piece band, and each have a stereo mix, so we use the 1/4" aux outs from the X32Rack  with adaptors for some mixes.  Stereo is a great benefit in IEM - panning 'everyone else' off to the sides helps each performer to focus on 'more me' without more volume.

While sharing mixes for your guitars and basses is certainly possible, it's simple to set up independent mixes for each performer using a system like this, and will avoid inevitable conflicts ("Your're too loud" - "No, YOU"RE too loud!").

If you're planning to tour with this rig, you'll want to package it with a mic splitter.  Several bands have come across my stages with this sort of system - their own X32rack + splitter in a single rack, pre-wired, with inputs and house tails labelled with their input list - it's pretty slick.  With a rig like this and your IEM mix saved, soundcheck should be a breeze!

[Mac Kerr]

1. Does anyone know of a relatively hassle free stereo setup that could do what I'm after? Equip models would be great.

Posse personal monitor seems to fit your bill. It lets you do a general mix and add your personal vocal and instrument into that for "more me".

2. How would this be set up (ie - running the same mix to three people) I would like to keep stage equipment for this as minimal as possible.

Each musician would set up his own, and you would split the signal 3 ways to the shared mix.

3. I know how we can run an extremely easy mono system (with UE soundtaps) so is stereo worth all the extra hassle I assume it will bring?

Stereo is not much more difficult since it's only 2 stereo mixes.

It's worth bearing in mind that we're a touring band that will be relying on different engineers every night. Would setting up two stereo mixes be a pain for a lot of live engineers?

If you give good guidance on what is in the mix it shouldn't be too much hassle. If it ever is, you go mono that night.

Mac

[John Koepke Jr.]

One of the bands I work with ALOT, has an XR18 in a rack with a CBI splitter snake.  A short tail feeds the XR18 and a 25' tail feeds the stage snake.  All the mics are plugged into the CBI splitter.

Behringer also makes the PowerPlay P1 which will do a stereo or mono mix into headphones.  The XR18 has 8 outputs so you could easily do 3 stereo mixes and Main L/R for a 4th stereo mix.  Everyone would use a mobile tablet or phone to set their monitor mixes.  Generally once it is setup, there is a little tweaking for each gig, but that's about it..

One issue with Splitter's (Y splitters or splitter snakes) is sometimes you will get hum, a ground loop, or whatever back into your mix.  I personally prefer a CBI Splitter snake with Transformer ISO's and ground lift switches on each channel.  But that add's considerable cost to the snake.

Later on if you ever decide to go Wireless IEM's, you could just mount the transmitters in the same rolling rack as the Splitter and XR18 rig.

[Callan Browne]

Hey Joe,
When you play, do you bring your own mixer? If so what model and are you open to replacing it with one of the suggestions mentioned here already?
Do you ever play in venues that have their own mixer - do you need to be able to connect into this?
Do you usually mic up everything? guitar amps, bass, drums? ... the crowd?

What are your current plans for the 'in ear' (transducer) part of IEM's - custom moulds, generic? any model in mind?

Also, are you sure you only need 2 stereo mixes?
I play guitar and sometimes use IEM's, but I would never want to share a mix with our other singing-guitarist.
if you are limited to only 4 sends, then perhaps a mono mix per person would be preferable - or at least an option to consider.

and last Q (for now) - do you play in this band? What do you play? For no other reason then to help me understand where you are coming from.

When I play with IEM's, both the drummer and I have a stereo mix and the others have their own wedge and individual mix. (so 2 stereo + 3 mono mixes in total, plus FOH)
We run backing tracks for a few songs, so really only the drummer and me need the IEM's, but I hope to get the others on board soon too - I've recommended them not go cheap though, so they are staying with wedges for the moment until they are ready.
I have an X32R in a road case with my IEM transmitter, the drummer has his own little mixer, which is basically just a headphone amp with an easy to grab volume control (and he is happy with).

good luck - ask heaps of questions here too.
IEM's done well are great in many ways, but done poorly they will scar the user for life.

[Terry Martin]

I use X32 Rack, 4 stereo Sennheiser stereo IEMs, CBI Ear Splitter and rack drawer in a 12 space rack.  We bring our own mic / cable package - all guitars run direct for consistency.   Sound check takes about half a song.    Monitor channel levels rarely change for us.  I'm the drummer and primary leader for Bombshell The Rock Show!   
https://www.facebook.com/BombshellRox
http://www.BombshellRox.com



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Michael Grimaila]

I use X32 Rack, 4 stereo Sennheiser stereo IEMs, CBI Ear Splitter and rack drawer in a 12 space rack.  We bring our own mic / cable package - all guitars run direct for consistency.   Sound check takes about half a song.    Monitor channel levels rarely change for us.  I'm the drummer and primary leader for Bombshell The Rock Show!   
https://www.facebook.com/BombshellRox
http://www.BombshellRox.com



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I second this approach. With mic splitters you can provide all mics to the FOH console for larger gigs.... or use the X32R main mix for smaller single rack solution (using powered speaker for FOH).

[ProSoundWeb Community]