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Author Topic: New system recommendations  (Read 959 times)

Zachary Jordan

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New system recommendations
« on: September 10, 2017, 09:16:48 pm »

I'm working with a small local church to install a new system.  It has a congregation of probably 15-20.  The sanctuary is probably 30'x40'.  Maybe a little smaller.  They have an existing system was installed about 30 years ago, consisting of 12 in ceiling speakers in the sanctuary, and 3 speakers in classrooms in the church.  It's of course an old 70v system. 

They are wanting to do update but do not want their speakers very intrusive.  Would you all suggest, keeping an in-ceiling speaker design and maybe just not replacing all 12?  Or two very small speakers either mounted at ceiling over podium (vaulted probably 12-15' at max), or two wall speakers on either side of stage.   
I know that they don't need a huge speaker because the church is so small.   Any recommendations?
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Mac Kerr

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« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2017, 09:18:56 pm »

Any recommendations?

Please go to your profile and change the "Name" field to your real first and last name as required by the posting rules displayed in the header at the top of the section, and in the Site Rules and Suggestions in the Forum Announcements section, and on the registration page when you registered.

Mac
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David Mau

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2017, 06:24:54 pm »

I'm working with a small local church to install a new system.  It has a congregation of probably 15-20.  The sanctuary is probably 30'x40'.  Maybe a little smaller.  They have an existing system was installed about 30 years ago, consisting of 12 in ceiling speakers in the sanctuary, and 3 speakers in classrooms in the church.  It's of course an old 70v system. 

They are wanting to do update but do not want their speakers very intrusive.  Would you all suggest, keeping an in-ceiling speaker design and maybe just not replacing all 12?  Or two very small speakers either mounted at ceiling over podium (vaulted probably 12-15' at max), or two wall speakers on either side of stage.   
I know that they don't need a huge speaker because the church is so small.   Any recommendations?


Shoot me a call man! 719-323-6100 x 201   my name is David
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Doug Fowler

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2017, 06:49:47 pm »


Shoot me a call man! 719-323-6100 x 201   my name is David

You managed to break the two main forum rules on your first post.
Read the rules, fix your display name.
No commerce allowed in the forums.

Thank you for your cooperation.
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Frank DeWitt

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2017, 06:52:01 pm »

What is the system not doing?   12 ceiling speakers on a 70 volt system may or may not be a bad thing.

Depending on there location, I would want to add delay. 
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g'bye, Dick Rees

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2017, 07:20:36 pm »

Thirty years with likely no maintenance.  The first thing to do is simply test everything, find any faults, clean all the connections and bring what is likely to be a serviceable system back to specs.  Only after that need any changes or additions be considered.

In such situations, a little spit and polish can work wonders.
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Zachary Jordan

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2017, 09:32:01 pm »

Thirty years with likely no maintenance.  The first thing to do is simply test everything, find any faults, clean all the connections and bring what is likely to be a serviceable system back to specs.  Only after that need any changes or additions be considered.

In such situations, a little spit and polish can work wonders.

Everything appears to be working fine.  The sound is not the greatest, but I don't expect much out of it.  What got them started wanting to upgrade is to have something they can record audio and play cd's or something from their phone if they wanted to.  The current amp/mixer would of course not allow this. 
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Jean-Pierre Coetzee

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2017, 11:13:59 am »

Everything appears to be working fine.  The sound is not the greatest, but I don't expect much out of it.  What got them started wanting to upgrade is to have something they can record audio and play cd's or something from their phone if they wanted to.  The current amp/mixer would of course not allow this. 

Quote to replace the mixer and leave it at that, a bluetooth box could solve the play audio from a phone problem and a CD player could solve the CDs problem. There are also a large number of ways to record audio.

If the actual speakers are meeting current needs and their only problem is that the console isn't cutting it then quote them to replace the console, depending on their budget there are a lot of options.
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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2017, 02:04:03 pm »

Everything appears to be working fine.  The sound is not the greatest...

If the sound is, as you say, "not the greatest", then it APPEARS that everything is not "working fine".  Spending some time ascertaining the condition of the various components, cleaning and testing connections costs only time.  Spendinding money based on unsubstantiated guesswork is a waste of both time AND money.

Make a list of all components with brand and model #, then post here.  You WILL receive assistance from experienced professionals as well as others who have gone through the process before.  Knowing what and how to test is fairly standard, takes little (but necessary) time and can usually be done with readily available equipment most home owners possess...or should possess.

If you can furnish all requested info, you can be shepherded through the process easily enough.  You might even post pictures.  Yes, it will take time to go step by step, but in the end there should be no back-tracking and none of the time wasted.

Best of luck.
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Zachary Jordan

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2017, 09:37:16 pm »

Their current mixer/amp is a Altec/Lansing 1715B.  Their speakers are Dukane in ceiling speakers.  12 in the sanctuary, and 3 in other rooms.  There is one speaker connection to the amp. 

Here are some pics: https://photos.app.goo.gl/S1obUFG1staoTYPz2
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g'bye, Dick Rees

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2017, 10:15:12 pm »

Their current mixer/amp is a Altec/Lansing 1715B.  Their speakers are Dukane in ceiling speakers.  12 in the sanctuary, and 3 in other rooms.  There is one speaker connection to the amp. 

Here are some pics: https://photos.app.goo.gl/S1obUFG1staoTYPz2

Thanks for the info.  Pictures wouldn't work for me.  A model number for the Dukanes would help.  It would also help to know your location so any Forum members in your area can chime in with resources/connections. 

I think the first thing to do would be to have the Altec evaluated.  Are you aware of any amplifier technicians in your atea?  A quick check-up shouldn't take more than an hour/hour and a half of bench time.  The unit actually is capable of taking the inputs you stated.  Input modules are still available on the open market.  I'm out of spares for that model though, but I'll dig around and see if anything got overlooked.

If rehab of the current system is not preferred it would be good to know the congregations requirements for todays audio vs those of the era when the install was done.  Is this primarily speech with a bit of gentle musical program or is it desirable to have more advanced audio projection for worship music and media connections for recording, broadcast and such?


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Zachary Jordan

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2017, 07:03:28 am »

That's odd that the pictures didn't work for you.  They had lost the paperwork for the speakers, so I'm going to have to take one out to see what model it is. 
There isn't anyone around here close that works with amps to take a look.  I've attended church there a couple of times to listen to a service and the audio sounded almost like it was clipping, but not very loud.  There was no music  played through it because of the lack of ability. 

Their requirements today for their sound system would be to record the service to digital media (right now they are recording with a phone left sitting on the podium), and play cds and bluetooth.  From time to time they may have a guitar or two plug into the system.  They have a piano, but it isn't mic'd. 
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Joel Mevis

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Re: New system recommendations
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2017, 08:08:54 am »

That's odd that the pictures didn't work for you.  They had lost the paperwork for the speakers, so I'm going to have to take one out to see what model it is. 
There isn't anyone around here close that works with amps to take a look.  I've attended church there a couple of times to listen to a service and the audio sounded almost like it was clipping, but not very loud.  There was no music  played through it because of the lack of ability. 

Their requirements today for their sound system would be to record the service to digital media (right now they are recording with a phone left sitting on the podium), and play cds and bluetooth.  From time to time they may have a guitar or two plug into the system.  They have a piano, but it isn't mic'd.

Pics worked for me. .. I have been in the low voltage world for 10 years, these look more like a paging system and speakers I would install in smaller department stores. Most of the time they can not get very loud with out distorting.

We use to have similar speakers in our hallways at church. Since the could not produce any bass with out distorting and clipping we an old analog graphic EQ where we removed everything under 250-300hz they worked much better that way.

What about a JBL EON ONE system. Single tower, and small sub, built in mixer.  They actually sound pretty good. 
« Last Edit: September 13, 2017, 08:11:17 am by Joel Mevis »
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