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Author Topic: Please recommend portable active FOH speakers for - Live Band and DJ events  (Read 11108 times)

olakunle odebode

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EDIT: Further to contributions on this thread I have revised my search and will be aiming for a set of active speakers, instead of passive ones., my primary reconsideration is weight and simplicity. In my experience, the wonderful passive systems I have heard were either installs or touring grade kit - usually very heavy and or large, so I have had to concede that for portability, passive speakers are no longer an option for me.

I'd like to put together a portable PA system which prioritises sound quality over weight, to support a small live band, which could also be used for DJ/speech based deployments at events such as weddings or corporate events.

There are so many options out there, and it is difficult to audition all of them, though I will ensure I personally audition the top 2 or 3 contenders, before any investment is made.

From those who have heard/or used the speakers they recommend, in response to this request, please also describe a bit about your experience with your recommended options. That would be superb.

Max Budget: $1,500.00(approx £1,200.00) , for the FOH Passive speakers (subs and tops), negotiable upwards if discernible quality justifies the extra expense.

Type of music: R&B, Pop, CCM(Christian contemporary music), Jazz, Acoustic, small choir.

Typical Band line up: 2 or 3 digital pianos/synthesizers(or sound modules), 2 guitars, bass, drums, 4 vocalists. I'd like the guitar amps and bass amps miked and amplified via the PA, and their volume on stage turned down significantly (very likely tilted towards the guitarists ears and placed in close proximity to their ears - raised on stands - rather than pointing towards the audience), all other members of the band/speakers will hear themselves via stage monitors/some placed on stands.

Likely venue sizes : Community Halls, Churches, all indoors - seated - 200 max, dance area for DJ events - 80 people on the dance floor max.

Preference for passive : I'd like to buy once, and buy what sounds the most transparent. My unscientific - i.e untested, thinks that passive speakers will give me a certain flexibility to "tune" the system, with greater control, rather than having to add my own complementary "tuning" to the inevitable DSP that accompanies most active speakers today. I expect to take advantage of bi-amped passive speakers in the tops, and defining my own "speaker management" solution between the mixer and the amps. Some of the best speakers I have personally heard close up or mixed on, have all been passive (JBL 3 way + subwoofer - JR115's, Martin Audio O-Line mini line array + subs, D&B Audiotechnik line arrays + subs), so on this preference, I'm open to either option - powered or unpowered.

Considerations: Clarity/Minimal distortion, in my experience, typically from systems with full range speakers (as many speakers as possible, sharing the workload) across the audio spectrum, have provided the most open, most natural, least feedback, easiest to mix sound, with far less effort on my part to "struggle" with the speaker anomalies and room, to nail the sound I want from each instrument/voice. I accept that while small speakers can sound good, I'd prefer larger speakers that sound better, if this reduces the cost. In order of priority, my criteria is audio quality 1st , then lower cost, ahead of size/portability.

Exclusions:

I am not considering the columnar "stick" line arrays, made up of small speakers, like the RCF Evox/Fohnn Linear, HK Elements, Bose L1/F1. So it's likely to be either really good tops that can do full range audio, or tops + subs. I'd prefer more rigid less resonant wood cabinets over synthetic moulded enclosures.

While I have a fair idea of the options available in an active speaker configuration, I'd like to explore any quality or cost advantages of using passive speakers, especially where I can "tune" via my own choice of DSP options, before audio is amplified in external amps.

I'm in the United Kingdom, so certain North American origin brands like Community and Yorkville are out of my reach.

Thanks
« Last Edit: August 15, 2017, 08:08:45 AM by olakunle odebode »
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Jonathan Goodall

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Can't really comment too much on different models but with $1500 (~$1950nzd) you'd be lucky to buy one new decent sub here, let alone 2 + tops.
Do you already have power amps and a crossover/DSP?
« Last Edit: August 15, 2017, 06:15:36 AM by Jonathan Goodall »
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Chris Grimshaw

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Where abouts in the UK are you?
I'm in Sheffield.

£1200 isn't going to get you much if you want four cabinets. Audio quality will be way down, and there won't be much you can do in the way of DSP to "fix" them - they're pretty cheap drivers in poorly-designed cabinets.

If you don't have amplifiers already, seriously consider active speakers. The engineers at JBL/Yamaha/wherever have a lot of equipment and expertise, and have also spent a long time blowing up speakers to find their limits, and adjusting the DSP accordingly. If you're really finding them not to your taste, analogue graphic EQs can be had very cheap these days.


You might get lucky on the usual auction site by searching for complete systems - they often sell cheaper than all the parts would seperately. Remember to check to make sure it all works beforehand. Check for dust on the amp fans, and also on the speaker grilles - if they've been pushed hard, you'll usually find a circle of dust where the bass ports are. If they've been pushed really hard, there'll also be a dust circle over the driver.

What I'd probably do in your situation is buy the best pair of tops you can get, and rent subs. Factor the rentals into your pricing. Buy cheap, buy twice.

Chris
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Andrew Bishop

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Dear olakunle
I think a pair of 12" and a pair of 15" subwoofers would be perfect. But 2 x 15" on 2 x 18" might serve you better for larger audiences.
People are loving the iNuke amps from Behringer. I am getting alot of positive feedback on these.
Give me a call and I will explain more.
I am in Ripon.
Andrew
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olakunle odebode

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Can't really comment too much on different models but with $1500 (~$1950nzd) you'd be lucky to buy one new decent sub here, let alone 2 + tops.
Do you already have power amps and a crossover/DSP?

Thanks Jonathan,

If I may clarify, I have looked at active speakers, and typically these would be my 1st choice. The ideal active speakers at the top of the "consumer" range, which I would want - tops and subs, such as the JBL SRX812(or 815) and matching 18 inch subs, are clearly beyond my budget.

Of course we can all dream of owning Meyer, Martin Audio, D&B and the like, which are even further beyond my budget, and I have had these wonderful wishes too!

So it got me thinking, what if I took all the current functionality of active speakers and created something similar from separate components, the advantage being, I could upgrade certain aspects of the total solution, in the future without swapping out all of my investment. With active speakers its a total change, whenever you swap out speakers.

My short research led me to the iNuke amps (which someone else has also mentioned on this thread) from Behringer, which also have in-built digital speaker processing, in a lightweight device, and all I needed to complement these, would be a set of passive speakers. If I continue down the passive speaker path, these would be my choice of amp + speaker processing.

I have no conclusions at this time, but we now seem to live in a wonderful world where, speaker processing can be done digitally(i.e to a high standard), in the digital mixer, and/or externally in a combined amp + processor, and/or in the active speaker. So many choices. As I will most likely be acquiring a digital mixer anyway, I wanted to explore any possible cost savings and quality gains from processing and amping outside the speaker cabinet.
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Jean-Pierre Coetzee

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Honestly the reason you heard a good sounding passive box is either it has processing that the manufacturer dictates(the Martin / D&B boxes) or possibly a very good operator. If you are neither having all the processing in the world will not help you.

Also to setup a passive system as well as a manufacturer could setup an active system/OEM amp and speaker combo would require software and knowledge that is quite far out of your price point.

Look to get a semi-decent powered box, IMHO buying a collection of components won't cost much less and any additional cost you do incur going active would give you significantly better sound quality/reliability.
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David Winners

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My suggestion for a very budget minded rig is a pair of Turbosound iQ10 over iQ15b subs. You wouldn't have to stretch the budget much if you shop wisely. If / when you move to a digital board, they are in the Behringer ultranet universe.

I use iQ10 for wedges, on sticks for acoustic stuff, and FOH over a sub for small venues. They sound better than anything else in this price range IMO.

They are plastic boxes, but you're not going to find birch cabinets in your price range new.

Up your budget a bit and you can get into DSR112, which is a forum favorite, best bang for your buck top box that punches way above its price. It is a wood box. A forum search will provide opinions from people with far more experience than myself.

Good luck
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olakunle odebode

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Where abouts in the UK are you?
I'm in Sheffield.

£1200 isn't going to get you much if you want four cabinets. Audio quality will be way down, and there won't be much you can do in the way of DSP to "fix" them - they're pretty cheap drivers in poorly-designed cabinets.

If you don't have amplifiers already, seriously consider active speakers. The engineers at JBL/Yamaha/wherever have a lot of equipment and expertise, and have also spent a long time blowing up speakers to find their limits, and adjusting the DSP accordingly. If you're really finding them not to your taste, analogue graphic EQs can be had very cheap these days.


You might get lucky on the usual auction site by searching for complete systems - they often sell cheaper than all the parts would seperately. Remember to check to make sure it all works beforehand. Check for dust on the amp fans, and also on the speaker grilles - if they've been pushed hard, you'll usually find a circle of dust where the bass ports are. If they've been pushed really hard, there'll also be a dust circle over the driver.

What I'd probably do in your situation is buy the best pair of tops you can get, and rent subs. Factor the rentals into your pricing. Buy cheap, buy twice.

Chris

Thanks Chris, so kind of you to respond. I'm in Berkshire, near Reading.

All points you have made are valid.

What led me to post here was I could not easily find good references online, in my search, for high quality passive speakers within my budget, so best that I ask others also. Kind of like manufacturers have made these extinct with the advent of active speakers.

Your suggestion to buy the best tops I can afford (typically as I'll most likely use these more often) and rent subs, is one I never thought of.

In my earlier response to Jonathan (previous post), I've explained some of my thinking of why I have thought it good to also examine the passive speaker option.

You do have a very valid point, lots of good choices have been made by active speaker designers, and I will always have the option to tailor the speaker sound, on the speaker itself - which more of them include nowadays, or externally via eq.

More on your points, going back to 1st principles, drivers, horns, and cabinets are where most of the quality(or opportunity to lose quality - i.e distortion) lie, before we can artificially improve this further through DSP(in or before the speaker) and via all manner of speaker processing in the amps.

My decision to look at the passive option, especially now that relatively inexpensive but powerful Class D amps like the iNuke DSP include speaker processing, is born out of nostalgia - my best listening experiences, in small venues, including those where I was the mixing engineer, have been through passive speakers.

With ample use of graphic EQ, I have mixed ok with Mackie SRM 350's and 450's and got a pretty good result, the 450's version 2 IIRC were loud enough and clear enough for most of what I would like to start of with, but I would not put loud drums and bass through these without adding subs. At their loudest, these distort, but I really do not need to have them that loud.

I may be overthinking this. In my head I'm imagining all the layers of processing and delay/latency through multiple A/D & D/A converters, especially when you are using a digital radio microphone, digital mixer, as well as DSP in the speakers, and attempting to possibly reduce this impact and any minor sonic losses from the multiple conversions. Guess that's today's world - unavoidable digital imprints on live audio.

Who knows, I may need to come back down to earth and just choose the active speaker option....
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olakunle odebode

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My suggestion for a very budget minded rig is a pair of Turbosound iQ10 over iQ15b subs. You wouldn't have to stretch the budget much if you shop wisely. If / when you move to a digital board, they are in the Behringer ultranet universe.

I use iQ10 for wedges, on sticks for acoustic stuff, and FOH over a sub for small venues. They sound better than anything else in this price range IMO.

They are plastic boxes, but you're not going to find birch cabinets in your price range new.

Up your budget a bit and you can get into DSR112, which is a forum favorite, best bang for your buck top box that punches way above its price. It is a wood box. A forum search will provide opinions from people with far more experience than myself.

Good luck

Thanks David - I appreciate your recommendations.

I'll re-aim my search to active speakers, in the two categories you have outlined. The IQ's represent really good value for money, I need to audition them soon.

Before then, if anyone has an opinion on how the more recent products like the Turbosound IQ, Yamaha DSR/DXR's compare to some of the older active monitors that I know very well - the Mackie SRM 350 and 450's version 2, please share?

I will most likely acquire a Behringer digital mixer so the IQ's would, as you have rightly pointed out, have some integration benefits.
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olakunle odebode

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Honestly the reason you heard a good sounding passive box is either it has processing that the manufacturer dictates(the Martin / D&B boxes) or possibly a very good operator. If you are neither having all the processing in the world will not help you.

Also to setup a passive system as well as a manufacturer could setup an active system/OEM amp and speaker combo would require software and knowledge that is quite far out of your price point.

Look to get a semi-decent powered box, IMHO buying a collection of components won't cost much less and any additional cost you do incur going active would give you significantly better sound quality/reliability.

Thanks Jean-Pierre. I appreciate this viewpoint, and am going back to the active speaker path....

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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Please recommend portable passive FOH speakers for - Live Band and DJ events
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2017, 08:02:50 AM »


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