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Author Topic: Is this a new DJ thing?????????  (Read 1558 times)

Ivan Beaver

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Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« on: July 19, 2017, 02:00:16 pm »

I have been getting the impression (I won't go into details) that at some DJ events, some of the guys are simply muting and unmuting various subs during the performance-at full performance level.

I assume this is for some sort of "effect"?

This is a new concept to me-has anybody else run into it?
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Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

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David Allred

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2017, 02:56:12 pm »

I have been getting the impression (I won't go into details) that at some DJ events, some of the guys are simply muting and unmuting various subs during the performance-at full performance level.

I assume this is for some sort of "effect"?

This is a new concept to me-has anybody else run into it?

That could definitely be an effect.  Could also be an anti-fatigue (auditory) attempt?
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2017, 03:27:26 pm »

That could definitely be an effect.  Could also be an anti-fatigue (auditory) attempt?
I think it is more of the "sudden" effect of reducing some of the subs, rather than just turning them down.

And then only some of them.

It seems like asking for trouble-especially if some are muted and they forget and then want full level.

But then again-it is "art", and pretty much anything goes.
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Ivan Beaver
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Guy Graham

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2017, 06:00:58 pm »

Might it be some modern adjustable digital version of kill switches, or even just the low frequency kill switch from a typical 3-way steep analogue fixed pass band filter?

These were used by some DJs (especially mixing genres with lots of percussive builds, breakdowns etc) both to produce extra drama by further manipulating the thump exciting the dance floor, as well as allowing smoother, subtler and more complex mixing - all via punching in and out huge portions of the frequency spectrum.

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g'bye, Dick Rees

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2017, 06:47:04 pm »

But then again-it is "art", and pretty much anything goes.

I don't know anything about Art, but I know what I like...and that ain't it.
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Dennis Wiggins

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2017, 10:13:31 pm »

I have been getting the impression (I won't go into details) that at some DJ events, some of the guys are simply muting and unmuting various subs during the performance-at full performance level.

I assume this is for some sort of "effect"?

This is a new concept to me-has anybody else run into it?

Very old... Since the Disco Era, Dee-Jays have used tone pots that completely roll off highs, mids , or lows... supposedly, to create 'tension' and 'excitement'.  Yawn.

CHORUS
So high (you got me movin')
Rock me baby
Roll me away
So high (you got me movin')
Rock me baby
Roll me away

Ijustdroppedintoseewhatconditionmyconditiomwasin,
Dennis
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Don T. Williams

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2017, 10:43:48 pm »

Amplifier protection circuits reacting to abuse?  Probably not, but . . .
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Tim Hite

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2017, 10:56:44 pm »

. . .simply muting and unmuting various subs during the performance-at full performance level.

I assume this is for some sort of "effect"?

This is a new concept to me-has anybody else run into it?

Current crop of DJ mixers has an impressive array of really powerful filters and DSP at the DJ's fingertips. Aside from 3 or 4 band GEQ on every input, there are multiple, assignable high-order (48dB/octave) LPF and HPF options, some with synthesizer type VCF resonance controls. Also, "isolators" which are essentially analog crossovers that can cut entire freq bands of a track out completely. If an SSL G+ EQ is a velvet glove, these guys are using 16lb sledge hammers. . .

On top of that, most of the guys I know writing techno and house are using multiple drum synthesizers with 3-4 different kick drums hitting at once to get the desired sound, possibly even adding a subharmonic synthesizer (DBX120A or similar). You can think of it like putting multiple mics on a kick drum and using that as a creative tool. You can modulate the tuning of the drum on the fly. Likewise with snares and hats.

It's a huge experiment in everything you wouldn't want to have happen in a live stage or recording situation. There's no telling where the weirdness is actually happening.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2017, 09:47:50 am »

Current crop of DJ mixers has an impressive array of really powerful filters and DSP at the DJ's fingertips. Aside from 3 or 4 band GEQ on every input, there are multiple, assignable high-order (48dB/octave) LPF and HPF options, some with synthesizer type VCF resonance controls. Also, "isolators" which are essentially analog crossovers that can cut entire freq bands of a track out completely. If an SSL G+ EQ is a velvet glove, these guys are using 16lb sledge hammers. . .

On top of that, most of the guys I know writing techno and house are using multiple drum synthesizers with 3-4 different kick drums hitting at once to get the desired sound, possibly even adding a subharmonic synthesizer (DBX120A or similar). You can think of it like putting multiple mics on a kick drum and using that as a creative tool.

This is not an overall thing, but rather just some of the subs/drivers.  The others are sitll working.
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Ivan Beaver
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Jay Barracato

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2017, 10:32:44 am »

This is not an overall thing, but rather just some of the subs/drivers.  The others are sitll working.
I know as a system tech that would drive me nuts trying to figure out a pattern or if it was an intermittent fault.

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Jay Barracato

David Allred

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2017, 01:26:28 pm »

I know as a system tech that would drive me nuts trying to figure out a pattern or if it was an intermittent fault.

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Ivan is saying it is by design.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2017, 02:03:13 pm »

Ivan is saying it is by design.
I won'
t go into details, but some emails I have gotten sound like they are muting some of the bass, and then turning it back on, all while the DJ is playing a show.

Not for troubleshooting reasons, but as if it was "natural" to do this during a show.
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A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
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Jay Barracato

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2017, 04:14:01 pm »

Ivan is saying it is by design.
If you were sys teching and part of the system was cutting in and our, would your first thought be the guy on stage is doing it on purpose?

Or would your ears tell you something is not as usual and trigger the troubleshooting mode.

I have told a story before on here about a song that had the clicking sound of subs hitting xmax recorded into the track. Drove me crazy until I realized the click was coming from the tops.

I have had enough techs tell me something is wrong with the system only to have it turn out to be their signal that I start troubleshooting by checking what they are sending.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

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Jay Barracato

Don T. Williams

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2017, 05:53:15 pm »

1+ for Jay's comment.  I had an employee that just loved a certain song and would play it when we were testing.  That damn song had so much intentional distortion that I couldn't tell if a system was good or bad.  I had to tell him to never ever play it in my shop after he used it for sales demo and the customers ask if that was how the system always sounded!
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George Friedman-Jimenez

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #14 on: July 20, 2017, 09:02:39 pm »

Could this be the beginning of the end of the current style of extreme hyping of the bass? Even DJs must realize that with so much subbage a lot of otherwise nice parts of the music get drowned out and lost as the middle of the frequency spectrum gets overwhelmed by bass. So maybe, just maybe, they are starting to want to hear some of those mids that have been covered up for all these years, and experimenting with uncovering the mids temporarily during parts of a song. Wow, there were vocals, congas and piano in that song? Harmony? Melody? Who knew?
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Lance Hallmark

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2017, 03:38:19 pm »

I won'
t go into details, but some emails I have gotten sound like they are muting some of the bass, and then turning it back on, all while the DJ is playing a show.

Not for troubleshooting reasons, but as if it was "natural" to do this during a show.

From a DJ perspective, I have not heard of this, if they are cutting out frequencies it would be across all speakers in the P.A. via tone controls or effects. The only thing I can think of is that maybe the sound guy is giving some of his subs a break, letting them cool down maybe? Could it have been the DJ turning the monitors up and down? Oftentimes I will cut the monitor down or off until I'm ready for the next mix. Most DJs could care less about individual speakers and usually don't have access to tweak individual cabs while they are playing.
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Randy Pence

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #16 on: July 25, 2017, 07:38:25 am »

I know as a system tech that would drive me nuts trying to figure out a pattern or if it was an intermittent fault.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

I once thought the dj was trying to mess with me, asking where the bass was going, but as it turned out, one of the amps was failing and he was sensitive enough to perceive a couple dB difference
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Kevin McDonough

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Re: Is this a new DJ thing?????????
« Reply #17 on: July 25, 2017, 09:31:38 am »

When you say "they" are turning off a portion of the subs, who do you mean?

I assume not the actual DJ themselves? I would think that they would just be giving you a LR out of their mixer, and any effects/EQ/Cuts they applied would be to the whole music signal?

So a system tech or the sound co providing the sound you mean? If it was for creative reasons, how would they know when to do it, when the DJ wanted it cut? is it happening with specific songs or parts, or specific times etc?

While I appreciate you don't want to go into too much info about specific clients etc, I struggle to understand what turning portions of the subs on and off like this would accomplish. surely if you wanted to lower the bass temporarily for whatever reason, you would just do it with all the subs together to preserve your system design and coverage across the audience etc.


I can only think that maybe they don't have enough rig for the job, and either the amps are protecting automatically, or the system tech is cycling through groups of subs at a time manually giving them a small rest and chance to cool?

K
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