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[Tim Hite]

Looking at upgrading the tops on my EAW rig. I could use a bit more output. Was just looking at spec on the Danley SM80 and it sure seems like they have similar output and freq response to my current KF300e boxes. These are used over SB600e subs, which I am quite content with. Everything is Lab Gruppen powered

Aside from being 50lbs lighter and more modern are the any other advantages to upgrading to Danley here?

How about to a different Danley box?

After looking at spec sheets on the Danley site, it sure seems like most of the boxes are right there in the 127dB long-term output range with some coverage options.

Immediate need is to cover 500-1000 people for country and big band, outdoors, in the outfield of a small baseball diamond. I feel like my KF boxes might run out of gas.

[Keith Broughton]

Looking at upgrading the tops on my EAW rig. I could use a bit more output. Was just looking at spec on the Danley SM80 and it sure seems like they have similar output and freq response to my current KF300e boxes. These are used over SB600e subs, which I am quite content with. Everything is Lab Gruppen powered

Aside from being 50lbs lighter and more modern are the any other advantages to upgrading to Danley here?

How about to a different Danley box?

After looking at spec sheets on the Danley site, it sure seems like most of the boxes are right there in the 127dB long-term output range with some coverage options.

Immediate need is to cover 500-1000 people for country and big ban, outdoors, in the outfield of a small baseball diamond. I feel like my KF boxes might run out of gas.

I would say the Danley would exhibit a more coherent sound and a more predictable and even off axis SPL drop.

[Art Welter]

1)Looking at upgrading the tops on my EAW rig. I could use a bit more output. Was just looking at spec on the Danley SM80 and it sure seems like they have similar output and freq response to my current KF300e boxes.
2)Aside from being 50lbs lighter and more modern are the any other advantages to upgrading to Danley here?
3)How about to a different Danley box?
4)Immediate need is to cover 500-1000 people for country and big ban, outdoors, in the outfield of a small baseball diamond. I feel like my KF boxes might run out of gas.

1) The output above 200 Hz may be similar, but the SM-80 rolls off at around 12 dB per octave from 200 Hz- it is around 15 dB down at 70 Hz, the KF300e is only -3dB at 70 Hz.
2) Passive operation with one amp channel may be considered an advantage.
3) There are certainly many to choose from, but DSL offerings with similar low mid output and mid/HF pattern of your current KF300e boxes are at least as heavy. Country lives in the low mid.
4) Any system will "run out of gas" if pushed too hard. If you want to increase your headroom, you need to be looking at a lot more than a single sealed 12" for low mid per side if you want to be louder than a Fender Twin.

Like Carrol Shelby said, "There's no replacement for displacement ;^).

Art

[Scott Holtzman]

1) The output above 200 Hz may be similar, but the SM-80 rolls off at around 12 dB per octave from 200 Hz- it is around 15 dB down at 70 Hz, the KF300e is only -3dB at 70 Hz.
2) Passive operation with one amp channel may be considered an advantage.
3) There are certainly many to choose from, but DSL offerings with similar low mid output and mid/HF pattern of your current KF300e boxes are at least as heavy. Country lives in the low mid.
4) Any system will "run out of gas" if pushed too hard. If you want to increase your headroom, you need to be looking at a lot more than a single sealed 12" for low mid per side if you want to be louder than a Fender Twin.

Like Carrol Shelby said, "There's no replacement for displacement ;^).

Art

Art is completely right. You can only get so much from a front loaded 12.  Stick a horn in front of it and it gets louder.  If you want the low end it needs to be a big ass horn.  Big ass horns add weight.

Or you can stick a line of front loaded boxes and couple them together.

It's still heavy but logistically more manageable.

This is the entire crux of the discussion and until a breakthrough occurs in the physical sciences this isn't going to change.

Going from ground stacking to getting speakers in the air either horizontally or vertically is an exponentially increase in  equipment and knowledge.

This is also why it is so hard to make the jump to providing for events where ground stacked won't do.

[Tim Hite]

. . .
3) . . . Country lives in the low mid.

Haven't done much country other than mixing up acoustic folkish stuff, good to know about the low-mid thing. I think I'm solid with my 2x15" subs being able to play higher than most. . .

4) Any system will "run out of gas" if pushed too hard. If you want to increase your headroom, you need to be looking at a lot more than a single sealed 12" for low mid per side if you want to be louder than a Fender Twin.

Like Carrol Shelby said, "There's no replacement for displacement ;^).

Art

Yeah I know. . .I'm in the midst of shopping a +6dB rig and was looking for a quick way to get a bit extra without having to pony up for a small-format line array, just yet. My KF300's are biamped with oversize amps, so I may just cross-rent 4xKF650 and some processing, which would get me there. The SM80 is cheap enough that I'd consider owning them or replacing the 300s if they had a bit more output.

And yeah, Scott, I was typing this response while you were posting. I totally agree. Problem is, I'm still trying to see what this area will support before I commit $50k+ to a new rig, lifts, foldback etc. . .

chicken, egg, etc. . .

. . .
Or you can stick a line of front loaded boxes and couple them together.

It's still heavy but logistically more manageable.

This is the entire crux of the discussion and until a breakthrough occurs in the physical sciences this isn't going to change.

Going from ground stacking to getting speakers in the air either horizontally or vertically is an exponentially increase in  equipment and knowledge.

This is also why it is so hard to make the jump to providing for events where ground stacked won't do.

[sbjacob]

Looking at upgrading the tops on my EAW rig. I could use a bit more output. Was just looking at spec on the Danley SM80 and it sure seems like they have similar output and freq response to my current KF300e boxes. These are used over SB600e subs, which I am quite content with. Everything is Lab Gruppen powered

Aside from being 50lbs lighter and more modern are the any other advantages to upgrading to Danley here?

How about to a different Danley box?

After looking at spec sheets on the Danley site, it sure seems like most of the boxes are right there in the 127dB long-term output range with some coverage options.

Immediate need is to cover 500-1000 people for country and big ban, outdoors, in the outfield of a small baseball diamond. I feel like my KF boxes might run out of gas.

Hi Tim check the specs out on the OS80 they go a little lower. http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/products/loud-speakers/outdoor-series/os80/

[Tim Weaver]

I'd be inclined to get the SM80's and run them from 160-ish and up. Then get a pair of killer subs and put your SB600's between the two. You'll add some real low end plus get the SM80's up a little higher in the air. The 80's will hang from 200hz and up no problem.

Something like........
http://jtrspeakers.com/captivator-218pro.html

It would be a tri-amped four-way system.

[Steve Litcher]

Building on Tim's suggestion, you might want to check into JTR Noesis 3TX speakers. They seem like they'd fit your need quite well. We have them and absolutely love them - we run everything from Country to Blues to Rock to Metal to acoustic, and they handle it all with ease.

We ran ours with EAW subs for a while, and then switched over to the Orbit Shifters. It's really a sweet sounding, versatile and easy to manage rig.

[Steve Eudaly]

Yeah I know. . .I'm in the midst of shopping a +6dB rig and was looking for a quick way to get a bit extra without having to pony up for a small-format line array, just yet. My KF300's are biamped with oversize amps, so I may just cross-rent 4xKF650 and some processing, which would get me there. The SM80 is cheap enough that I'd consider owning them or replacing the 300s if they had a bit more output.

If you're only needing the additional gas for this one gig, then cross-rent the 650 rig and be done with it.

If this is a reoccurring issue, then yes, perhaps it is time to upgrade. And if that's the case, I think looking at 650s to round out your existing EAW inventory wouldn't be a bad route.

[Ivan Beaver]

Hi Tim check the specs out on the OS80 they go a little lower. http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/products/loud-speakers/outdoor-series/os80/

I generally do not recommend the OS product for portable situations for several reasons.

The biggest one being that the first time you try to move it you will regret buying it.

It is designed not have have any place water can collect (hence the outdoor usage).  As such, there are no handles and it is hard to grip.

But it does go a little lower and costs less.

But don't say I didn't warn you---------

I also has a pigtail connection, not a NL4 jack.

[ProSoundWeb Community]