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[Chris Edwards]

I've been contemplating purchasing some JBL and Soundcraft products but am a bit hesitant because of Harman's recent acquisition by Samsung.  My main concerns are warranty and parts supply as well as future firmware and software upgrades on the products.  Should I be concerned?  Are current Harman product owners concerned? 

I am also curious if they will just keep the JBL Automotive side of things and just sell of the other pieces.  Thoughts?

[Tim McCulloch]

I've been contemplating purchasing some JBL and Soundcraft products but am a bit hesitant because of Harman's recent acquisition by Samsung.  My main concerns are warranty and parts supply as well as future firmware and software upgrades on the products.  Should I be concerned?  Are current Harman product owners concerned? 

I am also curious if they will just keep the JBL Automotive side of things and just sell of the other pieces.  Thoughts?

Harman is indirectly in lots of markets, a few of which Samsung is not.  If those are making money I'd guess Samsung would keep them, if they're marginal or running losses expect them to be sold or closed.

We've got a bunch of money in JBL & Crown and we're not concerned yet.  Transducer parts seem readily available but hardware/mechanical items can be spotty.  That's been SOP for the last 10 years, though, so I don't read much into it.  The same with Crown - current models seem to have parts availability, legacy products are always a guess.  Crown is particularly helpful with parts inventory info and their projected turn around times tend to be spot on.

If you have a significant Harman inventory and/or clients that want JBL/Crown/AKG/Soundcraft, I think whatever ROI standards you have should be applied.  You can't run a business based on blind speculation.

[Renard Hurtado]

[/quote]i was discussing this with a friend also some other major brands that has been sold or bought by other companies and burried ( SWR etc).

His answer was "Yamaha is forever", maybe he's
right !

Renard from Curacao

[Jeff Bankston]

18 sound bought Ciare but nothing has changed, yet

[Marjan Milosevic]

18 sound bought Ciare but nothing has changed, yet

If by that you mean no Ciare product is yet available since the purchase, then yes, you are right.

[Bob Leonard]

The list of manufacturers under the Harman umbrella seems to be almost endless at times, and Samsung, like any other uuuuge company will weed out the marginal products and non money makers. The JBL, dbx, Soundcraft, and Harman's other premier brands have names synonymous with quality  and customer loyalty. I haven't heard of any issues, and based on what I know about Samsung, don't anticipate any radical changes in support or quality. My best guess would be that Samsung will leave most of the Harman brands alone with either business as usual or more money spent for improvement of those brands.

[David Sturzenbecher]

The list of manufacturers under the Harman umbrella seems to be almost endless at times, and Samsung, like any other uuuuge company will weed out the marginal products and non money makers. The JBL, dbx, Soundcraft, and Harman's other premier brands have names synonymous with quality  and customer loyalty. I haven't heard of any issues, and based on what I know about Samsung, don't anticipate any radical changes in support or quality. My best guess would be that Samsung will leave most of the Harman brands alone with either business as usual or more money spent for improvement of those brands.

Looks like they are doing pretty well.
http://www.androidauthority.com/samsung-highest-operating-profit-world-781407/

[John Roberts {JR}]

Probably won't make much difference to end users, but Samsung in Korea is dealing with a bribery scandal. May not be that unusual for large companies in the PAC RIM countries.

JR

[Dave Pluke]

My best guess would be that Samsung will leave most of the Harman brands alone with either business as usual or more money spent for improvement of those brands.

The acquisition still puzzles me.  The original Press Release seemed to indicate Samsung was most interested in the Car Audio and Home Theater segments.  It wouldn't be hard to imagine them eventually spinning off the Pro Audio offerings.  I hope, for the sake of competition, that Mr. B. isn't cracking open his piggybank as we speak...

In any case, today's Products should continue to be supported for the next 3 - 5 years (i.e. the warranty period and timeframe we might base ROI calculations on).

Dave

[John Roberts {JR}]

The acquisition still puzzles me.  The original Press Release seemed to indicate Samsung was most interested in the Car Audio and Home Theater segments.  It wouldn't be hard to imagine them eventually spinning off the Pro Audio offerings.  I hope, for the sake of competition, that Mr. B. isn't cracking open his piggybank as we speak...

In any case, today's Products should continue to be supported for the next 3 - 5 years (i.e. the warranty period and timeframe we might base ROI calculations on).

Dave

Harman is (was?) huge in automotive sound and increasingly more as cars become more computerized. The brand still has some juice in consumer audio, which these days means home theater. Pro sound is unlikely to be of interest to Samsung unless they use it for marketing consumer gear (like JBL has for decades).

caverat lector.... pure speculation on my part...

JR

[Tim McCulloch]

Harman is (was?) huge in automotive sound and increasingly more as cars become more computerized. The brand still has some juice in consumer audio, which these days means home theater. Pro sound is unlikely to be of interest to Samsung unless they use it for marketing consumer gear (like JBL has for decades).

caverat lector.... pure speculation on my part...

JR

I foresee more "Powered by Crown" and "JBL Inside" types of marketing.  The brands still have some consumer cachet and Samsung could leverage their expanded use of the technologies to expand the brand recognition.  I don't pretend that the top of end of JBL's portable catalog is hugely profitable but Id bet the install side makes a decent return for Harman.

What Harman is figuring out is how to cross-pollinate technologies and products across brand lines.  Sometimes it works well and sometimes it doesn't (Soundcraft remote apps, anyone?) but it's coming together.

Time will tell.

[Stelios Mac]

They'd have to be absolutely crazy to do so, imo.
JBL, Crown & Soundcraft are amongst the most popular Pro-Audio brands - Especially JBL.
I mean, everyone (pro or not) will instantly recognize the look of Vertec, even if they don't know it's JBL or even a speaker!

It would be like saying "Right, we bought VW Group for x y z reasons, but we don't care about Lamborghini or Bugatti so we're shutting them down."

Every single cabinet JBL makes includes their own drivers, their own amps, their own DSP, even their own paint finish... They get maximum profit on every single sale they make, and I assume it's been like this for a decade or two.
If L'Acoustics or Nexo are profitable, I can only imagine what JBL is.

[John J.R. Bogle]

Every single cabinet JBL makes includes their own drivers, their own amps, their own DSP, even their own paint finish...

Just an interesting side note: I believe the Mpro line used Crown power amps.

Also (not to derail the thread) does anyone remember the old JBL/UREI power amps? Sounded great but not very road worthy (owned a couple - both died an early death ).

Back to the OP. I don't think Samsung is that awful of a company (they seem to be quality minded (never mind the burning cell phones . I would doubt they'll tinker too much with Harmon as it seems to be an overall profitable group of products as it is. My gut feeling is that I'd have no problem buying a new JBL or DBX product. I understand your point though as when I tried to get crossover info & parts for some old EAW boxes, dealing with LOUD technology was a serious pain. OTOH I'd bet Samsung will leave Harmon as it's own division and just make use of some of it's R&D occasionally.

[Bob Leonard]

Samsung not a bad company? Samsung is known as the most respected brand in flat screen TV's, even to the point where many other brands use or license their technology. Their build quality is beyond reproach, and their support is well above the norm. Their home appliances are built like a brick shithouse, and just about everything made by the company says quality. One of the few Asian companies I don't mind buying from.

[John Roberts {JR}]

Samsung not a bad company? Samsung is known as the most respected brand in flat screen TV's, even to the point where many other brands use or license their technology. Their build quality is beyond reproach, and their support is well above the norm. Their home appliances are built like a brick shithouse, and just about everything made by the company says quality. One of the few Asian companies I don't mind buying from.

Here hold my galaxy note 7 phone for a minute...

JR

[Tim McCulloch]

Here hold my galaxy note 7 phone for a minute...

JR

Sure thing, pal.

While it was a very public failure I think Samsung handled it about as well as could be done:  they found the problem, thought they'd fixed it and finally recalled and refunded/replaced every purchase.  This level of engagement probably kept the problem from becoming an even bigger publicity issue for them.

A small handful of problem SKUs in a company with so many divisions, products and markets is not the end of world for Samsung and I'd assert that for most consumers the Note 7 fiasco is already a faded memory.

And right now I'd rather have stock in Samsung than in Toshiba...

[John Roberts {JR}]

Sure thing, pal.

While it was a very public failure I think Samsung handled it about as well as could be done:  they found the problem, thought they'd fixed it and finally recalled and refunded/replaced every purchase.  This level of engagement probably kept the problem from becoming an even bigger publicity issue for them.

Yes, the "thought they fixed" was the interesting part to me (because I'm a technology nerd). The phone had two different battery vendors and their initial ASSumption was that the fault condition was only occurring with one vendor's batteries... BZZT wrongo.

Turns out the fault vector was two fold... the mechanical packaging was too tight around the battery, and size tolerance of batteries was sloppy enough that the lack of clearance caused some batteries to overheat and fail. Once they melt the fireworks really start  . Besides cutting back to just one battery vendor, IIRC they also tried using a slower charging rate to keep battery temperature down, but no luck. 

The decisions to axe the entire model was surely a difficult decision involving millions of dollars loss, and an unexpected sales/market share bump for their competitors.

Yes they eventually got it right, and I completely understand the foot dragging and "hail mary" attempts to rescue the valuable program. 

A small handful of problem SKUs in a company with so many divisions, products and markets is not the end of world for Samsung and I'd assert that for most consumers the Note 7 fiasco is already a faded memory.

And right now I'd rather have stock in Samsung than in Toshiba...

I'd rather not own stock in either...

Toshiba, where to begin?  I recall when Toshiba was caught selling secret submarine concealment technology to Russia back in the 80s (quiet prop design). More recently they are in the news because their Westinghouse subsidiary (they bought to get an inroad into the US nuclear power plant business) has recently declared bankruptcy due to reverses in that industry. 

Probably not a good time for nuclear power plants or clean coal. My local clean coal power plant has been running on natural gas since 2015 because A) it's cheaper and B) it actually works reliably...  The >$7B they spent building the (not yet) SOTA clean coal power plant looks like a massive white elephant. The new technology was not close to operational when project started (maybe not even now after years of delays), and clean coal is not cheaper than gas, so why spend the extra $B?. After multiple announcements every several months that they would be bringing the clean coal plant on line any day now, the local utility rate commissions finally said "no mas" they can't charge us rate payers for the extra $B that they wasted, or run the more expensive clean coal. I suspect we ratepayers will still pay one way or the other.

JR

[Bob Leonard]

Here hold my galaxy note 7 phone for a minute...

JR

I have a few that I'll be using while on vacation. I'll be away from my much loved Weber Genesis and using charcoal. They make great starters and no lighter fluid needed.

[Tim McCulloch]

I have a few that I'll be using while on vacation. I'll be away from my much loved Weber Genesis and using charcoal. They make great starters and no lighter fluid needed.

They leave a nasty aftertaste.  Ask Samsung...

[Bob Leonard]

Not if you coat them with hickory flavored BBQ sauce. Best part is that you can put them under the charcoal and remote start the grill from the house by dialing the phone number.

[John Roberts {JR}]

Samsung just re-released the note 7 in South Korea... Since it has features the 8 doesn't. Don't know if they will release it any wider than that.

Probably good if they can reduce some of that multiple $B loss by converting some dead inventory. A won-win situation.

JR

[Stephen Kirby]

While I've never been a fan of JBL (the old Junk But Loud thing) I do recognize that they have terrific brand recognition.  I'm sure Samsung would love to slap an orange sticker on anything that makes noise.  Audio industry specific brands like Soundcraft or DBX are just part of the package.  They could even be spun off since they were acquisitions anyway.

So in keeping the public seeing orange, the consumer and automotive divisions should probably get all the support they need.  Pro audio would be part of the marketing budget.

[brian maddox]

While I've never been a fan of JBL (the old Junk But Loud thing) I do recognize that they have terrific brand recognition.  I'm sure Samsung would love to slap an orange sticker on anything that makes noise....

Had a job recently where i needed a tiny speaker for a up close and personal speech only foldback monitor.  Sent someone off to dig something up and this little gem is what i got.

What isn't obvious in the picture is this thing is literally the size of the typical JBL Plastic logo on their speakers.  It's like they didn't slap the logo ON a speaker.  They just made THE LOGO a speaker. 

It worked okay for what i needed.  rechargeable battery.  Actual line level input.  Didn't sound horrible for being about 3 inches across. 

[Nathan Riddle]

It worked okay for what i needed.  rechargeable battery.  Actual line level input.  Didn't sound horrible for being about 3 inches across. 

Warning, thread deviation.

This is an excellent idea for Danley's new Nano speaker... Then its a 6" speaker that sounds 'great' instead of "not horrible" 

[ProSoundWeb Community]