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[Jesse Stern]

In IAS, you can select the frequency list for a unit to show ALL tunable frequencies, or only frequencies that exist as a channel in a group. 

Is there a way to set WWB to only use pre-existing group/channel frequencies in a coordination?

Sometimes I am in a situation where the devices aren't networked, and it would save time to only have to assign group/channels to them instead of scrolling through frequency settings 25kHz at a time.

[Jordan Wolf]

Jesse,

What wireless systems are you using?

I'll agree that using pre-programmed Groups/Channels can be easier for deployment and assignment.

I still have the, uh, "pleasure" of using multiple units of ULX-P and there is an option when building your Inventory whether to use Master List Mode or not. I use this mode when I have a lit of wireless to wrangle (60+) so I can squeeze more freqs. in different zones.

I wish UHF-R, ULX-D, etc. allowed for a similar functionality as well, but I have not found it myself in WWB.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Kevin Maxwell]

In IAS, you can select the frequency list for a unit to show ALL tunable frequencies, or only frequencies that exist as a channel in a group. 

Is there a way to set WWB to only use pre-existing group/channel frequencies in a coordination?

Sometimes I am in a situation where the devices aren't networked, and it would save time to only have to assign group/channels to them instead of scrolling through frequency settings 25kHz at a time.

If I am interpreting your question correctly yes you can lock in existing frequencies. This is assuming you are using at least version 6.12 of WWB. In the frequency coordination section you will see the list of your frequencies and all the way to the left on each device is an Icon that indicates whether it is locked or not. So if you lock them all then you can do your additional frequencies without losing your original settings. I would suggest that you save the show and then play around with making changes and see what happens and what works for you and what doesn’t. The one thing I have found though is sometime it isn’t possible to fit in more channels without retuning a bunch of devices. One suggestion is to do your initial coordination with a bunch of spare channels and that will make adding them later much easier.

[Jean-Pierre Coetzee]

In IAS, you can select the frequency list for a unit to show ALL tunable frequencies, or only frequencies that exist as a channel in a group. 

Is there a way to set WWB to only use pre-existing group/channel frequencies in a coordination?

Sometimes I am in a situation where the devices aren't networked, and it would save time to only have to assign group/channels to them instead of scrolling through frequency settings 25kHz at a time.

I understand what you are asking and I'm going to say more than likely no since you will not get a properly co-ordinated system, the more exact you can be the more likely your are to not have any interred issues and therefore you will want to use exact frequencies in-stead of manufacturer defined frequencies in the group/channel presets.

What situations are you in where you do not have enough time to correctly co-ordinate your wireless system? If you have a large amount of frequencies to co-ordinate and you tend to use them in Similar areas just leave them as is and have any new units change to fit your current co-ordination.

It would also be useful if you let us know what wireless units you are trying to co-ordinate.

[John Sulek]

I understand what you are asking and I'm going to say more than likely no since you will not get a properly co-ordinated system, the more exact you can be the more likely your are to not have any interred issues and therefore you will want to use exact frequencies in-stead of manufacturer defined frequencies in the group/channel presets..

Using the manufacturer groups / channels does not invalidate your coordination if you have tested them against each other in WWB/ IAS...etc.
It is math...doesn't matter where the numbers come from as long as they all play nicely together.
Folks get into trouble by combining the manufacturers presets among different band splits or models without using any coordination software to check for conflicts.

[Andrew Outlaw]

Well Jesse, if you're working with a certain companies UHF-R's and in the DC area, there is a user group in all of them (U1 I think, it'll be the only one that's on all of them) that I programmed a few months ago, so there's always that. As far as I know, there is no way to force workbench to only coordinate with groups like you could with the ULX-P's.

Here are workarounds: if you just don't like scrolling through numbers, use your crossover cable to hook into them one at a time to set frequency.

Also, let's say you're using 10 h4's, and 5 G1's. What I might do is use the recommended group/channel frequencies on the H4's, lock those in in my coordination, and then coordinate the G1's. You still have to scroll, but a little less of it.

There's always the find some stagehand not doing anything and make him do it for you trick too 

[Jean-Pierre Coetzee]

Using the manufacturer groups / channels does not invalidate your coordination if you have tested them against each other in WWB/ IAS...etc.
It is math...doesn't matter where the numbers come from as long as they all play nicely together.
Folks get into trouble by combining the manufacturers presets among different band splits or models without using any coordination software to check for conflicts.

I'm not implying that, I'm implying mixing manufacturers and then wanting to use the predefined groups from each manufacturer.

Also if you can get a more accurate coordination is it really not worth the extra time to avoid IM?

I've used the stagehand not doing anything trick quite a few times. Always check the work afterwards but is a real time saver.

I also try to co-ordinate and dial in as much as possible before I get to the venue. You might even be able to go in the day before and get a scan if need be.

I feel wanting to bypass correct procedure to save time should be as serious here as it is in rigging even if lives are not at risk, do you want the reputation as someone who cuts corners or someone who is thorough and does what is expected.

[Kevin Maxwell]

I'm not implying that, I'm implying mixing manufacturers and then wanting to use the predefined groups from each manufacturer.

Also if you can get a more accurate coordination is it really not worth the extra time to avoid IM?

I've used the stagehand not doing anything trick quite a few times. Always check the work afterwards but is a real time saver.

I also try to co-ordinate and dial in as much as possible before I get to the venue. You might even be able to go in the day before and get a scan if need be.

I feel wanting to bypass correct procedure to save time should be as serious here as it is in rigging even if lives are not at risk, do you want the reputation as someone who cuts corners or someone who is thorough and does what is expected.

I am not sure if you are talking about the same thing I am but I sometimes have a bunch of wireless that are properly coordinated for a location and then we need to add some more. I am using Wireless Workbench 6.12 and I use a WinRadio as a scanner, I have found that it is more accurate than using the Shure receivers as the scanners and sometimes I am trying to add frequencies in a range that is outside of the Shure receivers. I am using Shure UHF-R sometimes mixed with some Sennheiser EW series wireless and also having to keep clear of the wireless comms.

Rather than from the start throwing away the coordination I already have, I lock those channels and after a scan see if I can add the Sennheiser without having to retune the already coordinated Shure’s. I have had mixed results. Sometimes I have to retune a few of the Shure’s but WWB will tell me which ones are going to be a problem. And I have it reassign frequencies to those.

I have slightly changed my technique and am usually now putting some spare channels in to start with. But sometimes the scan shows something that wasn’t there before and I have to do more retuning then I would like.     

Our standard wireless setup for Musicals consists of 18 Shure UHF-R and 8 Sennheiser EW series. And one of the theaters has 5 frequencies taken up with the Telex wireless comms. And sometimes we need to add more mics to the system. Even though these theaters aren’t that far away from each other (just over 2 miles) I do seem to get very slightly different hits when scanning.

[Jean-Pierre Coetzee]

I am not sure if you are talking about the same thing I am but I sometimes have a bunch of wireless that are properly coordinated for a location and then we need to add some more. I am using Wireless Workbench 6.12 and I use a WinRadio as a scanner, I have found that it is more accurate than using the Shure receivers as the scanners and sometimes I am trying to add frequencies in a range that is outside of the Shure receivers. I am using Shure UHF-R sometimes mixed with some Sennheiser EW series wireless and also having to keep clear of the wireless comms.

Rather than from the start throwing away the coordination I already have, I lock those channels and after a scan see if I can add the Sennheiser without having to retune the already coordinated Shure’s. I have had mixed results. Sometimes I have to retune a few of the Shure’s but WWB will tell me which ones are going to be a problem. And I have it reassign frequencies to those.

I have slightly changed my technique and am usually now putting some spare channels in to start with. But sometimes the scan shows something that wasn’t there before and I have to do more retuning then I would like.     

Our standard wireless setup for Musicals consists of 18 Shure UHF-R and 8 Sennheiser EW series. And one of the theaters has 5 frequencies taken up with the Telex wireless comms. And sometimes we need to add more mics to the system. Even though these theaters aren’t that far away from each other (just over 2 miles) I do seem to get very slightly different hits when scanning.

To an extent that. If you work the same venues the RF should usually be similar in the same venue every time. There are exceptions.

Just trying to solve the actual need to change frequencies the whole time instead of trying to use predefined groups for OP.

[Jesse Stern]

I understand what you are asking and I'm going to say more than likely no since you will not get a properly co-ordinated system, the more exact you can be the more likely your are to not have any interred issues and therefore you will want to use exact frequencies in-stead of manufacturer defined frequencies in the group/channel presets.

What situations are you in where you do not have enough time to correctly co-ordinate your wireless system? If you have a large amount of frequencies to co-ordinate and you tend to use them in Similar areas just leave them as is and have any new units change to fit your current co-ordination.

It would also be useful if you let us know what wireless units you are trying to co-ordinate.

There isn't anything "incorrect" about using the manufacturer-assigned groups and channels to coordinate units in the same band... that's what they are there for and I trust manufacturers to know how to properly space frequencies and intermods on their own equipment.

An example of a common scenario where I would like to restrict my coordination to groups/channels in WWB:

I have Multiple Shure ULX units will be setup throughout a GS and multiple breakout rooms all in close proximity.  I need to coordinate them all before sending them out to their respective rooms.  I also would like to have backup freqs on hand incase of unexpected interference, or if extra units end up being added last minute. 

I import a .csv scan into WWB so it can avoid any local RF transmissions, and do a coordination.  It gives me my list of frequencies, but they all need to be "manually" entered into the receivers and transmitters (ULXs don't even have an IR sync) since none of them are group/channel freqs.   

This is very time consuming to deploy.  If I could stick with groups/channels, it would save time programming them and it would be easier to tell the breakout techs what freqs to use (i.e. "G3 C2" instead of "525.125").  Also, if someone ended up taking hits and needed to make an "emergency" change, or needed to add a mic, they could just do a quick channel scan and find a clean one that wouldn't invalidate my whole coordination. 

[Kevin Maxwell]

There isn't anything "incorrect" about using the manufacturer-assigned groups and channels to coordinate units in the same band... that's what they are there for and I trust manufacturers to know how to properly space frequencies and intermods on their own equipment.

An example of a common scenario where I would like to restrict my coordination to groups/channels in WWB:

I have Multiple Shure ULX units will be setup throughout a GS and multiple breakout rooms all in close proximity.  I need to coordinate them all before sending them out to their respective rooms.  I also would like to have backup freqs on hand incase of unexpected interference, or if extra units end up being added last minute. 

I import a .csv scan into WWB so it can avoid any local RF transmissions, and do a coordination.  It gives me my list of frequencies, but they all need to be "manually" entered into the receivers and transmitters (ULXs don't even have an IR sync) since none of them are group/channel freqs.   

This is very time consuming to deploy.  If I could stick with groups/channels, it would save time programming them and it would be easier to tell the breakout techs what freqs to use (i.e. "G3 C2" instead of "525.125").  Also, if someone ended up taking hits and needed to make an "emergency" change, or needed to add a mic, they could just do a quick channel scan and find a clean one that wouldn't invalidate my whole coordination.

See my first post in this thread and my second. Enter the data in WWB and then import the scan and see if everything is working together. Then save that setup. Then if you need to add more or move to a different place lock the existing wireless in WWB and then import your scan and see if in this location everything plays nice together. Then add the additional units and if it is possible it will give you coordinated frequencies for the new ones. It also makes sense to put some spares into your initial coordination then the only variable will be the scan and of course the look up for local frequencies.

You can enter all of the data using the Group and Channel in WWB 6.12. Also when you have WWB calculate (add) more channels it will display the Group and the Channel besides the frequency.

[Mac Kerr]

There isn't anything "incorrect" about using the manufacturer-assigned groups and channels to coordinate units in the same band... that's what they are there for and I trust manufacturers to know how to properly space frequencies and intermods on their own equipment.

An example of a common scenario where I would like to restrict my coordination to groups/channels in WWB:

I have Multiple Shure ULX units will be setup throughout a GS and multiple breakout rooms all in close proximity.  I need to coordinate them all before sending them out to their respective rooms.  I also would like to have backup freqs on hand incase of unexpected interference, or if extra units end up being added last minute. 

I import a .csv scan into WWB so it can avoid any local RF transmissions, and do a coordination.  It gives me my list of frequencies, but they all need to be "manually" entered into the receivers and transmitters (ULXs don't even have an IR sync) since none of them are group/channel freqs.   

This is very time consuming to deploy.  If I could stick with groups/channels, it would save time programming them and it would be easier to tell the breakout techs what freqs to use (i.e. "G3 C2" instead of "525.125").  Also, if someone ended up taking hits and needed to make an "emergency" change, or needed to add a mic, they could just do a quick channel scan and find a clean one that wouldn't invalidate my whole coordination.

Unless all the RF in the room is in that 1 group there is no coordination. Since there is usually only 8-10 frequencies in those groups doing a coord that includes spares is an effort in futility. Also anyone doing a scan to chose a clear frequency will invalidate your coord.

Mac

[Pete Erskine]

In IAS, you can select the frequency list for a unit to show ALL tunable frequencies, or only frequencies that exist as a channel in a group. 

Is there a way to set WWB to only use pre-existing group/channel frequencies in a coordination?

Sometimes I am in a situation where the devices aren't networked, and it would save time to only have to assign group/channels to them instead of scrolling through frequency settings 25kHz at a time.

This thread has been interesting but I think the effect is moot.  Your desire is to give your techs the group/channels numbers rather than frequencies when using WWB.

As john pointed out above, Go ahead and do your coordination for all your spaces.  As you can see below WWB and IAS both list the group and channel numbers for the frequencies.  Since you are using WWB the freqs will be properly IM coordinated even if they use freqs from different groups -  Just keep all your coords in an RF area in the same zone and the freqs can be backups for any mic in the area, just by giving the group/channel numbers to your techs.  Do not allow any local scans since there is no control and you cannot be sure that it will not effect other rooms which might not be on at the time.

First shot is WWB and second is IAS  (don't compare the two they were different shows.)

[Jordan Wolf]

...As you can see below WWB and IAS both list the group and channel numbers for the frequencies.  Since you are using WWB the freqs will be properly IM coordinated even if they use freqs from different groups -  Just keep all your coords in an RF area in the same zone and the freqs can be backups for any mic in the area, just by giving the group/channel numbers to your techs.  Do not allow any local scans since there is no control and you cannot be sure that it will not effect other rooms which might not be on at the time.

Pete,

From my experience, WWB will not constrain its calculations to using ONLY Gr/Ch presets when calculating UHF-R units; more often than not, the coordinated freqs. do not line up with a Gr/Ch preset.

In WWB Inventory, ULX units can be constrained to Gr/Ch presets OR used in Master List mode for more frequency agility.

Only sticking with Gr/Ch presets limits the amount of freqs. you can make work, but if that number works for the OP, it cpuld save some time.

[ProSoundWeb Community]