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Author Topic: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues  (Read 989 times)

Andrew Broughton

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Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« on: April 16, 2017, 03:28:54 pm »

So, for years before this, I've had no real problems recording multi-track (32 tracks) of 16 or 24 bit/48k audio using DVS on my Lenovo ThinkPad from RIOs

This year, I cannot get a clean recording. I know there's been Dante and Firmware updates between this year and last, but I don't know if they are the cause.
I thought maybe something had happened to my computer (a piece of software or driver update) that had caused me to not be able to cleanly record DVS multitracks, so I did a clean install of Win10 on the computer. No dice, same issue. Wiped that partition and did a clean install of Win7. (The computer's a few years old and Win7 has always worked best on this computer) Tried another recording, still having issues.

I get random skips and glitches in the recordings. In the past, I would have chalked that up to too slow a hard drive, but this machine (even when it had spinners) has never had an issue. It now has SSDs all around, so that can't be an issue. I've always had the ASIO and DVS settings at maximum latency and buffer sizes and my computer still has the same RAM it always had - 8gb, so I'm at a loss as to what is causing the problems.

It's skipping and glitching. I see no clocking errors in DC, the only warnings are Fanout detections, but I've always had those, and I'm still well under the max flows limitation.

The RIOs are on firmware 3.11 which I know is not the latest, but has been fine for the past years.
DVS is 3.10.1.1
Computer is a Lenovo ThinkPad W520 with 8gb ram, 3 Samsung 500gb EVO 850 SSDs (1 mSATA, 2 SATA), running Win 7 with all updates.

I need some help to figure out how to troubleshoot this issue. I'm pretty sure it's my computer as another person has been able to record clean multi-tracks on this system using the same version of DVS.

Thanks for any and all help!
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boburtz

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2017, 03:35:39 pm »

I need some help to figure out how to troubleshoot this issue. I'm pretty sure it's my computer as another person has been able to record clean multi-tracks on this system using the same version of DVS.

Thanks for any and all help!
Do you have the dpc latency checker? I would start there, it's an invaluable tool for rooting out  computer problems as they relate to DVS stability.
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David Sturzenbecher

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2017, 03:45:57 pm »

Have you followed all the suggestions here?

https://www.audinate.com/faq/how-can-i-tune-windows-pc-best-audio-performance

I had issues that were resolved with a LAN driver update.


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Andrew Broughton

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2017, 04:42:18 pm »

Do you have the dpc latency checker? I would start there, it's an invaluable tool for rooting out  computer problems as they relate to DVS stability.
Great tip. I forgot about that program.
Ran it and even though I'm not getting any Red bars, disabling my WiFi Driver definitely lowers the latency. My computer has a hardware switch to disable the WiFi and I thought that was enough (certainly helps when using DC) but even with the hardware switch off, disabling the driver in Device Manager lowers the latency further.
Even though I have the MS approved driver, I'll see if there's a later version from Intel.

Thanks!
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Andrew Broughton

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2017, 04:43:28 pm »

Have you followed all the suggestions here?

https://www.audinate.com/faq/how-can-i-tune-windows-pc-best-audio-performance

I had issues that were resolved with a LAN driver update.


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Thanks for that link. Looks like I already had done all the suggestions there except of course for running DPC.
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jabney (john abney)

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2017, 03:03:01 pm »

...recording multi-track (32 tracks) of 16 or 24 bit/48k audio using DVS...

This year, I cannot get a clean recording...

I need some help to figure out how to troubleshoot this issue. ...
We had some problems with Dante DVS, and it seems that one or more of the following work ... so far:

. 32 Dante channel limit (we had been using 64 Dante channel limit)
. Multicast for everything (wish Dante would make Multicast the default)
. Hardware Dante at 'both ends' (we added an Ashly digiMIX24 with a Brooklyn II card for monitoring the Dante signal, etc - we already had the Allen&Heath iLive 48 with its Brooklyn card)

best, john




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Ade Stuart

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2017, 06:10:54 pm »

If disabling WiFi hasn't worked have you checked the latency and clock histograms for each device.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLQDwDXXoxc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sgnx0-TwDjE

What is the full network setup?
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Andrew Broughton

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2017, 06:24:07 pm »

Thanks, Ade. My recording last night was better, but still not perfect. I'll try these logs while recording to see if they are showing errors.
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-Andy

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Andrew Broughton

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2017, 08:48:44 pm »

Ok, looks like the clock is fine, but latency is the problem. It's fine for up to a few minutes, then glitches with a 30-60ms delay. Sometimes a few in a row.
1st Latency pic is when not recording, 2nd is while recording.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2017, 05:05:01 pm by Andrew Broughton »
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Ade Stuart

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2017, 04:48:57 pm »

Ok, looks like the clock is fine, but latency is the problem. It's fine for up to a few minutes, then glitches with a 30-60ms delay. Sometimes a few in a row.

A few thoughts

Is dpclat always in the green, if not have you tried running dpclat whilst recording and monitoring latency and if so do you see any simultaneous spikes?

Are the hard drives RAID or JBOD?






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Andrew Broughton

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2017, 05:03:43 pm »

A few thoughts

Is dpclat always in the green, if not have you tried running dpclat whilst recording and monitoring latency and if so do you see any simultaneous spikes?
Yes, always green once I disable the WiFi driver, but I haven't run it while recording. As you can see, I get latency errors even when not recording showing up in DC.
Quote
Are the hard drives RAID or JBOD?
No, just independent drives, and as I mentioned, very high speed SSDs.

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-Andy

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Ade Stuart

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2017, 04:28:01 pm »

It may be worth getting in touch with Audinate, I found them very helpful with a DVS update problem I once had.

In the meantime, is dpclat green with DVS running?

These additional things may not help if dpclat is green but they've helped me to minimise latency;

In the BIOS disable C state control, speedstep and any peripherals that you do not need eg memory card readers, UMTS modems, serial ports etc.

In control panel disable all instances of Batteries - microsoft ACPI-Compliant Control Method Battery.

Double check that the Ethernet adaptor is running at 1Gb/s and change the ethernet cable... sorry a bit obvious I know but worth mentioning.

If you are running managed switches check the port statistics - if you have errors here can you post the network configuration and may be someone else can chime in.

Finally, Audinate used to advise against using Intel 82579 network adapter. I'm not sure if this is still the case, I've certainly used them successfully. Is this what your machine uses? You could try using a USB3 to GbE adapter.

Good Luck!
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Andrew Broughton

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2017, 07:17:51 pm »

Thanks Ade.
What's frustrating is this same machine had no issues with DVS until this year.


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Riley Casey

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2017, 07:31:41 pm »

My personal MacBook suddenly developed an aversion to running anything Dante related throwing up an error message when launching DVS  or controller. Apparently some process I now can't remember the name of was failing to launch even after multiple installs and restarts. Audinate support was not interested in pursuing any help beyond repeating the usual FAQ type solutions. I also had a second partition with a different OS version and the Dante apps ran fine on that.  Not sure if that sort of thing is an option on Winwdows but it seems like some bit of newly changed software on your machine is not feeling cooperative.

Justice C. Bigler

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2017, 03:05:24 pm »

I'm convinced that there is a fundamental problem with DVS.

I have had various things regarding latency happen with DVS that cause it to have recording issues that either produce glitches, or cause the CPU utilization to spike so high that it is unusable, or it just won't connect at all. This has happened across multiple platforms with multiple different operating systems over several years and different versions of DVS. The only solutions that I have found work thus far is to get a new computer. It seems that once DVS stops working on a system, it won't ever go back to working again.

Anything connected to the network through Dante hard interfaces works fine. DVS seems to be rather flaky.
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Andrew Broughton

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #15 on: April 22, 2017, 09:18:10 pm »

I would have disagreed up until this year. Before this I never really had any issues.
Now with the latest DVS (and even the previous version) I cannot get a glitch-free recording. I've got a clean Win 7 install, and using dpc I have tried disabling various devices. I thought at first it was the wifi driver, but in the end it doesn't make a difference. It still seems to be kinda random. I'll disable a device and test and it seems ok, then a few minutes into the recording, huge latency and another glitch. It's very slow going to diagnose this problem.

At the moment, DPC shows acceptable latency until I enable DVS. So now I'm trying various drivers for my network card. Pretty slow progress with driver changes, reboot, test, etc...

Currently waiting for more activation licenses since each activation uses up a license. Luckily Audinate have been great and quick with helping with the activations.

Not giving up just yet, but in the end I'll probably have to buy a new computer, as Justice says. Frustrating!
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-Andy

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Justice C. Bigler

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #16 on: April 22, 2017, 10:04:44 pm »

I've had issues with Windows 7, Windows 10, Max OSX 10.6.8 and now the newest 10.11.12 on my newest Mac Pro. Haven't had a chance to sit down and trouble shoot the Mac Pro yet. But it just stopped working. So far my Lenovo P50 laptop with Windows 10 Pro has stayed solid and continues to work.

My systems stay locked down with no system updates or software updates unless absolutely needed.

It is really frustrating as one day DVS will just up and decide to not work.
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boburtz

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #17 on: April 22, 2017, 11:54:57 pm »

At the moment, DPC shows acceptable latency until I enable DVS.

From what I understand, DPC latency checker's benefits can not be used while running programs of any kind, it's more for finding out what background processes are taking place while your machine is idle. 
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Andrew Broughton

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2017, 12:37:16 am »

From what I understand, DPC latency checker's benefits can not be used while running programs of any kind, it's more for finding out what background processes are taking place while your machine is idle.
Oh really? Well there's no issues at all in DPC until I run DVS, so how should I proceed to troubleshoot this?


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boburtz

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #19 on: April 23, 2017, 02:08:21 pm »

Oh really? Well there's no issues at all in DPC until I run DVS, so how should I proceed to troubleshoot this?


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From the DPC user guide: "Note that the Deferred Procedure Call concept exists in kernel mode only. Any user-mode code (Windows applications)
runs in the context of a thread. Threads are managed and scheduled for execution by the dispatcher"
If you are not seeing DPC latency spikes at idle, I would suggest that your dropout issue is not caused by DPC, but something else. I don't know which program you are using, but the one from Resplendence has a bit more detailed information than the one from Thesycon, which is very basic.
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Mike Ottinger

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Re: Help troubleshooting new DVS recording issues
« Reply #20 on: April 23, 2017, 02:47:50 pm »

Yes, always green once I disable the WiFi driver, but I haven't run it while recording. As you can see, I get latency errors even when not recording showing up in DC.No, just independent drives, and as I mentioned, very high speed SSDs.
I have been having the same issue, Just wandering if your laptop is a quad core i7? 
I have a T520 dual core with 16 gig of ram and 256 G SSD.  Also 7200 750 g drive in bay.  I have given up trying to record with DVS.  Same problem all is well then occasional glitches.

Mike
Pyramid Sound Works
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