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Author Topic: Setting channel gains on Yamaha MG24/14fx  (Read 230 times)

JonDunlap

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Setting channel gains on Yamaha MG24/14fx
« on: March 20, 2017, 03:58:56 pm »

I have a Yamaha MG24/14fx mixer. I'm trying to figure out how to properly set the channel gain levels. I got the basics of it but am uncertain where the fader needs to be when I start the process. Do I need to have it all the way down to the bottom or set at "0"
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Jean-Pierre Coetzee

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Re: Setting channel gains on Yamaha MG24/14fx
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2017, 04:40:06 pm »

Around these parts they will say close the gain, put the fader at 0 then slowly increase gain until the level at FOH is satisfactory.

This is a foolproof method and is the best way to do it. I don't do it this way and I need to live with that but I like to not have my faders all in a straight line on the mixing console since I want to be able to look down and see approximately where something is sitting in the mix.

The MG24/14fx has a nasty pre-amp that sounds horrible when run into clip(just like every Yamaha mixer I've worked on) keep it far from clip and you will be just fine. Keep in mind that the rest of the systems gain structure is just as important, you can do a search on the forums and you will find plenty of information on setting gain structure up in a system. If I'm correct there has even been an article or two on it on Prosoundweb.
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Stephen Kirby

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Re: Setting channel gains on Yamaha MG24/14fx
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2017, 07:14:58 pm »

Get the loudest input level you can, turn the gain up until the clip light flickers and then turn it down 10-15%  If you know it's a loud singer or the guitar player has a bunch of pedals than might get turned on at once, turn it down a bit more.

The input trim is to get a solid signal into the channel so as to keep the signal to noise reasonable.  After than, you mix with the faders.  That's what they're there for.  Never understood the practice of putting all the faders at 0 and mixing from the little knobs at the top.  Which also affects all your sends.

Now most folks will never make as much noise at soundcheck as they will while rocking out.  So you have to give yourself some headroom.  How much depends on experience with the board (if it has a nasty noticeiable clip then more headroom, if it clips gracefully you can get away with less).

And you may still need to adjust the trim when the singer goes for that really big note or the guitarist steps on the "pedal of doom" TM.
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Setting channel gains on Yamaha MG24/14fx
« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2017, 12:39:09 am »


The MG24/14fx has a nasty pre-amp that sounds horrible when run into clip(just like every Yamaha mixer I've worked on) keep it far from clip and you will be just fine. Keep in mind that the rest of the systems gain structure is just as important, you can do a search on the forums and you will find plenty of information on setting gain structure up in a system. If I'm correct there has even been an article or two on it on Prosoundweb.

I got my mix spanked by treating a PM2000 like it was something British.  It's been a long time but I kind of recall it took at least -6dB at the inputs and -3dB on the submasters to make clean audio.  I was happy after I stopped beating my console... ;)
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Gordon Brinton

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Re: Setting channel gains on Yamaha MG24/14fx
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2017, 08:41:32 am »

I have a Yamaha MG24/14fx mixer. I'm trying to figure out how to properly set the channel gain levels. I got the basics of it but am uncertain where the fader needs to be when I start the process. Do I need to have it all the way down to the bottom or set at "0"

I always start with mine set all the way down. But allow me to elaborate on this more.

Input Gain should be thought of as a tool to correct a problem. It can boost an incoming signal that is too weak to adequately drive the rest of the system and/or provide a healthy signal-to-noise ratio. Many microphones provide a very weak signal and need boosting. Some sources provide a very strong signal and need reducing (Padded). If the signal is too weak, you may be adding hiss to the audio due to the noise floor being amplified along with the signal. If the signal is too strong, it can easily become heavily distorted which sounds ugly.

You should use the gain knob to adjust the incoming level accordingly. Think of it as a mini amplifier which can boost a weak signal. Only add as much as is necessary to create a proper, usable, and optimal signal level for the rest of the channel strip and system processing. How do you know how much is enough? ...By making use of PFL meters.


Speaking of meters...here is how to best understand analog meters.

The 0 dBu reading indicates the level where signal-to-noise ratio is at its optimum. It is the loudest it can go without adding any noticeable distortion. As you increase level beyond 0 dBu, distortion is gradually being added to the signal. By the time the level hits the peak indicator, distortion is at its maximum and most noticeable. If the signal remains consistently below the 0 dBu, then later in the system, you may be amplifying the noise floor (hiss) unnecessarily. Thus, 0 dBu is your target.


The procedure to set gain should be as follows...

- Turn down the faders and any Aux sends. Also turn the Effects switches to Off.
- Turn on PFL and watch the 3rd meter.
- With incoming signal, increase gain until the signal frequently bounces around the 0dBu mark. It is OK if the signal occasionally goes above 0 dBu as long as it does not hit peak very often.
- Gain should be left alone for the remainder of performance unless the source level changes a lot and needs correcting.
- Set faders to desired level for the room.
- Lastly, set Aux Sends to desired level.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2017, 08:47:21 am by Gordon Brinton »
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Jean-Pierre Coetzee

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Re: Setting channel gains on Yamaha MG24/14fx
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2017, 10:58:35 am »

Using your method I would want to make sure there is between 15 and 20 dB of headroom between my current level and clip other than that this is pretty much the method I use.
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Gordon Brinton

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Re: Setting channel gains on Yamaha MG24/14fx
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2017, 01:37:57 pm »

Using your method I would want to make sure there is between 15 and 20 dB of headroom between my current level and clip other than that this is pretty much the method I use.

If I am understanding your point correctly, there is 30 dBu between unity and clip, which should be, what, roughly 18 dBfs? I found this graph in the MG24/14fx manual.

I don't know why the meter is marked as -20 to +5. Maybe it is calibrated that way.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2017, 01:59:17 pm by Gordon Brinton »
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Jean-Pierre Coetzee

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Re: Setting channel gains on Yamaha MG24/14fx
« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2017, 01:56:00 pm »

If I am understanding your point correctly, there is 30 dBu between unity and clip, which should be, what, roughly 18 dB? I found this graph in the MG24/14fx manual.

I don't know why the meter is marked as -20 to +5. Maybe it is calibrated that way.

On the MG24 just set it so that the level is around about the 0 mark. There is 15 dB between the +5 mark and the clip light at least so don't worry about that too much.
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"If you want "loud", then run a piece of sheet metal through a table saw------

If you want "watts"-then plug in a toaster"
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