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[Callan Browne]

I've got a couple of outdoor shows coming up next month, which will be my first show with my new subs (SRX818SP X2)
The shows are car show 'n shine style events.
Here's a pic of the bigger venue:

full size
I believe we'll be set up near the marquee's you can just see at the back of this photo.

I don't expect to cover this area with my rig at rock concert levels, that's not that idea, we are pretty much background music, except for down the front.
I'll get my mains (VP 15" DPC x2) up as high as I safely can and hope to cover at least the front area as best I can.
Maybe also put the subs together on one side.

Music style is rock/pop covers, Beatles, Stones, INXS, U2, kinda thing.

Our bass player is always tuned to E (~41hz) so I was thinking of putting a hi pass filter on the subs around the same place - the idea being to ask less of my undersized rig.
I haven't yet looked for this in audio architect, but I thought I could apply this in the output eq of the x32.
Does anybody else do this?
I've seen Ivan mention something similar before on passive setups, setting the low cut in the DSP.

So my question, is this a good idea and what values would you recommend?
My starting point might be: Low cut, 40hz, -6db.
I can't seem to change slope in X32edit although I can add a second identical filter, which changes the on screen display. I've no idea if this impacts the sound in a negative way (phase etc.)

thanks!

[Paul G. OBrien]

I don't see why it would be necessary, just run the system the way you usually do and don't push it harder just because it doesn't sound as loud as it does inside.

[Ivan Beaver]

A high pass filter should be used on EVERY speaker-no matter the type.  At least in my opinion.

There is often a lot more going on than just the lowest note of the bass guitar.

I had a football stadium that actually launched the voice coils of the subs right through the dust caps!!!!!!!!

And this was when the choir was singing acapella.

HOW?  Well the contractor was using large amps-bridged.

They did not have any limiters set-no high pass on the subs.

The mics on the choir were condensers, with no windscreen (outside) and no highpass on the choir channels.

So the wind blew and "pop" went the subs.

The main reason for using high pass filters is to keep the unwanted signals (that can come from many different places) from causing excess strain on the drivers.

When you get below the tuning of the cabinets, the drivers will "flop around" and tear themselves up-even if the power (voltage) is below ratings.

[Callan Browne]

A high pass filter should be used on EVERY speaker-no matter the type.  At least in my opinion.

There is often a lot more going on than just the lowest note of the bass guitar.

I had a football stadium that actually launched the voice coils of the subs right through the dust caps!!!!!!!!

And this was when the choir was singing acapella.

HOW?  Well the contractor was using large amps-bridged.

They did not have any limiters set-no high pass on the subs.

The mics on the choir were condensers, with no windscreen (outside) and no highpass on the choir channels.

So the wind blew and "pop" went the subs.

The main reason for using high pass filters is to keep the unwanted signals (that can come from many different places) from causing excess strain on the drivers.

When you get below the tuning of the cabinets, the drivers will "flop around" and tear themselves up-even if the power (voltage) is below ratings.

 Thanks Ivan,
Any recommendations where to set the high pass in my case?
Do I match it to the expected program material, or to the subs capability?
If I can find a high pass in the dsp, would there be a preferred slope to set?

[Ivan Beaver]

 Thanks Ivan,
Any recommendations where to set the high pass in my case?
Do I match it to the expected program material, or to the subs capability?
If I can find a high pass in the dsp, would there be a preferred slope to set?

I would not go lower than the manufacturer recommended setting.

I like 24dB Butterworth for high pass (low cut) filters on subs.

[Paul G. OBrien]

Ivan.. these are powered boxes with a shit ton of built-in DSP, there is no way there isn't a user non-defeatable low/cut filter already implemented.

[Callan Browne]

I would not go lower than the manufacturer recommended setting.

I like 24dB Butterworth for high pass (low cut) filters on subs.

I only have the choice of 6db in my DSP, which I just opened up.
Would putting 4 X 6db BW filters on be the same as a single 24db filter?


Thanks Paul - Yep, I'm not trying to bypass that in anyway, just exploring if I should try and set it any higher to only 'ask' my subs to produce what is relevant for these specific gigs.

[Ivan Beaver]

I only have the choice of 6db in my DSP, which I just opened up.
Would putting 4 X 6db BW filters on be the same as a single 24db filter?


Thanks Paul - Yep, I'm not trying to bypass that in anyway, just exploring if I should try and set it any higher to only 'ask' my subs to produce what is relevant for these specific gigs.

I would suspect that the internal HP would work fine.

But if it makes you "feel better", then use a single HP filter.

I find it "odd" that there is only a 1st order HP filter (6dB), but you can cascade several together.

But it never amazes me what some software people put in our devices.

[Chris Grimshaw]

Don't stack the 6dB/octave filters unless you have to.
Butterworth filters are defined by their -3dB point, and slope. If you set the first filter (6dB/octave is generally taken as Butterworth) for -3dB at 40Hz, and then put another there at the same frequency, you're 6dB down at 40Hz, with a 12dB/octave slope. That's a 2nd-order Linkwitz-Riley.

Butterworth filters are the ones to have for subs - they leave bass extension in place as much as possible, while steeply cutting below. Filters with a softer knee (Linkwitz-Riley, Bessel, etc) will take a couple of dB off the useful bottom end of the subs.
A powered box should be absolutely fine. I generally set highpass filters on everything I can, set just below the bottom note on the instrument. Headroom is good, more is better.

Ivan, coils getting through cones is a failure mode I haven't seen before! Got any pics?

Chris

[Ivan Beaver]

D
Ivan, coils getting through cones is a failure mode I haven't seen before! Got any pics?

Chris

This was several years ago, I may have some photos somewhere, I would have to look around.

Yes the coils flew right through the dust caps.

It was quite the sight.

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