Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Dan Richardson]

Several replies to my statement "On the original TM16, with the gains at noon, the available +15 dB digital gain is not enough gain for a typical vocal."

Regardless if 15dB is or not...The point was that if the gains were bumped/changed, just go back to your prescribed place.

and

I would have thought that once you had set the actual gain control to a ballpark position, +/-15dB would be more than enough.

This was a response to leaving the gains at the easily-recalled noon position. With log pots up at 2 o'clock, the prescribed place is very difficult to repeat. Hence the suggestion to set them at noon and use digital makeup. Unfortunately there's not enough to make it work.

[Dan Richardson]

Mixed on my original TM16 again over the weekend, and remembered a few other things.

The parametric bands only go up to Q4. It's a blunt instrument.

There are only graphics on the outputs, no parametrics, and the graphic EQ is broken up into 4 non-scrolling windows.

[kel mcguire]

Exactly. Why automate everything in the signal
path and leave out the first...and the one that affects ALL other downstream functions? It's not logical. I can adjust all other functions from a tablet...but to set the input..I have to go to the board. Not to mention many musicians habit of having a soundcheck level..then another level fir the show. This whole thing might work for a self mixing band..but it could never replace say an X32 on a hired gig.

What if the software +/- 15dB is just after the physical input gain (before the rest of the channel)would that not in essence be a similar solution if you started out not at the board for the first song? Also, I just don't see bands coming out even near 10dB hotter than soundcheck.

so, you're saying for a hired gig, recallable input gains are a must and this is really best for a band that needs 24 inputs yet mixes from the stage only? OK. How many hired concerts and video productions have I mixed on a Presonus SL2442 without recallable input gains? Anyone else?

[kel mcguire]

Several replies to my statement "On the original TM16, with the gains at noon, the available +15 dB digital gain is not enough gain for a typical vocal."

and

This was a response to leaving the gains at the easily-recalled noon position. With log pots up at 2 o'clock, the prescribed place is very difficult to repeat. Hence the suggestion to set them at noon and use digital makeup. Unfortunately there's not enough to make it work.

Doesn't the TM30pro have linear pots?

[kel mcguire]

Mixed on my original TM16 again over the weekend, and remembered a few other things.

The parametric bands only go up to Q4. It's a blunt instrument.

There are only graphics on the outputs, no parametrics, and the graphic EQ is broken up into 4 non-scrolling windows.

It looks like the 30pro has 6 band para EQ on every output. The graphic seems to fit on a single window too. Not sure of the Q but I'd call a Q of 4 far less than blunt. Along with graphic EQs it also has assignable ultra narrow feedback notch filters. It remains to be seen how well those perform.

[Dan Richardson]

Doesn't the TM30pro have linear pots?

Quoting myself, yet again, "On the original TM16..."

I have no experience with the pro. I'm posting about what a total disappointment I found their last mixer to be.

[John Chiara]

so, you're saying for a hired gig, recallable input gains are a must and this is really best for a band that needs 24 inputs yet mixes from the stage only? OK. How many hired concerts and video productions have I mixed on a Presonus SL2442 without recallable input gains? Anyone else?

You may have...I have not. Here's a 'typical' scenario. The venue I work at has an X32 at FOH. The stage is 80' away. I usually set gains from on stage as time is usually limited..and I can check connections, monitors  and input gains as quickly as possible. With a Touchmix at FOH I couldn't do this. Deal breaker. This whole concept was one of the reasons I bought an X 32 over 3 years ago as opposed to another offering. If it's 'tablet controlled' it needs to be just that for all functions. It's this assumption that has so many of us scratching our heads. Why would you design it that way...unless no SL user ever expressed a negative reaction to this omission. 😇

[Steve M Smith]

This was a response to leaving the gains at the easily-recalled noon position. With log pots up at 2 o'clock, the prescribed place is very difficult to repeat. Hence the suggestion to set them at noon and use digital makeup. Unfortunately there's not enough to make it work.

My response was not about leaving the gains at 12:00 but was to set the gains properly then use the trims for what they were intended for - slight adjustments.  It's not going to vary from the initial sound/line check by too much.

OK. How many hired concerts and video productions have I mixed on a Presonus SL2442 without recallable input gains? Anyone else?

How many such shows has anyone done with an analogue mixer without anything recallable? - Many!



Steve.

[Scott Bolt]

My response was not about leaving the gains at 12:00 but was to set the gains properly then use the trims for what they were intended for - slight adjustments.  It's not going to vary from the initial sound/line check by too much.

How many such shows has anyone done with an analogue mixer without anything recallable? - Many!



Steve.

The use case that bugs me is that when the mixer is transported, the knobs can be moved.

I suppose one could glue them into position so that wouldn't happen, but it just seems odd in this day and age to have any non-digital pot for gain control.

[Dan Richardson]

My response was not about leaving the gains at 12:00 but was to set the gains properly then use the trims for what they were intended for - slight adjustments.  It's not going to vary from the initial sound/line check by too much.

Unless, of course, there's more than one band.

People have been doing this with analog mixers forever, of course. However, most analog mixers use log pots for trim, and are designed such that appropriate gain for a vocal puts the trim somewhere between 10 o'clock and noon, where the pot has way more resolution, and the position is less touchy. Which brings us back to my original contention. QSC screwed up the gain structure on the original TouchMix.

[ProSoundWeb Community]