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Author Topic: Business Minded Questions  (Read 21159 times)

Matthias McCready

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Re: Business Minded Questions
« Reply #250 on: October 12, 2017, 09:28:31 pm »

if your clients are happy paying the price they're paying, there's no reason to reduce the price to current clients provided they're satisfied with the service.

While I am new to the audio industry from a business perspective I completely agree with this. To the point there will be clients who will want to spend a lot and clients who are more frugal, and price should be given accordingly (within reason). Example: You are contacted by a company for a corporate gig and you are thinking $5k for the project, before you even state anything they want to give you $8k for the project, for a more professional experience you are offering them the service they want at the price they are willing to pay. Maybe you add in some additional addons they did not expect and really go the extra mile.

On the flip side there are those potential clients who are more "involved" wanting to know every single minute detail, and what each detail will cost; trying to get a deal wherever possible and at some point you can graciously say, "I feel like you may want to do this yourself, you can rent gear from 'X,'" or, "I might be above your price range," while letting them know that you will be there if they need anything. In the end there is a good chance they might not be able to do it themselves, or the cheaper competition is not quite all that it was was stated to be. A lot of clients will fall somewhere in the middle.

This may have been discussed already (I read the whole thread at some point) but take as long as you can before you get to the topic of money. Tell them you will provide what no one else can, tell them all the special things you are going to do for them, their event will be custom (this is how pricing can be different from client to client), and entice them, if you will, into your services. This is building that customer-client connection. With this you are no longer just some random company throwing them a quote you are a helpful adviser offering a service that they want. Isn't this part of why we make gear decisions? We want a feature and we want a name, would you rather buy a cheaper Behringer X32 or a Midas M32, and those two consoles are almost identical!

Matthias
« Last Edit: October 12, 2017, 09:30:39 pm by Matthias McCready »
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Ray Aberle

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Re: Business Minded Questions
« Reply #251 on: October 12, 2017, 09:49:35 pm »

Ooooh, Yeahhhhhh. Ummm, I'm gonna have to go ahead.... and sorta.... "disagree" with you here. ["He's been real flakey lately. And I'm just not sure he's the caliber person we want for upper management. He's also been having some problems with his TPS reports."]

You have a price list, and that's what it costs YOU to do a job. Maybe that's more than what the client wants to pay. Maybe that's less. But it's what YOU charge to provide whatever service they're asking for. As soon as you get into the game of "Hmmm, this client can pay more, so let's screw them over," then you have to keep multiple price lists for clients, AND pray to god they don't talk to each other. Because as soon as Client A talks to Client B, and finds out Client B is paying 15% less than Client A, they're going to be rightfully pissed off at you.

[That being said, everything goes out the window with political campaigns. They're going to call you 24-48 hours before a show and expect full service production. ABSOLUTELY there's going to be a PITA tax / Rush Production Charge involved.]

Now, something else: Sometimes you have an annoying client, and you decide to raise rates with them until it's either worth it dealing with their bullshit, or they look for a new provider. So you might be thinking to yourself that "Technically" you're charging them something different than another client-- but be realistic. The extra charges are indeed "production management" charges.

Just be careful if you choose to have different rates for different clients.

-Ray
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Business Minded Questions
« Reply #252 on: October 12, 2017, 11:49:09 pm »

Never mind.  This deserves a better response than I've been writing...
« Last Edit: October 13, 2017, 12:01:57 am by Tim McCulloch »
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"Practicing an art, no matter how well or badly, is a way to make your soul grow, for heaven's sake. Sing in the shower. Dance to the radio. Tell stories. Write a poem to a friend, even a lousy poem. Do it as well as you possible can. You will get an enormous reward. You will have created something."  - Kurt Vonnegut

Matthias McCready

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Re: Business Minded Questions
« Reply #253 on: October 13, 2017, 12:26:18 am »

Ooooh, Yeahhhhhh. Ummm, I'm gonna have to go ahead.... and sorta.... "disagree" with you here. ["He's been real flakey lately. And I'm just not sure he's the caliber person we want for upper management. He's also been having some problems with his TPS reports."]

You have a price list, and that's what it costs YOU to do a job. Maybe that's more than what the client wants to pay. Maybe that's less. But it's what YOU charge to provide whatever service they're asking for. As soon as you get into the game of "Hmmm, this client can pay more, so let's screw them over," then you have to keep multiple price lists for clients, AND pray to god they don't talk to each other. Because as soon as Client A talks to Client B, and finds out Client B is paying 15% less than Client A, they're going to be rightfully pissed off at you.

[That being said, everything goes out the window with political campaigns. They're going to call you 24-48 hours before a show and expect full service production. ABSOLUTELY there's going to be a PITA tax / Rush Production Charge involved.]

Now, something else: Sometimes you have an annoying client, and you decide to raise rates with them until it's either worth it dealing with their bullshit, or they look for a new provider. So you might be thinking to yourself that "Technically" you're charging them something different than another client-- but be realistic. The extra charges are indeed "production management" charges.

Just be careful if you choose to have different rates for different clients.

-Ray

Nice Office Space quote (my favorite movie).  ;D To note I was not advocating for arbitrary pricing based on how much money you think you can stiff someone for, I agree you charge what you need to charge. What I was attempting to communicate was that different clients will have different needs (some would want extras and some would not) the approach needs to be different based on the client. While good service should be provided at all levels, there are at times higher expectations with different levels of service. One has different expectations from Wendy's, to Red Robins, and to Fogo De Chao, both from the perspective of the server and the customer. All of these jobs should be done with a smile and to satisfy, the manner in which things are presented is however different and entirely dependent on the circumstance. I will again state I am new to the audio business, that knowledge is from other trades so perhaps it worthless and does indeed not apply in any form here. If my comments are deemed unhelpful for this discussion I will take this as a learning experience and redact them. I am here to learn as well and I did not mean to overstep myself.

Matthias
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Ray Aberle

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Re: Business Minded Questions
« Reply #254 on: October 13, 2017, 01:03:45 am »

I agree in that there are different expectations from Wendy's, Red Robin, and (whatever that last one you wrote is) -- HOWEVER, your original point appeared to be that (to use your analogy) Red Robin will charge a poor person less than a wealthy one, since the wealthy person can afford more. Yes, there are different expectations between the different brands, but at the same time, they're different brands! Each brand offers different quality and value. So, for your analogy to fit, a production company would have several brands, each one offering varying quality and value based on how much the customer is willing to spend.

I hope that this makes sense!

You're correct in that different clients have different needs, and the approach does vary, but the pricing structure (from one brand) should be the same. Maybe Client A orders a video wall, and Client B orders a 12k projector -- they're getting the same great service, but one is getting a higher level of equipment than the other, so they're naturally going to pay more.

-Ray

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Scott Holtzman

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Re: Business Minded Questions
« Reply #255 on: October 13, 2017, 01:06:29 am »

I agree in that there are different expectations from Wendy's, Red Robin, and (whatever that last one you wrote is) -- HOWEVER, your original point appeared to be that (to use your analogy) Red Robin will charge a poor person less than a wealthy one, since the wealthy person can afford more. Yes, there are different expectations between the different brands, but at the same time, they're different brands! Each brand offers different quality and value. So, for your analogy to fit, a production company would have several brands, each one offering varying quality and value based on how much the customer is willing to spend.



I think to use the food service analogy with Matthias you have one restaurant with three menus, the same staff and the same ingredients.

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Scott AKA "Skyking" Holtzman
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Matthias McCready

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Re: Business Minded Questions
« Reply #256 on: October 13, 2017, 01:20:50 am »

I agree in that there are different expectations from Wendy's, Red Robin, and (whatever that last one you wrote is) -- HOWEVER, your original point appeared to be that (to use your analogy) Red Robin will charge a poor person less than a wealthy one, since the wealthy person can afford more. Yes, there are different expectations between the different brands, but at the same time, they're different brands! Each brand offers different quality and value. So, for your analogy to fit, a production company would have several brands, each one offering varying quality and value based on how much the customer is willing to spend.

I hope that this makes sense!

You're correct in that different clients have different needs, and the approach does vary, but the pricing structure (from one brand) should be the same. Maybe Client A orders a video wall, and Client B orders a 12k projector -- they're getting the same great service, but one is getting a higher level of equipment than the other, so they're naturally going to pay more.

-Ray

The last restaurant was one of the more expensive ones I could think of that was also a chain  ;) My apologies I stated my position poorly in the first post. Perhaps with the analogy to think that Dj's, small productions, and large productions are very different dynamics, it is unlikely a company does all three or even two. Although within each of those categories things could be done well or poorly. Ray I think you stated my point better than me...Anyways I will be done before I miscommunicate anymore.  :-X All of you have much more experience.

Ray, Tim, and Scott I do want to thank you so much for your posts I have learned a lot (obviously there is much more for me to learn!) I appreciate your posts and the thought and time that goes into them. This is a great thread too (Thanks Nathan!)  I will go back to my observations now  :)

Matthias
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Chris Hindle

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Re: Business Minded Questions
« Reply #257 on: October 13, 2017, 07:55:01 am »

.. Perhaps with the analogy to think that Dj's, small productions, and large productions are very different dynamics, it is unlikely a company does all three or even two.
ummm. i know many companies that do all three, and do them VERY well.
One started as a DJ when he was in high school. A classmate of mine.
He is now multi-national.
Chris.
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scottstephens

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Re: Business Minded Questions
« Reply #258 on: October 13, 2017, 09:58:06 am »

Ooooh, Yeahhhhhh. Ummm, I'm gonna have to go ahead.... and sorta.... "disagree" with you here. ["He's been real flakey lately. And I'm just not sure he's the caliber person we want for upper management. He's also been having some problems with his TPS reports."]

Right on Ray. Good luck with your Layoffs. I'm going to go watch  Kung Foo.

Scott

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