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Author Topic: Waves SoundGrid vs. UAD Realtime Rack on Soundcraft Vi3000  (Read 7303 times)

Zach Brown

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Waves SoundGrid vs. UAD Realtime Rack on Soundcraft Vi3000
« on: February 05, 2016, 05:34:45 PM »

Hi everyone,

Looking at  at the Soundcraft Vi3000 console for FOH needs, and utilizing MADI for low latency plugin integration.

The top two contenders are the Waves SoundGrid Server solution, vs. the Soundcraft marketed UAD Realtime Rack Core unit that is sold as a tightly integrated solution.

The costs are similar for the two routes (UAD Core vs. SoundGrid Server One).

Surprisingly, unless I'm missing something, the capabilities of the two systems don't appear to be close.  The Waves platform appears to stand head and shoulders above the UAD option, unless I've misunderstood what they can each do.

See if I understand this correctly...

The UAD rack handles 16 channels of MADI (meaning, it can insert plugins on 16 channels/groups) and can run any of the 74 compatible UAD plugins.  however, the "Core" package only includes 14 plugins to start with, which are all "Legacy" versions anyways.

Unless there's a limitation to the MADI output of the Vi3000, the SoundGrid Server (via the MGO interface) can handle 128 channels of MADI and advertises more DSP.  Meaning, I could slam an insert on every channel on the console, plus busses, and have more actual DSP at my disposal, all at the same or less latency as the UAD Realtime Rack Core.  Plus, any Waves SoundGrid compatible plugin would be at my fingertips.

Is this correct?  If so, how the heck are they selling any of the UAD Realtime Rack units?

Thanks for your help!
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Mac Kerr

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Posting Rules
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2016, 06:04:27 PM »

Thanks for your help!

Please go to your profile and change the "Name" field to your real first and last name as required by the posting rules displayed in the header at the top of the section, and in the Site Rules and Suggestions in the Forum Announcements section, and on the registration page when you registered.

Mac
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Zach Brown

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Re: Posting Rules
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2016, 07:03:52 PM »

Please go to your profile and change the "Name" field to your real first and last name as required by the posting rules displayed in the header at the top of the section, and in the Site Rules and Suggestions in the Forum Announcements section, and on the registration page when you registered.

Mac

Thanks, and sorry for the mistake.
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Aaron Glas

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Re: Waves SoundGrid vs. UAD Realtime Rack on Soundcraft Vi3000
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2016, 10:24:32 PM »

I've toured with a Vi3000 plus a Real Time Rack with great success. Yes, it only does 16 channels. However, the plugins sound fantastic and if you set yourself up with a touch screen, it's easy to use.
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Ray Aberle

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Re: Waves SoundGrid vs. UAD Realtime Rack on Soundcraft Vi3000
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2016, 10:42:03 PM »

I've toured with a Vi3000 plus a Real Time Rack with great success. Yes, it only does 16 channels. However, the plugins sound fantastic and if you set yourself up with a touch screen, it's easy to use.

Hey there,

Like Mac asked of Mr. Brown, per the Rules of Participation here on the ProSoundWeb, please jump back into your profile and update your Display name to reflect your Real, Full Name.

Thanks!

-Ray
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Steve Payne

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Re: Waves SoundGrid vs. UAD Realtime Rack on Soundcraft Vi3000
« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2016, 04:18:31 PM »

Hi everyone,

Looking at  at the Soundcraft Vi3000 console for FOH needs, and utilizing MADI for low latency plugin integration.

The top two contenders are the Waves SoundGrid Server solution, vs. the Soundcraft marketed UAD Realtime Rack Core unit that is sold as a tightly integrated solution.

The costs are similar for the two routes (UAD Core vs. SoundGrid Server One).

Surprisingly, unless I'm missing something, the capabilities of the two systems don't appear to be close.  The Waves platform appears to stand head and shoulders above the UAD option, unless I've misunderstood what they can each do.

See if I understand this correctly...

The UAD rack handles 16 channels of MADI (meaning, it can insert plugins on 16 channels/groups) and can run any of the 74 compatible UAD plugins.  however, the "Core" package only includes 14 plugins to start with, which are all "Legacy" versions anyways.

Unless there's a limitation to the MADI output of the Vi3000, the SoundGrid Server (via the MGO interface) can handle 128 channels of MADI and advertises more DSP.  Meaning, I could slam an insert on every channel on the console, plus busses, and have more actual DSP at my disposal, all at the same or less latency as the UAD Realtime Rack Core.  Plus, any Waves SoundGrid compatible plugin would be at my fingertips.

Is this correct?  If so, how the heck are they selling any of the UAD Realtime Rack units?

Thanks for your help!

Hi Zach,
  We run waves plugins on an SC48 and UAD plugins via Real Time Rack on a Vi5000.
  I think you are looking at the raw numbers and missing the nuances that set these two systems apart.  Raw numbers rarely paint the whole or accurate picture.
  Wave plug ins are the most common and familiar in the live arena.  If you are looking to add this specific capability to a Vi console, then Soundgrid is the answer.  Problem solved.  End of discussion.
  If you are looking to add the best plug in solution to a Vi, then there is more to consider.
  The Vi system is a very  good sounding console.  The cannel strip eq, comps and gates are all very powerful and musical.  The Lexicon effects are just that,  high end Lexicon effects.  Plus 8 channels of insertable BSS901 frequency agile compression.  It all adds up to a very capable good sounding console that is perfectly happy without the need for plugins to make it a usable system.  With Vi’s, plugins are not a necessity, they are the icing on the cake.  Hence,  UAD vs Waves.
  UAD offers extremely accurate, realistic emulations of classic analog processing.  When you have a console that has everything on board that you need to do a superior  job, do you really need 128 inserts on every channel and buss?  Why would you want to do that?  We use the UADs on the money channel, drum busses, bass comp…you know, special stuff.  We have yet to feel that 16 channels of special inserts was not more than enough.
  Also, the Real Time Rack integration and interface with touch screen control is seamless.  Extremely well done.  All plug ins and parameters are stored in console show files and presets and instantly recalled.
  On the negative side of UAD, the Realtime Rack will only run 74 compatable plugins.  Practically speaking, this is not much of an issue, but it is frustrating to look at new, latest, greatest plugins being released and not be able to run them.  I have been after Soundcraft for a while about this, but I believe it is out of their hands and it is what it is.  That’s a bummer.
  All in all, if I were to choose a plugin system for the Vi again I would do exactly the same thing.  I would run UADs on the Real Time Rack.
  I hope that added some perspective.
All the best.
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Steve Payne
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Keith Erickson

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Re: Waves SoundGrid vs. UAD Realtime Rack on Soundcraft Vi3000
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2016, 04:27:20 PM »

Hi everyone,

Looking at  at the Soundcraft Vi3000 console for FOH needs, and utilizing MADI for low latency plugin integration.

The top two contenders are the Waves SoundGrid Server solution, vs. the Soundcraft marketed UAD Realtime Rack Core unit that is sold as a tightly integrated solution.

The costs are similar for the two routes (UAD Core vs. SoundGrid Server One).

Surprisingly, unless I'm missing something, the capabilities of the two systems don't appear to be close.  The Waves platform appears to stand head and shoulders above the UAD option, unless I've misunderstood what they can each do.

See if I understand this correctly...

The UAD rack handles 16 channels of MADI (meaning, it can insert plugins on 16 channels/groups) and can run any of the 74 compatible UAD plugins.  however, the "Core" package only includes 14 plugins to start with, which are all "Legacy" versions anyways.

Unless there's a limitation to the MADI output of the Vi3000, the SoundGrid Server (via the MGO interface) can handle 128 channels of MADI and advertises more DSP.  Meaning, I could slam an insert on every channel on the console, plus busses, and have more actual DSP at my disposal, all at the same or less latency as the UAD Realtime Rack Core.  Plus, any Waves SoundGrid compatible plugin would be at my fingertips.

Is this correct?  If so, how the heck are they selling any of the UAD Realtime Rack units?

Thanks for your help!

It should also be noted that you can stack RTR units if you wish....this can get you up to 64 channels.
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Steve Payne

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Re: Waves SoundGrid vs. UAD Realtime Rack on Soundcraft Vi3000
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2016, 04:55:56 PM »

It should also be noted that you can stack RTR units if you wish....this can get you up to 64 channels.

Absolutely correct.  Obviously, this solution could become costly.
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Steve Payne
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Waves SoundGrid vs. UAD Realtime Rack on Soundcraft Vi3000
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2016, 04:55:56 PM »


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