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Author Topic: Large Outdoor Events  (Read 17347 times)

Mark Cadwallader

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #20 on: July 04, 2015, 06:06:28 PM »

Do you guys have suggestions/preferences on where I could find the properly rated cord?

Jake, besides your favorite big box home-fixup store, 10/3 SOOW cable is available at electrical supply dealers. Don't get the SJOW cable - it is not as heavy duty. You will also need to get the appropriate ends - the "plugs" to go on the ends of the cable. Leviton and Hubbell are two well-know brands. Get the industrial duty version; most commonly found as a black and white combination of the various plug body parts. You need a NEMA 5-20P (the male plug) and the matching NEMA 5-20C (the female connector) end. The 5-20 ends look a lot like standard "Edison" ends used on household extension cords, but one of the flat male blades is at a right angle to the other. The female end will accept 5-20 or 5-15 plugs.

If NEMA wire device naming conventions are a mystery to you, it is worth a few minutes to study the charts. It will make following some of the threads here a bit easier.
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TJ (Tom) Cornish

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #21 on: July 05, 2015, 08:20:25 AM »

Hi Jake. I wanted to give you some kudos for asking the right questions and desiring to learn. A few thoughts or clarifications for you:

- As was mentioned somewhere, it doesn't really matter what the lights on your Driverack do if you can run your amps up to clipping. That means you can access all the power you have.

- You may be able to get a little more out of your system by optimizing speaker settings; especially by making sure your crossover point is in a reasonable place and that you're not trying to playback lower frequencies than your gear can handle.

Your best investment will probably be to invest in a couple hours of someone's time to help you setup your Driverack for your system. You will learn a few things and you will know what your system can do. From there you can decide if it is adequate for your needs, or if it's time for an upgrade. If you post your location, someone may be willing to help get you started for a few bucks, or maybe on a slow day, a few beers.
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William Schnake

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #22 on: July 05, 2015, 01:05:19 PM »

I think you're on the right track in seeking to understand proper gain staging and amp to speaker power levels.  If it's working for you now, ask your questions regarding system configuration and operation. 

Don't go ditching what's working for you ...

I agree with what Dick says here.  Make sure that you are getting the most out of what you have.  Going forward decide where you want to end up not that I just want a specific piece of equipment.  I plan my purchases in the larger sense over a 5 year window, and then as times and equipment needs change, I adapt to what makes the most sense for me.

Think in terms of system not collection of gear that may or may not work together.  For me this keeps me from purchasing and then having to repurchase gear all of the time.  Everything we purchase can also be used with one of our smaller systems.

Bill
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Jake Bekkerus

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #23 on: July 05, 2015, 02:39:33 PM »

Hello All,

I have looked into purchasing the power cord, and will be making that investment.

I agree that I need alot more experience unlocking and understanding all of the features that the DRPA2 has to offer. Not just for this set up but for any others that I may choose to expand to in the future. I am in San Marcos, TX which is right in the middle of Austin and San Antonio if any of you are floating around this area. I would definitely be interested in meeting up to go over everything!

Scott, this is a non profit event. Usually the closest thing to a stage they have is a trailer pulled to the middle of the field. A couple of the events have tried to convince me to set up there, but for logistical reasons I continue to convince them that setting up on the side of the field makes more sense. My mic is of pretty good quality, but only because I had a cheaper one that kept cutting off on the town's mayor...talk about lesson learned the hard way. So it has actually been able to span the whole football field and beyond with no problem.

Mike, the amps are set to full range, and I am using the DRPA2's cross overs. I am not 100% sure what they are currently set to. This years relay season is over, so I haven't pulled it out to look at it for awhile. I know it is set to whatever the automatic wizard set it to.

As far as a 5 year plan goes... I would like to expand my capabilities. I would like to figure out how to squeeze the most out of the system I have for now. I might even try to keep it for another couple of gigs. That would eventually be enough to cover my investment so if I sold pieces of it they would be for profit for the new system. Long term though I would like to learn what I need to be looking for in a more efficient system as I continue to do these large events. While I know I won't be putting on full on stadium rock concerts, I would like to get to a point where I am not having to turn as many jobs down. Somewhere down the line I would also like to be able to incorporate small live acts. I would also like to have a more versatile system, I would like to not feel like I have to drag everything out for every event. That being said I am living in an apartment, and already have a almost a whole room dedicated to this. Pretty sure if I expand too much farther my wife will eventually put her foot down. This is why I think a more efficient system could also be advantageous. Swapping from double 15s to single stacks could be a possible space saver. When this venture started I bought the setup because I was planning a relay for life event and my DJ cancelled on me last minute. Since then every year the number of events reaching out to me for my services has grown. I do want to continue to expand my venture, and see where it takes me. Who knows, at some point if I am able to turn it into something self sustaining this may become my full time. Thanks again for all of the help.
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Scott Holtzman

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #24 on: July 05, 2015, 04:53:25 PM »

Jake, Making a full time living is touch building the business up yourself.  Lots of capital expense.

Outdoor is also far more expensive., you need more of everything.

Your next step up is a big one.  Keeping it in a spare room in an apartment will be challenging.

JBL just came out with self powered STX's.  Getting great reviews.  Just to give you an example you could get 4 dual 18 sub cabinets, two 3 way 15's and 4 two way 12's.  That would set you back about 20k and give you a good outdoor rig with some fills that could be used for smaller gigs.

If you want to do bands you will need a bunch of mics, cables and stands, and monitors figure another 5k.  Don't forget the mixer at 2k. 

So for 30k (about a $600 a month payment) you could make between 1500 and 3000 a month.  Especially if you could cross rent.

To me if you want to be in the business, skip over buying small quantities of stuff you will just have to replace. 

BTW, just to get an idea, what do you consider a good wireless mic (the one you bought)?

Also I may have been a little hasty saying you can't do sound full time.  Depends how modestly your wife can accept.  I would recommend trying to get your wife involved in the business.  My wife is band ambassador, cable roller, can tend a board for potty breaks and within reason will help me load in and out.  It will get her invested in the success and allow you to spend more time together.

Good luck,  let us know when your plans crystalize or any questions.

Hello All,

I have looked into purchasing the power cord, and will be making that investment.

I agree that I need alot more experience unlocking and understanding all of the features that the DRPA2 has to offer. Not just for this set up but for any others that I may choose to expand to in the future. I am in San Marcos, TX which is right in the middle of Austin and San Antonio if any of you are floating around this area. I would definitely be interested in meeting up to go over everything!

Scott, this is a non profit event. Usually the closest thing to a stage they have is a trailer pulled to the middle of the field. A couple of the events have tried to convince me to set up there, but for logistical reasons I continue to convince them that setting up on the side of the field makes more sense. My mic is of pretty good quality, but only because I had a cheaper one that kept cutting off on the town's mayor...talk about lesson learned the hard way. So it has actually been able to span the whole football field and beyond with no problem.

Mike, the amps are set to full range, and I am using the DRPA2's cross overs. I am not 100% sure what they are currently set to. This years relay season is over, so I haven't pulled it out to look at it for awhile. I know it is set to whatever the automatic wizard set it to.

As far as a 5 year plan goes... I would like to expand my capabilities. I would like to figure out how to squeeze the most out of the system I have for now. I might even try to keep it for another couple of gigs. That would eventually be enough to cover my investment so if I sold pieces of it they would be for profit for the new system. Long term though I would like to learn what I need to be looking for in a more efficient system as I continue to do these large events. While I know I won't be putting on full on stadium rock concerts, I would like to get to a point where I am not having to turn as many jobs down. Somewhere down the line I would also like to be able to incorporate small live acts. I would also like to have a more versatile system, I would like to not feel like I have to drag everything out for every event. That being said I am living in an apartment, and already have a almost a whole room dedicated to this. Pretty sure if I expand too much farther my wife will eventually put her foot down. This is why I think a more efficient system could also be advantageous. Swapping from double 15s to single stacks could be a possible space saver. When this venture started I bought the setup because I was planning a relay for life event and my DJ cancelled on me last minute. Since then every year the number of events reaching out to me for my services has grown. I do want to continue to expand my venture, and see where it takes me. Who knows, at some point if I am able to turn it into something self sustaining this may become my full time. Thanks again for all of the help.
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Scott AKA "Skyking" Holtzman

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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #25 on: July 05, 2015, 05:23:31 PM »

Hi Jake-

It's good to have a plan.

The phrase "going to the next level" gets used a lot and a couple years ago I wrote about it here at PSW.  I later added a few additional thoughts to that post and it can be read here:  https://soundforums.net/entries/460-The-Next-Level-the-Unicorn-of-the-production-business
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Jake Bekkerus

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #26 on: July 05, 2015, 05:32:53 PM »

Scott, I see you forgot to calculate in the cost of trailer I'm going to need for all of it too, lol. Currently I am able to fit my whole set up in the bed of my truck. A trailer was honestly going to be my next expense though (my back can only take so much more of that lifting).

Considering that at these kind of events I generally only have access to 1 120v outlet is going with powered cabinets going to be the better option? Thus far I had been staying with passive cabinets because I was under the (maybe incorrect) impression that it gave me greater flexibility. It SEEMS as if it would be easier to run the one extension cord to the rack with the power conditioner then run the speaker cables from there? Are the prepowered options more cost effective? If you were to set something up like that how would you disperse that equipment?

The mic that I am using is a shure PGX4/SM58. It's been treating me well so far. Sometimes I feel like the signal is a little weak, but I'm not really sure if that is actually the mic or the already identified sub-par mixer.

Tim, thanks. I will be sure to check that out!

You guys have all been super helpful; I look forward to continuing to use the forum as a resource for years to come!
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Mike Monte

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #27 on: July 05, 2015, 09:53:54 PM »

Scott, I see you forgot to calculate in the cost of trailer I'm going to need for all of it too, lol. Currently I am able to fit my whole set up in the bed of my truck. A trailer was honestly going to be my next expense though (my back can only take so much more of that lifting).

Considering that at these kind of events I generally only have access to 1 120v outlet is going with powered cabinets going to be the better option? Thus far I had been staying with passive cabinets because I was under the (maybe incorrect) impression that it gave me greater flexibility. It SEEMS as if it would be easier to run the one extension cord to the rack with the power conditioner then run the speaker cables from there? Are the prepowered options more cost effective? If you were to set something up like that how would you disperse that equipment?

The mic that I am using is a shure PGX4/SM58. It's been treating me well so far. Sometimes I feel like the signal is a little weak, but I'm not really sure if that is actually the mic or the already identified sub-par mixer.

Tim, thanks. I will be sure to check that out!

You guys have all been super helpful; I look forward to continuing to use the forum as a resource for years to come!

You make a good point about power.  IMO having a rig that can run well from one 20 amp circuit is a must for weekender work. 

When I started providing sound back in the 90's I used four Crown MT1200 amps.  I never had an issue running those four amplifiers on one circuit however I do remember seeing the lights at some venues dim with beat of the kick-drum....  I have since updated my power amps to Itechs, XTI's, etc. and all is fine.   

I'm a fan of passive rigs with efficient amplifiers.

I recently provided the sound system for the DJ at our local Relay for Life.  The overnight event took place on an unlit football field and the stage had a generator for power.  I had a "whopping" 13 amps to work with....  My passive rig (Yorkville TX cabs, three Crown power amps) worked well.  It covered the whole field with "announcements" and a solid half of the field with DJ music.  Also, over the years the Relay has been rained on....I just tarp the subs and put plastic contractor bags on the mid/hi cabs and the music keeps pumping.  I do not know if I could tarp/bag active cabinets...

FYI: I do not own a trailer.  For most of the sound gigs that I do, I use my Ford Expedition.  If the gig calls for more rig I rent a trailer but most of the time I just rent a van from U-Haul and pass on the cost of the rental [trailer or van] to the client.   

Mike M     
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chuck clark

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #28 on: July 06, 2015, 12:24:13 AM »

The best way to spend your money is to improve the weakest link in your audio chain.  In your case this is the small voice coil horn in the JRX top boxes.If you simply trade in your current top boxes for something w/ a 3" diaphragm horn driver be it SRX or QRX or any of several others, you will notice a marked improvement in your systems ability to "project" vocal clarity to a larger crowd outoors. Everything else you have will probably be fine. This is a well known weak point of the JRX series boxes which when pushed, become very harsh sounding in the highs. Perhaps someone else mentioned this but they then went on to suggest you change practically everything which over a period of years you may want to do, but let's focus on that weak point first shall we. I'm assuming you would like the most improvement for the $$$ spent. There ya' go,
Chuck
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Ed Hall

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Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #29 on: July 06, 2015, 02:08:56 AM »

Jake, you mentioned wanting to learn the craft better, you also said you're in your off season. One of the best investments I made when I was starting out was the Sound Reinforcement Handbook by Yamaha. $21 on Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0881889008/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?qid=1436162517&sr=8-2&pi=AC_SY200_QL40&keywords=yamaha+sound&dpPl=1&dpID=51Oa6Sjg5YL&ref=plSrch

It will give you a better understanding of sound and how to work with it.  It's not the final word but is a good start.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2015, 02:17:59 AM by Ed Hall »
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Large Outdoor Events
« Reply #29 on: July 06, 2015, 02:08:56 AM »


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