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Author Topic: Stage collapse, highschool production  (Read 8252 times)

Stephen Swaffer

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Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2015, 06:52:47 PM »


The engineering question that comes to mind is for what capacity was the orchestra pit cover engineered?


This week I have dealt with 2 separate  electrical design issues where the customer insisted they could not spend more money and "this" was the intended use.  My design was and is very adequate for the intended use-but now 2-3 years later they want to do something totally different and it is not working-breakers tripping, etc.

If I engineered every job I do to take into account anything the customer could dream up, nothing would be affordable-no doubt the engineer could design a pit cover to support a dozen dancing elephants, but what is a reasonable cost?

It seems like basic engineering principles/simple machines etc used to be a mandatory part of high school education-but today everyone expects everything to be fool proof.
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Steve Swaffer

Cailen Waddell

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Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2015, 07:59:33 PM »

We have a pit cover in our muni auditorium in a historic building.   In theory the loading on it is the same as the stage per the engineers report from the design of the project.  That said - I don't trust it nearly as much. If there was a stage failure - you would bust through to the concrete slab, inches below(maso on double 3/4" ply on 2x4 sleepers on neoprene pads).  If the pit cover failed, the damage could be catastrophic.    Thus we don't allow the pit cover to have the grand piano on it, the genie runabout, etc.  I wouldn't allow 90 kids jumping either.  Perhaps it can take it, but who the hell wants to find out?   


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« Last Edit: April 24, 2015, 08:33:51 PM by Cailen Waddell »
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Spenser Hamilton

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Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2015, 08:10:27 PM »


We have a pit cover in our muni auditorium in a historic building.   In theory the loading on it is the same as the stage per the engineers report from the design of the project.  That said - I don't trust it nearly as much. If there was a stage failure - you would bust through to the concrete slab, inches below(maso on double 3/4" ply on 2x4 sleepers on neoprene pads).  If the pit cover failed, the damage could be catastrophic.    Thus we don't allow the pit cover to have the grand piano on it, the genie runabout, etc.  I would allow 90 kids jumping either.  Perhaps it can take it, but who the hell wants to find out?   


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Our pit cover has a rating, there is additional bracing that is installed when there is not a band in the pit that increases that rating. We still maintain tight control over what is allowed on the cover (a 2x4 trunk of feeder exceeds the rating iirc).


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Technical Director - Chatham Capitol Theatre/Kiwanis Theatre

Kyle Van Sandt

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Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2015, 08:29:10 PM »

Most pit covers are standard issue staging made by Wegner or Staging Concepts.  Most aim to hit a 250PSF.  The issue with these systems is they can be re-installed wrong.  I bet that is what happened here. 
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Kyle Van Sandt
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The Egg, Albany, NY
vansandtdesigns.com

Cailen Waddell

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Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2015, 11:47:32 PM »


Most pit covers are standard issue staging made by Wegner or Staging Concepts.  Most aim to hit a 250PSF.  The issue with these systems is they can be re-installed wrong.  I bet that is what happened here.

I would bet the same.  Our pit cover has specific instructions, bracing points, etc to maintain its rating.


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Tom Reid

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Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2015, 05:41:38 PM »

Why does one need to cover the pit anyway?
Does it get the actors a little closer to the audience?
Yes, but at what risks?
Doing Godspell in '76 for high school drama, we toyed with the idea of a pit cover, and our drama guru opted to do Godspell in the round, bringing the audience on stage.
She probably saved a few broken bones.
Given budgets these day, and dwindling support for the arts in our school system, stay away from controversy.
If you're in need of getting in touch with the audience, do it in the gym, or do it in the round.
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Spenser Hamilton

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Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #16 on: April 25, 2015, 05:47:36 PM »

Why does one need to cover the pit anyway?

Because the artist would freak if there was a 16 foot gap between the monitor line and first row of seats ;)
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Technical Director - Chatham Capitol Theatre/Kiwanis Theatre

Tim Padrick

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Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2015, 02:39:44 PM »

I'd think that if a cover were designed to handle a load such as those that caused these failures, it would have to be very modular, lest it be too heavy to remove and replace.  And of course it would have to be properly supported.  I'm guessing 12x2 on 16" (or equivalent in steel) for a span of 8'.  The one in CA looks to have been made of 2x4s.

The one here in Indy looks as though it fell straight down, which seems peculiar.
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Steve Hurt

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Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #18 on: May 05, 2015, 07:20:51 PM »

The school that it happened at is in a  pretty affluent / well off area. 
They can afford a technical director, probably 2.

Apologize if this link has been posted before, but apparently IOSHA is investigating

http://wishtv.com/2015/04/27/state-to-open-new-investigation-into-westfield-stage-collapse/



Most school auditoriums are run by either drama teachers whose deepest technical understanding are the three Shakespeare plays they read in class, or a band or choir director, or if the school is very lucky, a janitor.

95% of schools don't have the budget to hire a real technical director that knows what they are doing.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2015, 07:27:16 PM by Steve Hurt »
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Joseph D. Macry

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Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2015, 04:25:55 PM »

Nobody has chimed in with the obvious joke?

"It's just a stage their going through."
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Joseph Macry,
Austin, TX

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Stage collapse, highschool production
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2015, 04:25:55 PM »


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