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[John L Nobile]

Our next show will have 3 numbers with upright bass. Bennet/Gaga numbers. Bass player has an Underwood pickup and couldn't get a decent level without feedback from his rig or another one he brought in. I told him to patch into the system and hear it through his Danley SM LPM monitor. He was blown away. I walked on stage and I was too. No eq. He asked for a little more bottom so I turned on the PA for that as the subs are under the stage.
Best upright sound I've ever had. His low notes were shaking the room and I could clearly hear every note.  He was so happy that he just texted me. He's still smiling.
But I'm always looking for something better. Are we better off with something other than the Underwood? I was thinking of strapping a Crown CM 311 to it. I have a few with broken headbands that I can use. Or am I better off with a pickup?
Suggestions?

[Jay Barracato]

The thing to remember about uprights is that feedback from the front and back vibrating is very direction dependent. The other is that much of the character of the note is well above what most people think of as bass frequency wise.

I have never had good results running through electric bass amps. There are a couple of acoustic bass amps like acoustic image but for what those cost you might as well run it through a monitor. Just offset the monitor like you would for a hypercard pattern mic.

I use both AT pro35 and EV nd467 mics on occasion but if there is a working pickup that is always the first choice.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

Is it a real wood bass or a plywood box?   

I HATE playing real wood basses.  Much, much too sensitive in the body.

Give me an old blonde KAY plywood bass and leave your orchestral instruments at home.

[John L Nobile]

Is it a real wood bass or a plywood box?   

I HATE playing real wood basses.  Much, much too sensitive in the body.

Give me an old blonde KAY plywood bass and leave your orchestral instruments at home.

That I don't know. I'll ask but he may not know. How do you tell the difference?

[Keith Broughton]

Try a mic as well as the pickup and add in the mic in the mains only. They can be grief in the monitors!
It will give you that nice "fingers on strings" sound to add to the pickup.

I'm dying to do a gig up there and try out that Danley rig.

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

That I don't know. I'll ask but he may not know. How do you tell the difference?

The real wood one burns with a blue flame...

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

Try a mic as well as the pickup and add in the mic in the mains only. They can be grief in the monitors!
It will give you that nice "fingers on strings" sound to add to the pickup.

I'm dying to do a gig up there and try out that Danley rig.

I carry a little Barcus-Berry instrument pre-amp for using with such pickups.  If I need a direct signal I can sometimes get it from an amp direct out, but they tend to be noisy and not all amps have them.  It's not great, but it's better than nothing and quieter than a buzzy amp feed.

It is a very common occurrence that a bassist will purchase the pickup only and not the matching pre-amp.  This doesn't really affect performance when playing through a proper bass amp but means that it won't match up well with a PA.

Edit:

A good reference for all things upright bass is

http://www.gollihurmusic.com/faq/25-FREQUENCIES_WHAT_ARE_THE_FREQUENCIES_OF_BASS_NOTES.html

[Keith Broughton]

I carry a little Barcus-Berry instrument pre-amp for using with such pickups.  If I need a direct signal I can sometimes get it from an amp direct out, but they tend to be noisy and not all amps have them.  It's not great, but it's better than nothing and quieter than a buzzy amp feed.

Edit:

A good reference for all things upright bass is

http://www.gollihurmusic.com/faq/25-FREQUENCIES_WHAT_ARE_THE_FREQUENCIES_OF_BASS_NOTES.html

I carry the Leon DI box for these pickups and it has a very high impedance input as well as a buffered out to go to an amp.
http://www.leonaudio.com.au/active.htm

[John L Nobile]

I carry a little Barcus-Berry instrument pre-amp for using with such pickups.  If I need a direct signal I can sometimes get it from an amp direct out, but they tend to be noisy and not all amps have them.  It's not great, but it's better than nothing and quieter than a buzzy amp feed.

We're going with bass through monitors. Amp sounds like crap and gets lots of feedback.
The reason I was thinking of the crown was that I could have him wireless with a spare pack.
He hasn't played that bass in years and if he doesn't practice more I may do the flame test.
So blue flame if it's real wood?

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

I carry the Leon DI box for these pickups and it has a very high impedance input as well as a buffered out to go to an amp.
http://www.leonaudio.com.au/active.htm

Here's what Gollihur has to say on the subject:

http://www.gollihurmusic.com/faq/11-PREAMPS_DO_YOU_NEED_A_PREAMP_WITH_YOUR_URB_PICKUP.html

[Steve M Smith]

Yes, you need a very high input impedance to get the low notes out of a piezo pickup.

I have some home made high impedance DIs with about 5M impedance which work very well for this.


Steve.

[John L Nobile]

I carry the Leon DI box for these pickups and it has a very high impedance input as well as a buffered out to go to an amp.
http://www.leonaudio.com.au/active.htm

Interesting box. I do need a DI for him but I can't find a price or a dealer. I was thinking of BSS.
Between you and Dick, I see the problem he was having with his amp. He'd have to get a preamp for that.
Dick's link is interesting. They don't sell Underwood which I find surprising. But there's quite a bit of info on this subject out there. It's not just a matter of mic it up and amplify. More stuff to learn.

We're heading into a busy convention time Keith. Maybe I'll see you with an AV outfit. If you're with a sound company, PM me. We do rent gear a few times a year.

[John L Nobile]

Yes, you need a very high input impedance to get the low notes out of a piezo pickup.

I have some home made high impedance DIs with about 5M impedance which work very well for this.


Steve.

I had him into a Radial DI last night and there wasn't any lack of bass. Not a lot of signal but the box may have been padded.
Can't seem to find any impedance specs on the Radial though.

[Steve M Smith]

If you're handy with a soldering iron, or know someone who is, I can send you the circuit diagram for my DI.  It's quite simple (I think I posted it on another thread a few weeks ago).

EDIT: Here it is:




Steve.

[John L Nobile]

Nice of you to post that Steve but my soldering skills are limited to cables and quick repairs.

[John L Nobile]

Can't seem to find any pricing on the Leon DI. I was looking at this
http://www.radialeng.com/pzdi.php

It looks quite versatile and I'm very happy with the JDI box I have now. It seems very well made.

[Steve M Smith]

That will probably do exactly what you want.  I like their enclosure design too.

I'm not sure about the 220K loading for magnetic pickups though as most instruments with magnetic pickups usually have 250K or 500K volume controls connected across the pickup output anyway.


Steve.

[Keith Broughton]

Can't seem to find any pricing on the Leon DI. I was looking at this
http://www.radialeng.com/pzdi.php

It looks quite versatile and I'm very happy with the JDI box I have now. It seems very well made.

I had a friend bring it up from Auz a few years back. Thought they might have a distributor in the US by now.
Anyway, this Countryman DI has a 10 meg "pickup" input.
http://www.countryman.com/type-85-direct-box

[Ivan Beaver]

I had a friend bring it up from Auz a few years back. Thought they might have a distributor in the US by now.
Anyway, this Countryman DI has a 10 meg "pickup" input.
http://www.countryman.com/type-85-direct-box

Yes that was "the standard" for many years.

You could really hear the difference-especially on acoustic guitars.  The sound would just "open up" and be more clear-as compared to a "normal" DI box that would load down the pickup-causing it to drive a load it did not like.

Until you hear the difference-a normal DI is "just fine". 

[Matthew Knischewsky]

I had a friend bring it up from Auz a few years back. Thought they might have a distributor in the US by now.
Anyway, this Countryman DI has a 10 meg "pickup" input.
http://www.countryman.com/type-85-direct-box

I also recommend the Type 85DI box for upright bass, or anything really.

John, Angus Audio in Cambridge ON has a used one on their website for $49. I'm sure they would send it up north for you.

Matt.

[John L Nobile]

I also recommend the Type 85DI box for upright bass, or anything really.

John, Angus Audio in Cambridge ON has a used one on their website for $49. I'm sure they would send it up north for you.

Matt.

Thanks for the tip. I looked at it but it looks a little beat up. I'd want to go with new for this. I'm actually leaning towards the Radial unit right now. I've probably got a month before I need to order it.

[Tim Padrick]

DPA 4099

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