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Author Topic: Mid-size digital console advice  (Read 9379 times)

Jose Rodriguez

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2014, 12:09:25 AM »

I doubt he'll still have $30k by the time construction overages have chewed on the wallet.
As a dealer for all the above I would look at QL5+Rio3224...Midas Pro2/3+DL251..lets not count out the SC 48
These 3 should be closer to $$22 (except Pro 3) depending on options..each has their plusses...Midas for sonics..Yamaha for value..SC48 for friendliness.
The choice may be market or genre influenced as well.
Where will this be ? Is this a Jazz..Rock..Country oriented venue ?
Connectivity may also be a factor...some may be simpler to integrate..will you want an all digital output path..copper...no copper...hybrid on the input side?

Thanks, Mike.

Primarily, the venue is going to be used for rock, jazz, and even some spoken word/lectures.

I know the QL or CL series consoles somewhat, but I’ll look at those a little closer and see how they compare to something like the M7, which I’m more familiar with.
Answering your other question, the inputs will be a hybrid of digital and copper. The outputs will be mostly copper; I know that he’s looking at a lot of powered loudspeakers with analog/copper inputs.

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MikeHarris

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2014, 11:44:58 AM »

If you know the M7 the CL/QL will be very familiar. The Dante Virtual Soundcard (included) makes recording very easy if that feature is useful to you.
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Kevin Maxwell

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2014, 03:43:30 PM »

The SC48 runs too hot for my taste, engineered too close to the bone. I agree that a Yamaha CL5 with two remote snake heads is the way to go. There's a good upgrade path if he ever decides to do a separate monitor mixer, and the system will be valuable in the reseller market for about ten years.

-Bink

Hi Bink, long time no talk. It is funny that you mentioned that the SC48 runs hot. I just finished a musical last night and we had to break down the SC48 so it can be returned tomorrow. I had to unplug our snakes and plug in all of the lines from the snake breakout that lives in the doghouse and as I was unplugging everything I almost called someone over to feel how hot the XLR connectors were. This consoles doghouse doesn’t have the usual gap allowing it to vent some of the heat out. It also makes it hard to turn the board on because you have to open the doghouse lid to get to the switches I just used one of the flat screwdriver blades on my Swiss army knife to hit the switch, because the monitor bracket blocked the lid. I was wondering where all the heat is coming from and if it would run cooler if you had the stage box version and if the input cards where in there. I have never had a problem with the board due to the heat but it does run hot.

I really like using the SC48 for these musical theater shows. I just wish this one had the output expansion card in it so I had more AES outs and more outputs for the automixer. I used my usual setup using the SCM810s for dialog but I was having a little bit of an issue now and then with one girl who cries loudly messing things up. I switched most of the cues with her in them to singing cues. Thus taking it out of the automixer return path. The show was Hello Dolly.

I also came up with a little trick for this show (20 wireless) I only had 13 outputs left for the automixer inputs (I only brought 2 SCM810 because I knew I wouldn’t have enough outputs) so I used the direct outs for the first 11 mics (the main characters where in the first 8 ) and then I put channels 12-16 (post) into the aux send 12 and feed that to the 12th channel of the automixer and I took channels 17-20 (post) and feed that to aux 13 and feed that to the 13th channel of the automixer. Since most of the dialog for those mics were interacting one at a time with the first 8 mics I had more channel of automixing in play without having more channel of automixing. And it worked very well even when I had more the one person on the 12th or 13th channel of the automixer. I came up with this workaround on site and actually trusted how the SC48 works enough to do it on the fly in a rehearsal.

So even though this is a little bit of a topic swerve it goes to how much I like the SC48. And for the price the OP is looking at you should be able to get the version with the stage box. But I would also seriously look at the Yamaha CL5. 
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Peter Morris

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #13 on: November 23, 2014, 07:25:47 PM »

Hi Bink, long time no talk. It is funny that you mentioned that the SC48 runs hot. I just finished a musical last night and we had to break down the SC48 so it can be returned tomorrow. I had to unplug our snakes and plug in all of the lines from the snake breakout that lives in the doghouse and as I was unplugging everything I almost called someone over to feel how hot the XLR connectors were. This consoles doghouse doesn’t have the usual gap allowing it to vent some of the heat out. It also makes it hard to turn the board on because you have to open the doghouse lid to get to the switches I just used one of the flat screwdriver blades on my Swiss army knife to hit the switch, because the monitor bracket blocked the lid. I was wondering where all the heat is coming from and if it would run cooler if you had the stage box version and if the input cards where in there. I have never had a problem with the board due to the heat but it does run hot.

I really like using the SC48 for these musical theater shows. I just wish this one had the output expansion card in it so I had more AES outs and more outputs for the automixer. I used my usual setup using the SCM810s for dialog but I was having a little bit of an issue now and then with one girl who cries loudly messing things up. I switched most of the cues with her in them to singing cues. Thus taking it out of the automixer return path. The show was Hello Dolly.

I also came up with a little trick for this show (20 wireless) I only had 13 outputs left for the automixer inputs (I only brought 2 SCM810 because I knew I wouldn’t have enough outputs) so I used the direct outs for the first 11 mics (the main characters where in the first 8 ) and then I put channels 12-16 (post) into the aux send 12 and feed that to the 12th channel of the automixer and I took channels 17-20 (post) and feed that to aux 13 and feed that to the 13th channel of the automixer. Since most of the dialog for those mics were interacting one at a time with the first 8 mics I had more channel of automixing in play without having more channel of automixing. And it worked very well even when I had more the one person on the 12th or 13th channel of the automixer. I came up with this workaround on site and actually trusted how the SC48 works enough to do it on the fly in a rehearsal.

So even though this is a little bit of a topic swerve it goes to how much I like the SC48. And for the price the OP is looking at you should be able to get the version with the stage box. But I would also seriously look at the Yamaha CL5.

The SC48 is great, but Avid’s delisting from the NASDAQ in February 2014, and their recent financial issues make me nervous.
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Jose Rodriguez

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2014, 12:09:12 PM »

The SC48 is great, but Avid’s delisting from the NASDAQ in February 2014, and their recent financial issues make me nervous.

Thanks, Peter. Thant's an interesting point.
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brian maddox

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #15 on: November 25, 2014, 10:09:34 AM »

The SC48 is great, but Avid’s delisting from the NASDAQ in February 2014, and their recent financial issues make me nervous.

i've seen other claim that this is just a temporary setback for Avid but...  If i had to bet on which company will definitely be around in 2025, i'm gonna go with Yamaha.  :)
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #16 on: November 25, 2014, 11:26:04 AM »

The SC48 is great, but Avid’s delisting from the NASDAQ in February 2014, and their recent financial issues make me nervous.

Didn't we just go through this?  The de-listing was temporary and they have $15MM (or more) in the bank.

While things aren't' great for Avid, they aren't as dire as for granny on her deathbed...
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Peter Morris

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2014, 12:30:47 AM »

Didn't we just go through this?  The de-listing was temporary and they have $15MM (or more) in the bank.

While things aren't' great for Avid, they aren't as dire as for granny on her deathbed...

Not in this tread  :) … and I’m still nervous.

On 12 November 2014, Avid announced that they will be unable to file their next 10-Q by the deadline required by the SEC, so things are still not that good. Hopefully 2015 will be better for them.

Not that we need to go there again but FWIW this this is my understanding of their financial position –
 
Avid Technology, Inc. announced unaudited consolidated earnings results for the third quarter and nine months ended September 30, 2014. For the quarter, the company reported total net revenues of $149,429,000 compared to $138,893,000 a year ago. Operating income was $15,060,000 against operating income of $3,866,000 a year ago. Income before income taxes was $14,605,000 against $3,503,000 a year ago. Net income was $14,240,000 or $0.36 per share diluted against $2,852,000 or $0.07 diluted per share diluted a year ago. Non-GAAP operating income was $23,316,000 against $15,634,000 a year ago. The improvement reflects continued focus on higher margin products, as well as the backlog conversion in third quarter from S6 console shipments. Non-GAAP net income was $22,500,000 against $14,135,000 a year ago. Non-GAAP net income per share diluted was $0.57 against $0.36 a year ago. Adjusted EBITDA was $27,312,000 against $19,985,000 a year ago, largely driven by the conversion of backlog and bookings to revenue, the emphasis on higher-margin products discussed earlier, and the continued execution of cost savings initiatives. GAAP net cash provided by operating activities was $5,252,000 against net cash used in operating activities of $4,472,000 a year ago. Capital expenditures were $5,269,000 against $3,708,000 a year ago. For the nine months, the company reported total revenues of $402,055,000 compared to $416,309,000 a year ago. Operating income was $22,387,000 against $23,039,000 a year ago. Income before income taxes was $21,224,000 against $22,171,000 a year ago. Net income was $19,797,000 or $0.51 per share diluted against $20,024,000 or $0.51 per share diluted a year ago. Non-GAAP operating income was $45,649,000 against $47,228,000 a year ago. Non-GAAP Net income was $43,052,000 against $43,568,000 a year ago. Non-GAAP net income per share diluted was $1.10 against $1.12 a year ago. Adjusted EBITDA was $58,070,000 against $60,907,000 a year ago. GAAP net cash used in operating activities was $20,830,000 against $10,028,000 a year ago. Capital expenditures were $11,660,000 against $8,998,000 a year ago. Both video and audio product revenue increased on a year-over-year basis and on a sequential basis, but audio revenue was especially lifted with heavy backlog conversion during the quarter from shipments over new Pro Tools S6 console. For the fiscal year 2014, the company expects adjusted EBITDA will be $64 million to $72 million. Free cash flow is expected to be approximately $15 million to $20 million. The company expects 2014 revenue will be down 3% to 5% from last year. The company expects non-GAAP gross margin to be in the range of 59% to 60%.
http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/snapshot/snapshot.asp?ticker=AVID


« Last Edit: November 26, 2014, 12:36:50 AM by Peter Morris »
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Justice C. Bigler

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2014, 03:48:36 PM »

Geez, they missed another SEC filing?

I also am nervous about Avid's future. Their fire sale of Protools upgrades over the last few weeks and forcing their users into a subscription format indicates to me that they are desperate for cash. And their accounting issues go back nearly 10 years now for something like 5 million transactions. Something is fundamentally wrong with their company. And while I think that Protools and Media Composer will live on (either under Avid's stewardship or some other company who will eventually buy up their assets), I think their live sound venture is much more uncertain.
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Rob Spence

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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2014, 11:12:10 PM »

I would be more concerned buying an SC48 as it has been around for a while and I would expect Avid to be replacing it sooner than Yamaha replacing a CL.


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Re: Mid-size digital console advice
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2014, 11:12:10 PM »


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