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[Joshua Dickard]

Good morning! Our church is just about to pull the trigger on a new audio system. So far, we've narrowed it down to two options:

Option 1      Renkus Heinz Passive Speaker System   
#   Qty   Model/Description   
1   1   RH STX4/44   3 Wide Array w/Hardware
2   2   RH STX2M/94D   Downfill Speakers W/HDWR
3   1   CXD4.3-xx   QSC 4 x 600w w DSP


QSC Option 2: Powered Line-Array, Flown Mains w Subs Ground-mounted         
#   Qty   Model/Description   
1   6   KLA12-WH   Two Way Active, Line Array
         500x500W,12" Woofer, 1.72 Comp.
         Driver; Rigging
2   2   KW181   Active Gound-stack Sub Woofer
3   2   KLA-af12-wh   KLA-AF12-W Fly Frame



These will be driven by a Behringer x32 board. The room is very basic. It is approximately 96'x54' in size (see image) with 22' ceilings. It is concrete block, but we have accoustic paneling around the room with full carpeting.

Our concern is about overall sound quality (not quantity), but we do want full coverage. I do have an EASE mapping on the Renkus Heinz, but we've never heard them (we've heard QSC, but not this exact model).

What are your thoughts? Please help!

[lindsay Dean]

Good morning! Our church is just about to pull the trigger on a new audio system. So far, we've narrowed it down to two options:

Option 1      Renkus Heinz Passive Speaker System   
#   Qty   Model/Description   
1   1   RH STX4/44   3 Wide Array w/Hardware
2   2   RH STX2M/94D   Downfill Speakers W/HDWR
3   1   CXD4.3-xx   QSC 4 x 600w w DSP


QSC Option 2: Powered Line-Array, Flown Mains w Subs Ground-mounted         
#   Qty   Model/Description   
1   6   KLA12-WH   Two Way Active, Line Array
         500x500W,12" Woofer, 1.72 Comp.
         Driver; Rigging
2   2   KW181   Active Gound-stack Sub Woofer
3   2   KLA-af12-wh   KLA-AF12-W Fly Frame



These will be driven by a Behringer x32 board. The room is very basic. It is approximately 75'x50' in size (see image). It is concrete block, but we have accoustic paneling around the room with full carpeting.

Our concern is about overall sound quality (not quantity), but we do want full coverage. I do have an EASE mapping on the Renkus Heinz, but we've never heard them (we've heard QSC, but not this exact model).

What are your thoughts? Please help!

sub on spec1  , no sub on spec 2
what style of music?

[Joshua Dickard]

sub on spec1  , no sub on spec 2
what style of music?

Contemporary worship, but we do a lot of old hymns with guitar, drums, piano, keyboard.

[Joshua Dickard]

Sorry, I should've mentioned that we have an optional sub quote to go along with the RH:

SUB WOOFER OPTION         
1   2   RH PNX212   DUAL 12' SUB
2   2   p7000   Yamaha Amps

[lindsay Dean]

Sorry, I should've mentioned that we have an optional sub quote to go along with the RH:

SUB WOOFER OPTION         
1   2   RH PNX212   DUAL 12' SUB
2   2   p7000   Yamaha Amps

I am a fan of seperate components on flown mains.
Amps/processors need to be where you can get to them in case of   issues.

On the x32 i would use outboard processing
in case of failure the console can be switched out with no redos on processing on mains

[Dave Neale]

Opinions are like you know what...

I am very fond of the QSC Wideline products. I'm always happy to see them.

However, an RH array installed in Charlotte, NC, (can't remember the venue, I'd need to dig out that tour book) is IMO the single finest rig I've ever mixed through.

[Cailen Waddell]

You should look at and model the danley stuff.  I bet one single sh100b might be sufficient for that size room


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[jason misterka]

Opinions are like you know what...

I am very fond of the QSC Wideline products. I'm always happy to see them.

However, an RH array installed in Charlotte, NC, (can't remember the venue, I'd need to dig out that tour book) is IMO the single finest rig I've ever mixed through.

This is a QSC KLA option, not Wideline or a line array.

Also, I've heard both RH extremes, they are used in some of the best and some of the worst installations.  I'm sure that is installer dependent...

Jason

[TJ (Tom) Cornish]

Good morning! Our church is just about to pull the trigger on a new audio system. So far, we've narrowed it down to two options:

...

I do have an EASE mapping on the Renkus Heinz, but we've never heard them (we've heard QSC, but not this exact model).

What are your thoughts? Please help!

My suggestion is to get a demo in your space of the actual systems proposed, even if you have to pay something for it.  Hearing a different QSC product will have little correlation to the system in question, and as has been alluded to in the thread, the competency of the installer can have a huge impact. 

We did this earlier this year when upgrading our system, and I was very surprised at the result.  It cost us a few hundred dollars to bring the systems in (3 products from 2 vendors plus some other gear we had access to for free), but it was VERY worth it in the end. 

[David Sturzenbecher]

I have installed a few STX4 systems, and it is a very fine box with plenty of snort, and is also availible in a non-powered version. I have also used the dual 12" subwoofer you mentioned.  4 of them did a decent job in an 8000 seat colleseum when I had no roof capacity to fly anything larger.

[Joshua Dickard]

Thanks for the replies. We only have about 250 in attendance regularly so I'm thinking that the KLA12's will be good for our room. We have asked about demo's but they can't schedule any when were actually available. We're also in a time crunch. I know it's bad to rush a decision, but honestly I don't think there's a bad option in this case from what I'm hearing.


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[lindsay Dean]

Thanks for the replies. We only have about 250 in attendance regularly so I'm thinking that the KLA12's will be good for our room. We have asked about demo's but they can't schedule any when were actually available. We're also in a time crunch. I know it's bad to rush a decision, but honestly I don't think there's a bad option in this case from what I'm hearing.


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David Sturzenbecher,
What is snort?

[David Hoover]

You should look at and model the danley stuff.  I bet one single sh100b might be sufficient for that size room


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I agree Danley will save you money and sound better.  It looks like you are wanting a mono cluster.  I would buy two SM60f speakers, hard pack them and fly them together.  Then depending on your low end requirements, one to two TH118 subwoofers.  That system will blow your socks off.  You could have a 250 person concert with those speakers and enough subs.

Danley also has a program called Danley Design Tool 3D which is free.  Be careful when you are using other programs as you WANT to see phase cancellation in your plot as well as low frequency interaction.  Danley's software will show accurately what the speakers and subs will do.  The software is so good that you can set your amps ahead of time, plug it in, and it sounds good right away.

Take Care

[David Sturzenbecher]

David Sturzenbecher,
What is snort?

Slang for output.


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[Ivan Beaver]

I agree Danley will save you money and sound better.  It looks like you are wanting a mono cluster.  I would buy two SM60f speakers, hard pack them and fly them together.  Then depending on your low end requirements, one to two TH118 subwoofers.  That system will blow your socks off.  You could have a 250 person concert with those speakers and enough subs.

Danley also has a program called Danley Design Tool 3D which is free.  Be careful when you are using other programs as you WANT to see phase cancellation in your plot as well as low frequency interaction.  Danley's software will show accurately what the speakers and subs will do.  The software is so good that you can set your amps ahead of time, plug it in, and it sounds good right away.

Take Care

Actually the DDT is the old version.

It has been replaced with Danley Direct.

It is also free and runs on mac or windows

It has a lot of the same look/feel-but is WAAYYYY faster and has some really cool features that make design work faster/easier than other programs.

[David Hoover]

Actually the DDT is the old version.

It has been replaced with Danley Direct.

It is also free and runs on mac or windows

It has a lot of the same look/feel-but is WAAYYYY faster and has some really cool features that make design work faster/easier than other programs.

Downloading it tomorrow!!!

[Ivan Beaver]

Downloading it tomorrow!!!

There are some videos to give a quick start.

There are a lot of cool features-but if one knows how to design a sound system, they can be up and running on DIRECT in just a few minutes.

Basically it is just a matter of the "knobology" or knowing where the different tools are and what is available.

[ProSoundWeb Community]