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Author Topic: Q20 power drill demonstration  (Read 26792 times)

Mike Sokol

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #40 on: January 31, 2014, 05:26:14 PM »

excuse the grammar but my thumbs suck at typing.


John, ref your signature "I think it needs more barn", is this the barn you're referring to? http://www.morebarn.org/

John Sabine

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #41 on: January 31, 2014, 09:05:55 PM »

Yep:)
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Mike Sokol

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #42 on: May 21, 2014, 01:35:49 AM »

More electric-shock drownings from my Marine electrical buddy Dave Rifkin. These are so sad since many involve children. This is a just a partial list of the full report on Mike Holt's forum.

Note that many of these victims weren't actually electrocuted in the strictest sense of the word. They were shocked with just enough current to immobilize their limbs, then they slipped below the water and drowned. So many of them were initially thought to be drowning victims until witnesses said they heard screams they were being shocked. What a horrible way to die.

ELECTRIC SHOCK DROWNINGS 2013-2014
 
1. Apr 23, 2014
North Miami Beach, FL.  A 7 year old boy was electrocuted at his home in the family swimming pool.  An older brother felt a shock and urge the victim and a younger brother to get out.  The victim did not hear his brother, and immediately thereafter was killed.  A rescuer performing CPR put his hand in the water and felt a shock.  A faulty swimming pool light is the likely cause of the accident.  The presence of a GFCI was not mentioned in the newspaper reports.

2. July 25, 2013
Ellijay, GA.  A 19 year old girl was electrocuted after a power outage at a home where she was watching a 5 year old girl.  A power line came down about 25ft from the house.  She went outside to investigate the power outage and either stepped in puddle of water or soggy ground.  The voltage gradient from the downed power line was enough to electrocute her.

3. July 19, 2013
Syracuse, NY.  A 12 year old girl was electrocuted while filling an inflatable pool in her backyard.  Witness say she picked up an extension cord or electric pump plugged into a receptacle, and began shaking.  She then fell into the pool.  Rescuers received shocks trying to get her out of the pool.  Although not mentioned, it was likely that the receptacle was not protected by an operable GFCI as required by the National Electric Code for all outdoor receptacles.

4. July 17, 2013
Davidson County, NC.  An 11yo girl was electrocuted in a swimming pool.  It was reported that a power line wire came down in the parking lot near the pool.  The girl touched the ladder of the pool and was shocked.  Rescuers trying to help the girl were also shocked.  Electricity was likely flowing from the downed wire into the earth, and passed through the pool enroute to its source.

5. July 4, 2013
Eagle Lake in Orrick Township, Sherburne County, MN.  A man was holding a plugged-in battery charger while standing in 20” of water.  He was preparing to connect the charger to his houseboat.  He slipped and immersed the charger which resulted in a severe electrical shock.  He died on 7 July.  A woman who went to his aid was also shocked and unconscious but was revived at the scene.  It is unknown whether the charger was properly grounded.

6. June 30, 2013
Pulaski County, KY, near South Fork of Lake Cumberland near Garland Bend.  A man swimming at a private dock reaches up to pull a ladder down to exit the lake.  The ladder contacted a frayed electrical wire energizing the ladder.  The man was electrocuted, but was able to move his 2yo son out of danger.   Others felt shocks trying to help the man.

7.  May 20, 2013
Grayson County, KY, Rough River Lake.  A 36yo man and one of his dogs were lost near a marina boat slip.  He jumped into the water when the dog was having problems. Witnesses report the man’s eyes rolled back and he went under the water suddenly.  Inspectors found a shore cord (with a submerged coupling between two cords) was energized and reported this was the cause of the electrocution.  The man was reportedly 10-15ft from the houseboat.  They found multiple NEC violations at the marina.

8. Sep, 2012
Americus, GA, South Georgia Technical College.  A 19 year old woman was electrocuted in a fountain pond while retrieving her young son’s ball.  Efforts to assist her were thwarted by others receiving electrical shocks.  Investigators found 17 violations in the electrical supply to the pond.  One month earlier another student reported shocks (the pond was only drained and cleaned as a result).

9. Aug 30, 2012
Bingham County, Idaho.  Two men and a woman were electrocuted in an irrigation ditch.  The woman went in to rescue a dog, and the 2 men tried to rescue the woman.  A faulty irrigation pump was responsible for this tradgedy.

10. Aug 22, 2012
Los Angeles, CA.  A man speeding in a car hit a fire hydrant and electrical pole.  The energized from the pole ended up in the large puddle created by the broken fire hydrant.  2 women were electrocuted when they entered the puddle to try and assist the driver.

11. July 25, 2012
Tampico, IL.  A 14 year old boy and girl were electrocuted while detasseling corn in an IL cornfield.   A lightning strike is suggested to have destroyed the grounding system for an irrigation pump.  A fault in the pump then leaked electricity into the ground creating electrical gradients across puddles and other wet areas.

12. July 25, 2012
Cohasset, MN, Pokegama Lake.  Two men and a woman were shocked by an extension cord in the water, presumably from a boat lift.  One of the men could not be revived and died.  The other two were hospitalized in serious condition.

13. July 7, 2012
Lake of the Ozarks, MO.  A 26 year old woman was swimming with her 2 stepbrothers when the brothers felt a tingling.  The boys swam to one dock and were unharmed.  The woman swam to a different dock, apparently where there was faulty wiring.  She may have been electrocuted when she touched something metallic on this dock.  She could not be revived at the scene.

14. July 4, 2012
Lake of the Ozarks, MO.   A 13 year old girl and her 8 year old brother were killed by electricity while swimming near a private dock.  Officials said the dock was not protected by a GFCI as required.  The electrical fault may have come from a boat lift or a water slide pump.

15. July 4, 2012
German Creek Marina on Cherokee Lake, Bean Station, TN.  A 10  year old and 11 year old boys were killed by electricity in the water at a TN marina while swimming between 2 docked houseboats.  An 8 year old girl also swimming with the boys was shocked but pulled to safety.  Several adults and another 12 year old boy were shocked trying to rescue the 2 boys.  Faulty houseboat wiring on one of the boats is believed to be one of the causes.

16. June 27, 2012
Celebration, FL.  An 11 year old girl was electrocuted when she reached into a mini golf pond at an Orlando, FL resort to retrieve a golf ball.  A man trying to help her was also shocked.  The cause was faulty pond pump that was not protected by the required GFCI.  Water came in contact with the pumps windings and electrified the small cement pond on the mini golf course.

17. May 5, 2012
Lake Sinclair, Putnam County, GA.  A 25-year-old woman was apparently electrocuted when she reached from the water and touched either a box or bare wire on the dock (it was being worked on at the time).  Another woman in the water was shocked when she pulled the 25 year old away from the dock and held her head above water.  She could not be revived at the scene.

Frank DeWitt

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #43 on: May 21, 2014, 11:54:11 AM »



John, ref your signature "I think it needs more barn", is this the barn you're referring to? http://www.morebarn.org/

As a sound guy I must point out that you could achieve almost the same effect with less house.   (Grin)
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Mike Sokol

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #44 on: May 22, 2014, 09:39:45 PM »

As a sound guy I must point out that you could achieve almost the same effect with less house.   (Grin)

But a "Less House" t-shirt would not be nearly as cool.  8)

Mike

John Roberts {JR}

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #45 on: May 24, 2014, 08:08:49 AM »

There are reports all over the news about a recent pool incident in FL. An electrical pump was shocking some kids and they managed to get a video so the news was all over it. I have no problem with making a big deal about this, but about half the reports said that the kids were "electrocuted"... They were not killed, they were "shocked". I guess the news producers thought electrocuted sounded more scary.

I saw Fox news trot out a safety "expert" and not one mention of GFCI technology. His advice was to have a technician check pools.  I vote for having an electrician check any pool wiring.

JR
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Mike Sokol

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #46 on: May 24, 2014, 08:56:36 AM »

There are reports all over the news about a recent pool incident in FL. An electrical pump was shocking some kids and they managed to get a video so the news was all over it. I have no problem with making a big deal about this, but about half the reports said that the kids were "electrocuted"... They were not killed, they were "shocked". I guess the news producers thought electrocuted sounded more scary.

Yeah, the same goes for musicians who were "electrocuted" at a gig last night, but are still alive and kicking to talk about it. I try to say things like "killed by electrocution" and "severely shocked but survived" to differentiate the terminology. But the news guys really like "electrocution" for everything.

Quote
I saw Fox news trot out a safety "expert" and not one mention of GFCI technology. His advice was to have a technician check pools.  I vote for having an electrician check any pool wiring.

Yeah, GFCI technology would save a lot of lives in the water, but too often it's improperly installed or never tested. Outside GFCI receptacles live a hard life and will occasionally fail in the "stuck on" position which renders them useless. Also note that water shocks are especially dangerous since in fresh water there's a voltage gradient that extends out dozens of yards from the voltage source. As you swim into it, your arms act like a dipole antenna begin picking up more and more current which makes it harder to swim the closer to you get. Once you hit around 20 volts differential hand-to-hand, your reaching the current threshold of 20 mA at which your arm muscles "lock up" and you can't swim. Then the unlucky victim slips below the water and drowns. So in many shock-drownings, there's really no electrocution or heart stoppage by electricity. And it doesn't show up on the autopsy as an electrocution, because they really weren't shocked sufficiently to stop their heart. My marine electrical safety buddy Dave Rifkin and I think that a lot of so called "drownings" around boat docks were in fact shock-drownings from a boat or dock with improper wiring causing voltage gradients in the water. And note that this effect has never been observed in saltwater since it has so much conductivity that this gradient "aura" is only a few inches in size, not dozens of yards as it is in freshwater.     
« Last Edit: May 24, 2014, 08:58:39 AM by Mike Sokol »
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Kevin Graf

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #47 on: May 24, 2014, 09:30:59 AM »

Mike, don't you have a page or long post on water shocks?
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Mike Sokol

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #48 on: May 24, 2014, 11:29:10 PM »

Mike, don't you have a page or long post on water shocks?

Not me, but my marine electrical safety buddy Dave Rifkin does. Here's a link to his report on shock-drowning on Mike Holt's forum: http://www.mikeholt.com/newsletters.php?action=display&letterID=1309

Dave and I have been discussing shock-drownings and how they happen for several years now. We often compare notes on testing techniques and code issues as they relate to electrical safety. 

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Re: Q20 power drill demonstration
« Reply #48 on: May 24, 2014, 11:29:10 PM »


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