ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 8   Go Down

Author Topic: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade  (Read 31233 times)

nicklang

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #40 on: April 02, 2014, 01:34:37 PM »

okay.....so on my Mackie Profx16 board I've got four aux outputs (Jack plugs) and matching sub faders.......

So do I use a jack>>>XLR cable for sub out 1 going to the first subwoofer and likewise from sub out 2 going to the second subwoofer?
Logged
Sound messer arounder for 7th Circle!!!
Check us out and give us a like.....
www.7thcircle.co.uk

Taylor Hall

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 869
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #41 on: April 02, 2014, 01:59:26 PM »

That's the general idea, but you will want to have a crossover between the mixer output and your sub input (unless your amp has built in DSP of some sort). The reason for this is that your mixer will be outputting a full-range signal and your sub only needs the low end. Giving a sub a full-range signal can damage it, so you want to be sure you only give it the frequencies it is designed to handle.

If you have a crossover (or amp with DSP), set it to the manufacturer's recommended crossover settings and see how it sounds. You may have to modify it slightly to better suit your particular rig.
Logged
There are two ways to do anything:
1) Do it right
2) Do it over until you do it right

Tommy Peel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1468
  • Longview, Texas
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #42 on: April 02, 2014, 02:41:46 PM »

okay.....so on my Mackie Profx16 board I've got four aux outputs (Jack plugs) and matching sub faders.......

So do I use a jack>>>XLR cable for sub out 1 going to the first subwoofer and likewise from sub out 2 going to the second subwoofer?

Nick,

Looking at a pic of your Profx16 possibly the best way to feed your subs would be to send your bass, kick, floor tom, and any other LF producing instrument(keys, etc...) to SUB1(or 2, 3 or 4) by doing the following:
  • Disengage the send to L-R with the button by the fader for the desired channels
  • Engage the 1-2 button for the channel
  • pan the channel all the way left(to send to SUB 1 instead of both 1 and 2
  • Connect the SUB1 output to the input of one of your SRM1801s using appropriate adapters and connect the full range output of the sub to the other SRM1801
  • Push the L and R buttons for SUB1 to send that SUB to the Main L-R mix
  • Connect your DSR112s to the L&R outputs and engage their high-pass filter
This will give you group fed subs as opposed to AUX fed subs but will prevent you from losing a monitor or FX send and for the most part accomplish the same thing. On that board to do AUX fed right(using a post fader send) you'd have to lose your FX send as it's the only post fader send.

It also should be noted(in case you didn't know) that the SUB faders are different from your AUX sends and don't affect each other.

I would let Tim, Rob, or Bob confirm my thinking before implementing this but I THINK I have it right.  :D
 

Hope this helps,
Tommy
Logged

nicklang

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #43 on: April 02, 2014, 03:25:39 PM »

Nick,

Looking at a pic of your Profx16 possibly the best way to feed your subs would be to send your bass, kick, floor tom, and any other LF producing instrument(keys, etc...) to SUB1(or 2, 3 or 4) by doing the following:
  • Disengage the send to L-R with the button by the fader for the desired channels
  • Engage the 1-2 button for the channel
  • pan the channel all the way left(to send to SUB 1 instead of both 1 and 2
  • Connect the SUB1 output to the input of one of your SRM1801s using appropriate adapters and connect the full range output of the sub to the other SRM1801
  • Push the L and R buttons for SUB1 to send that SUB to the Main L-R mix
  • Connect your DSR112s to the L&R outputs and engage their high-pass filter
This will give you group fed subs as opposed to AUX fed subs but will prevent you from losing a monitor or FX send and for the most part accomplish the same thing. On that board to do AUX fed right(using a post fader send) you'd have to lose your FX send as it's the only post fader send.

It also should be noted(in case you didn't know) that the SUB faders are different from your AUX sends and don't affect each other.

I would let Tim, Rob, or Bob confirm my thinking before implementing this but I THINK I have it right.  :D
 

Hope this helps,
Tommy

Tommy mate ......that's super helpful....thanks.....It's along the lines of what I was thinking....but wasn't sure exactly how to achieve it!!!.......

Should I be putting the bass guitar in the main L-R mix or to the sub group fader?????.......seems like an awkward instrument as the frequencies are within the range of the tops as well as the subs??

Cheers
Logged
Sound messer arounder for 7th Circle!!!
Check us out and give us a like.....
www.7thcircle.co.uk

Tommy Peel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1468
  • Longview, Texas
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #44 on: April 02, 2014, 03:33:37 PM »

Tommy mate ......that's super helpful....thanks.....It's along the lines of what I was thinking....but wasn't sure exactly how to achieve it!!!.......

Should I be putting the bass guitar in the main L-R mix or to the sub group fader?????.......seems like an awkward instrument as the frequencies are within the range of the tops as well as the subs??

Cheers

If you just put it in the SUB mix and then send the SUB mix to the main then the bass and whatever you're sending to your subs will also go to your mains.

Bass guitar signal would be:

Bass -> Channel strip -> channel fader -> SUB mix    -> subs
                                                                                 -> main mix(tops)

You definitely need the bass in the tops for the high frequencies it creates.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2014, 03:35:52 PM by Tommy Peel »
Logged

nicklang

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #45 on: April 02, 2014, 03:55:18 PM »

If you just put it in the SUB mix and then send the SUB mix to the main then the bass and whatever you're sending to your subs will also go to your mains.

Bass guitar signal would be:

Bass -> Channel strip -> channel fader -> SUB mix    -> subs
                                                                                 -> main mix(tops)

You definitely need the bass in the tops for the high frequencies it creates.

Okay....so bear in mind I'm slow witted.....lol.....

If you put the bass guitar along with the kick and floor toms to the sub mix and send out via the sub 1 out put.......but then go to the tops.....wouldn't that have defeated the point of using a sub group in the first place????......I don't really follow what you're suggesting exactly
Logged
Sound messer arounder for 7th Circle!!!
Check us out and give us a like.....
www.7thcircle.co.uk

Tommy Peel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1468
  • Longview, Texas
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #46 on: April 02, 2014, 04:01:18 PM »

Okay....so bear in mind I'm slow witted.....lol.....

If you put the bass guitar along with the kick and floor toms to the sub mix and send out via the sub 1 out put.......but then go to the tops.....wouldn't that have defeated the point of using a sub group in the first place????......I don't really follow what you're suggesting exactly

Not sure my theory is right but....

The idea behind aux/group fed subs is to keep other stuff out of the subs(vocal mics, electric guitar mics, etc...) not to keep the bass heavy stuff out of the tops. The high pass on the tops keeps them from having too much LF while the low pass on the subs keeps the HF of the kick/bass/floor tom out of the subs. This cleans up the vocals and other instruments and lets the subs do their jobs better.

I definitely welcome correction/clarification from the "real pros" anytime. :-)

Edit: spelling
Logged

nicklang

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #47 on: April 02, 2014, 04:18:41 PM »

....ah okay.....I understand you now.....

One of my concerns ...... and from what I gleaned from earlier posts was that having bass guitar and pounding kick drum, floor toms.....as well as all the other instruments and vocals ........etc all going to the tops was causing me to wear out my tops......

Maybe I misunderstood.....but I thought that even with the high pass filter turned on.......it was damaging my tops having all the band going through them.......

I just assumed (maybe wrongly) that the point of the aux mix (or sub mix in my case) was to ONLY send the higher frequencies to the tops and the lower frequencies to the subwoofers????
Logged
Sound messer arounder for 7th Circle!!!
Check us out and give us a like.....
www.7thcircle.co.uk

Corey Scogin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1266
  • Birmingham, AL, US
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #48 on: April 02, 2014, 04:37:06 PM »

Maybe I misunderstood.....but I thought that even with the high pass filter turned on.......it was damaging my tops having all the band going through them.......

I just assumed (maybe wrongly) that the point of the aux mix (or sub mix in my case) was to ONLY send the higher frequencies to the tops and the lower frequencies to the subwoofers????

Let try to simplify things a bit:

Scenario 1 "Good"
Use the internal crossover functionality of the subs/tops.  Engage the high-pass filter on the tops only if you're sending them the full-range signal, not if you're feeding them from the high-pass output of the subwoofer's built-in crossover.

Scenario 2 "Better"
Use a system processor/crossover that allows you to set the high-pass and low-pass filter points for each band (sub, main).  Many subwoofers with internal crossovers are set at 120Hz.  Using an external crossover will allow you to adjust the crossover frequency to taste.

Scenario 3 "Best"
Either using a 3-input crossover or no crossover at all, connect the mains to the stereo outputs of the mixer and the subwoofer to a group or aux output.  Only send signals that have desirable content below 100Hz to the subwoofer.  Engage the high-pass filter on the mains only if not using a crossover.  The point of an aux-fed subwoofer is not to protect the mains but to clean up any rumble from the subwoofer caused by low frequency content picked up by vocal mics and other instruments that have no business below 100Hz (or whatever the crossover point is).


*edits for clarity
« Last Edit: April 02, 2014, 04:45:37 PM by Corey Scogin »
Logged

Tommy Peel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1468
  • Longview, Texas
Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #49 on: April 02, 2014, 04:39:16 PM »

....ah okay.....I understand you now.....

One of my concerns ...... and from what I gleaned from earlier posts was that having bass guitar and pounding kick drum, floor toms.....as well as all the other instruments and vocals ........etc all going to the tops was causing me to wear out my tops......

Maybe I misunderstood.....but I thought that even with the high pass filter turned on.......it was damaging my tops having all the band going through them.......

I just assumed (maybe wrongly) that the point of the aux mix (or sub mix in my case) was to ONLY send the higher frequencies to the tops and the lower frequencies to the subwoofers????

I'll let Tim or one of the other Pros elaborate further.

I mix regularly at a small church with a full band through some JBL 15+horn tops run full range(no subs) with no problems. We run a DI'd bass and mic'd kick through it, have no issues, and expect no issues. We get as much kick and bass as we want in the room w/out pushing the system to it's limits. Anyway I doubt you'll have a problem but I'll let someone else chime in to confirm that.

And I think Corey just simplified everything pretty well. :-)
Logged

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Dissapointed with Mackie SRM450V2 and looking to upgrade
« Reply #49 on: April 02, 2014, 04:39:16 PM »


Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 7 8   Go Up
 



Site Hosted By Ashdown Technologies, Inc.

Page created in 0.034 seconds with 25 queries.