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Author Topic: VRX compression driver alternatives  (Read 1657 times)

Matthew Knischewsky

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Re: VRX compression driver alternatives
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2014, 01:49:03 pm »

And I was referring to crossover settings, of course, not specific room EQs. (Seemed like the comments were focusing later on EQs, which wasn't what I was thinking when I wrote the post.)

-Ray

Doug has really touched on something important here because sometimes the DSP settings are really quite good (like the ones in EAW's UX8800 and the V5 VerTec settings) but others are simply base line suggestions (I'm thinking JBL settings for DR260 and 480) and yet others are what seem to be detailed EQ and X-over settings but don't work because of differences between models of processors. Doing your homework is important here and knowing when it's appropriate to stray from the manufacturer's settings and why you might have to is the hard part. Now we are getting settings derived from the manufacturer actually setting up systems and measuring them and tweaking them, where as earlier settings seemed to be an afterthought. 
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: VRX compression driver alternatives
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2014, 01:57:12 pm »

Ivan -

Just curious. In the examples above, wouldn't that be better if dealt with using input EQ?   Don't you want the preset based on outside, no reflections, and then you use the input eq to adjust for room and temperature conditions, array size, etc.

Though don't get me wrong, I've had my share of disagreements with factory decisions.  I've seen examples of where factory techs made real mistakes, some obvious without listening (by looking at the preset on the factory processor vs their published preferred settings) and some by listening (wow they must have set the amp gains incorrectly between bands on the PLM presets).  I've seen several examples where factory presets had entirely incorrect limiter settings or other examples of where they didn't dot their Is and cross their Ts.

Jason
Yes the "voicing" should be done on the input side.

And yes-people do make mistakes.

But not just at the factory level.

I have seen systems tuned by some of the "best and most respected" in the business-that were obviously wrong.  The left side doesn't sound like the right side---------

So yes-it depends. 

But I would not make a blanket statement like "all factory presets need adjustments" and also "do not adjust the factory presets".  Situations vary.

Different manufacturers have different ways of dealing with it.  Some rely soley on external processing-in which all sorts of errors could be made by the user-many of whom "think" they know more than factory-but have no way to prove it.

Others make the box sound very good by itself-so it is a lot harder to screw up externally.

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A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

Doug Fowler

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Re: VRX compression driver alternatives
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2014, 08:02:06 pm »

Doug has really touched on something important here because sometimes the DSP settings are really quite good (like the ones in EAW's UX8800 and the V5 VerTec settings) but others are simply base line suggestions (I'm thinking JBL settings for DR260 and 480) and yet others are what seem to be detailed EQ and X-over settings but don't work because of differences between models of processors. Doing your homework is important here and knowing when it's appropriate to stray from the manufacturer's settings and why you might have to is the hard part. Now we are getting settings derived from the manufacturer actually setting up systems and measuring them and tweaking them, where as earlier settings seemed to be an afterthought.

Well, I suppose my point is in the beginning with DSP xovers, in many cases the manufacturers' settings were in fact not that good.   But in fairness, it was a steep learning curve for all involved. 

It's much better these days.
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Jim McKeveny

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Re: Getting Back To OP Question...
« Reply #23 on: March 17, 2014, 07:40:42 am »

IIRC the JBL 2407 is a BMS manufactured ring-radiator with a polyester diaphragm. In my experience with JBL models using these, there are one or two very tame-able peaks in the response (to my taste mind you, not to my analysis software).

If the OP routinely has difficulty achieving good results with unpowered VRX he needs to examine the whole system, environment, talent, and even his own expectations.
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Jim McKeveny

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Re: VRX compression driver alternatives
« Reply #24 on: March 17, 2014, 10:11:23 am »

about that time (excluding V-DOSC) suffered 

V-DOSC presets were very "young" then also. It seemed they were stressing the "cheese wedge/pie slice" HF transfer a bit too much. They also (correctly) demanded proper amplification.

L'Acoustics did keep up with it. As of now they probably have the best extended database(s) on their offerings. (Ex V-DOSC Paul Baumann w/JBL a tie perhaps?)
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