ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: [1] 2 3   Go Down

Author Topic: Hornless monitor  (Read 13150 times)

Jeff Bankston

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2568
Hornless monitor
« on: February 17, 2014, 05:46:51 PM »

i guess this isnt in a honkey tonk. its not wearing protection either, either.
Logged

Ivan Beaver

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9534
  • Atlanta GA
Re: Hornless monitor
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2014, 07:48:14 PM »

i guess this isnt in a honkey tonk. its not wearing protection either, either.
I thought you said it didn't have a horn?  Maybe I am missing something.

Ok hornless, not HF driverless.
Logged
A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

Jeff Bankston

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2568
Re: Hornless monitor
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2014, 07:56:21 PM »

I thought you said it didn't have a horn?  Maybe I am missing something.

Ok hornless, not HF driverless.
right , a cone for highs. and with no protecton
Logged

Kemper Watson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 708
  • Woodstock GA
Re: Hornless monitor
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2014, 08:17:48 PM »

i guess this isnt in a honkey tonk. its not wearing protection either, either.

Homebrew..
Logged

Mac Kerr

  • Old enough to know better
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7551
  • Audio Plumber
Re: Horn monitor
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2014, 08:19:57 PM »

right , a cone for highs. and with no protecton

That looks like a JBL 2301 horn to me. The 2301 was a 90º conical pattern 1" throat horn. It was intended for under a 10' throw, like you might find in a wedge monitor.

Mac
Logged

John Halliburton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 866
  • Still has hair and white pointy beard...
Re: Horn monitor
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2014, 09:36:05 PM »

That looks like a JBL 2301 horn to me. The 2301 was a 90º conical pattern 1" throat horn. It was intended for under a 10' throw, like you might find in a wedge monitor.

Mac

Here is an image from JBL literature that gives a better idea of this style of horn.  It's nickname is the potato masher.



Best regards,

John
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 09:38:57 PM by John Halliburton »
Logged

Mac Kerr

  • Old enough to know better
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7551
  • Audio Plumber
Re: Horn monitor
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2014, 10:00:11 PM »

Here is an image from JBL literature that gives a better idea of this style of horn.  It's nickname is the potato masher.



Best regards,

John

It could be the 1217-1290, but it looks more like the 2301 to me. Here is the cutsheet from  the 2301. I don' know if there is even a difference other than the apparent front mount/rear mount difference.

Mac

Logged

Ivan Beaver

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9534
  • Atlanta GA
Re: Hornless monitor
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2014, 07:29:57 AM »

Homebrew..
If you look back at old photos you will many  "variations" of this that all look "home brew".

Often the woofers were in a slant box-but there was some sort of HF attached to the top.

Often large Altec or JBL radial horns.

And this was at the top of the touring industry.

I remember seeing photos of Shynyrd in the mid 70s in which the monitors looked to be  3' tall overall.
Logged
A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

Tom Young

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 620
Re: Horn monitor
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2014, 07:35:28 AM »

I agree this looks like the JBL "potato masher" horn with lens system.

This photo is of Richie Blackmore and Rainbow and probably is from the late 1970's. It is a Tasco Sound monitor rig. I spent 6 months working with him and them in 1978. I have blocked most of these memories out  ;-)

Back in the 1970's Tasco Sound (Great Britain) employed this set up but without the perforated plate lens. The result was a very narrow (conical) coverage pattern (for MF's and HF's) that was affectionately called the "brain dart". When you were on axis to the HF horn this thing hit you like an ice pick. As long as you kept your head in that very small sweet-spot, you had clear monitors. 

I never figured out why the horn in a separate enclosure was thought to be useful in stage monitor configurations. Perhaps they changed the vertical aim angle for specific listener positions ?

Note that JBL describes these as 90 or 60 degrees WITH the perf plates. Without them, the actual horn is somewhere around 20-degrees (conical).

When I was doing sound over a wide geographical area back then, I ran into others using the potato masher HF horns and also larger (4", as in 2441, 2482) drivers with slant-plate and bent-plate lenses. No one had great success with these (in live sound) and JBL dropped them from production after a few years. Having said that, Tasco did use them for at least a few years until something better came along.

Placing perforated plates or slanted/bent plates at the horn mouth (which was also at the surface of the front baffle) may have spread out the otherwise very narrow, focused sound but it also added a huge amount of reflected energy. We all (now) know why this isn't such a great idea.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2014, 07:43:20 AM by Tom Young »
Logged
Tom Young
Electroacoustic Design Services
Oxford CT
203-888-6217

Ivan Beaver

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9534
  • Atlanta GA
Re: Horn monitor
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2014, 07:35:40 AM »

That looks like a JBL 2301 horn to me. The 2301 was a 90º conical pattern 1" throat horn. It was intended for under a 10' throw, like you might find in a wedge monitor.

Mac
Those were pretty popular in the 80s for monitors-I saw them a lot.  I have never actually used any-since all of my monitors were my build using "normal" horns.

So a question for the other 'ol timers-how well did they actually work?  The horn mouth is very small for the pattern-and I suspect there would be lots of interference.

I don't remember any other products that had that type of horn lens.  Maybe there is a reason.

Of course it is hard to compare the sound of something 30yrs ago to today-without having a current comparison.

I did do a repair job on a monitor that had the "horn" (if you can call it that) but not the "masher" part.

I thought it was a pretty worthless monitor since the pattern on the HF was so narrow if you moved 1' it was completely different.

I suspect the "masher" part widened the pattern-but at what sonic expense.

Just wondering since I have no direct experience with the whole product.
Logged
A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Horn monitor
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2014, 07:35:40 AM »


Pages: [1] 2 3   Go Up
 



Site Hosted By Ashdown Technologies, Inc.

Page created in 0.04 seconds with 25 queries.