ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6   Go Down

Author Topic: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?  (Read 3666 times)

Andrew Broughton

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 291
    • Check Check One Two Forums
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #30 on: January 31, 2014, 01:13:58 pm »

  ?!? Why would they?
Because they are concerned about counterfeits?
Logged
-Andy

"Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle..."

http://www.checkcheckonetwo.com
Saving lives through Digital Audio, Programming and Electronics.

Debbie Dunkley

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 560
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #31 on: January 31, 2014, 01:14:37 pm »

It makes me wonder if there is something that Shure could do to the SM that could not be counterfeited. Not quite as easy as a watermark on a $20 bill is it?
Logged
A young child says to his mother, "Mom, when I grow up I'm going to be a musician." She replies, "Well honey, you know you can't do both."

Tim McCulloch

  • SR Forums
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 12653
  • Wichita, Kansas USA
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #32 on: January 31, 2014, 01:24:14 pm »

Because they are concerned about counterfeits?

I'd assert that it does not benefit Shure to pay for lots of shipping of suspect products.  And under Customs/import laws any product found to be counterfeit is subject to immediate seizure.

So think of this scenario:  Andrew gets a UPS pickup label from Shure, who spends $6 to have the item delivered to them.  They decide it's an imported fake, and refuse to return it or they call ICE who seizes it.  Andrew is now out whatever product he sent in and Shure has created PR problem for themselves.  Andrew might be out $30-$50, but Shure now has a "customer" who's pissed off at them and decides to buy Audio Technica or EV.

If it's genuine, will the customer agree to pay for return shipping?

I don't see how Shure benefits from this type of engagement with end users.
Logged
Chewing through your wimpy dreams
They eat without a sound,
Digesting England by the pound.

Debbie Dunkley

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 560
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #33 on: January 31, 2014, 01:36:39 pm »

Shure responded to me...


Response By Email (Rick Waller) (01/31/2014 12:29 PM)

To determine if the mic is counterfeit, please send us detailed pictures of the mic with the grill on and off, the box, and all literature that came in the box. Keep all file sizes to below 300k. Do NOT reply via email. Emails with many large attachments will likely be rejected. Instead, login at the following link: (http://shure.custhelp.com/app/utils/login_form/redirect/account%252Foverview)/track/AvPl_wqODv8S~XPzGmIe~yL3UvsKCS75Mv86~zj~PP~z If you have not created a password yet, follow the link that says "Forgot your username or password?" and then "Reset your Password". Our support system is web based. Once logged into the web site, you will be able to update this incident and attach pictures. Make certain the pictures are in focus.

Good result so far and I am impressed.
I'll upload some good quality pics of everything I have and download to Shure. I only have 6 of the mics available to me but I'm not worried about the 7th one anyway.
Logged
A young child says to his mother, "Mom, when I grow up I'm going to be a musician." She replies, "Well honey, you know you can't do both."

Airton Pereira

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 149
    • The Knutz
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #34 on: January 31, 2014, 01:36:55 pm »

I'd assert that it does not benefit Shure to pay for lots of shipping of suspect products.  And under Customs/import laws any product found to be counterfeit is subject to immediate seizure.

So think of this scenario:  Andrew gets a UPS pickup label from Shure, who spends $6 to have the item delivered to them.  They decide it's an imported fake, and refuse to return it or they call ICE who seizes it.  Andrew is now out whatever product he sent in and Shure has created PR problem for themselves.  Andrew might be out $30-$50, but Shure now has a "customer" who's pissed off at them and decides to buy Audio Technica or EV.

If it's genuine, will the customer agree to pay for return shipping?

I don't see how Shure benefits from this type of engagement with end users.

The only way they would benefit is if they sent the customer a genuine Shure replacing the fake one. I mean benefit in PR but they would lose millions doing this. There's no winning situation for Shure.
I think the mics should have a control number and the customer should be able to check this number online to confirm it is genuine.
Logged
Drummer and Sound Engineer for The Knutz.

Steve Garris

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 169
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #35 on: January 31, 2014, 01:37:33 pm »

Debbie

I just went through this same thing, and was convinced by those web sites and Youtube video's that I had a fake SM58 that I purchased new in 2001. I purchased a real, but older 58 from Craigslist, and the next day I  looked at but did not purchase a fake. Here's what I discovered:

Many of those sites make incorrect claims:
Some older SM58's have a sticker just below the ball instead of the newer silkscreen - real 58's.
The older stickers say SM58 - Dynamic - Lo Z, the newer ones have repeated SM58 silkscreened - both real 58's.
The fake that I looked at had the "Caution" sticker on the capsule underneath the ball.
Some of the real 58's have dark grey threads on the main body where the ball threads in place, instead of the shiny silver threads - real 58's.
All real 58's have transformers, weigh about 300 grams, and have a yellow and green wire inside. I purchased a 90's model that has a 3rd black wire inside.
The bag might be smooth or textured leather, should be about 10" long, and will have either a Made in China label or stamped Made in Mexico (I have both, genuine Shure).
You cannot tell by looking at the flange at the bottom of the ball, this has changed over the years.
The metel "rib" around the center of the ball should be about 3mm, on the fake I looked at it was noticeably wider.
I contacted Shure regarding my mic with the Lo Z sticker, and they were very responsive.
I asked about the sticker and color of the threads, and Michael Pettersen replied:
[Yes, a label was used for many decades. I do not remember black threads, though. Photos would help.]

So I took my 2001 and 90's 58's to a friend that has been in the business for 30 years, and we plugged each one into a speaker and tested them audibly. His were sent to Shure for refurbishing, so we know they were genuine. All of these mic's sounded exactly the same. Additionally, they all had dark grey threads underneath the ball.

When I went to look at the fake, I advised the seller that I was concerned and sent links to several sites. She was very accommodating and I could tell she had no idea of the fake's. I noticed the Caution sticker on the capsule and the thicker ring around the ball. I did not unscrew the capsule to look at the wires. But the real test is done by listening to the mic!
I brought along a small bass headphone amp, and using adapters I could plug the mic into the battery powered amp and listen through headphones. The difference was immediately noticeable, the fake being very thin sounding and shrilly - terrible!

So all I can say at this point is you have to be able to listen and compare if you wish to purchase these mic's on the used market or at cheap prices online.

Wow - 8 replies while I was typing!
« Last Edit: January 31, 2014, 01:42:03 pm by Steve Garris »
Logged

Debbie Dunkley

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 560
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #36 on: January 31, 2014, 01:50:06 pm »

Debbie

I just went through this same thing, and was convinced by those web sites and Youtube video's that I had a fake SM58 that I purchased new in 2001. I purchased a real, but older 58 from Craigslist, and the next day I  looked at but did not purchase a fake. Here's what I discovered:

Many of those sites make incorrect claims:
Some older SM58's have a sticker just below the ball instead of the newer silkscreen - real 58's.
The older stickers say SM58 - Dynamic - Lo Z, the newer ones have repeated SM58 silkscreened - both real 58's.
The fake that I looked at had the "Caution" sticker on the capsule underneath the ball.
Some of the real 58's have dark grey threads on the main body where the ball threads in place, instead of the shiny silver threads - real 58's.
All real 58's have transformers, weigh about 300 grams, and have a yellow and green wire inside. I purchased a 90's model that has a 3rd black wire inside.
The bag might be smooth or textured leather, should be about 10" long, and will have either a Made in China label or stamped Made in Mexico (I have both, genuine Shure).
You cannot tell by looking at the flange at the bottom of the ball, this has changed over the years.
The metel "rib" around the center of the ball should be about 3mm, on the fake I looked at it was noticeably wider.
I contacted Shure regarding my mic with the Lo Z sticker, and they were very responsive.
I asked about the sticker and color of the threads, and Michael Pettersen replied:
[Yes, a label was used for many decades. I do not remember black threads, though. Photos would help.]

So I took my 2001 and 90's 58's to a friend that has been in the business for 30 years, and we plugged each one into a speaker and tested them audibly. His were sent to Shure for refurbishing, so we know they were genuine. All of these mic's sounded exactly the same. Additionally, they all had dark grey threads underneath the ball.

When I went to look at the fake, I advised the seller that I was concerned and sent links to several sites. She was very accommodating and I could tell she had no idea of the fake's. I noticed the Caution sticker on the capsule and the thicker ring around the ball. I did not unscrew the capsule to look at the wires. But the real test is done by listening to the mic!
I brought along a small bass headphone amp, and using adapters I could plug the mic into the battery powered amp and listen through headphones. The difference was immediately noticeable, the fake being very thin sounding and shrilly - terrible!

So all I can say at this point is you have to be able to listen and compare if you wish to purchase these mic's on the used market or at cheap prices online.

Wow - 8 replies while I was typing!

Hey Steve...you just hit on just about every 'difference' I have come across online - thank you for taking the time.
I am even more convinced mine are all real now because of some of your comments. My 2 older ones have the ohm sign on them and are obviously stickers yet this is 'supposed' to be one of the big give-aways.
Also some of mine have silver threads and some dark gray - again gray is often claimed to be fake-not so as you have confirmed.

Good info here.
thanks again - very helpful to everyone.
Logged
A young child says to his mother, "Mom, when I grow up I'm going to be a musician." She replies, "Well honey, you know you can't do both."

John Roberts {JR}

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 12934
  • Hickory, Mississippi, USA
    • Resotune
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #37 on: January 31, 2014, 01:50:54 pm »

I can imagine a hypothetical situation where Shure may be interested in identifying a new vector where counterfeit product is making it's way into the domestic market, and in that unusual case they would probably make the customer whole with a new real mic (their cost is probably less than the shipping). Other than that not worth all those expensive touches. 

Yes they can get counterfeti goods confiscated at ports of entry, but more effective for container loads than onesy twosey individual sales, unless some seller is only selling counterfeit Shure goods.

JR 
Logged
Tune it or don't play it... please

Lyle Williams

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 246
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #38 on: January 31, 2014, 02:19:41 pm »

If you have a whole bunch of mics that sound and handle the same, and you are convinced that some are genuine, then all are genuine.  It's that simple.
Logged

John Roberts {JR}

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 12934
  • Hickory, Mississippi, USA
    • Resotune
Re: SM58 fakes....Not so easy to detect?
« Reply #39 on: January 31, 2014, 02:33:46 pm »

If you have a whole bunch of mics that sound and handle the same, and you are convinced that some are genuine, then all are genuine.  It's that simple.

It is not completely out of the question for a counterfeit mic to behave reasonably close to the SM58, while most counterfeit sellers probably spend more effort on looking the same and less effort on sounding the same.

JR
Logged
Tune it or don't play it... please
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6   Go Up
 


Page created in 0.092 seconds with 23 queries.