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Author Topic: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?  (Read 13106 times)

thompson.sam

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Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« on: January 29, 2014, 11:56:10 AM »

Have been asked to quote our new stage monitors to a conventional/conservative style of church.

They need monitors desperately but refuse to use a standard stage monitor/ floor wedge due to it's "hideous look on stage". They've asked for something very low profile and slim. And an option to integrate it into a recessed design concept. My father is a fabricator and said he'd create something that we could easily mount a slim speaker to that could be kept or flipped down when not in use and then flipped up when in use.

I've looked a lot at JBL line array speakers because they're very slim in design. However once flipped on their side, they'll lose their horizontal dispersion to cover a nice vicinity of the stage on either side of their podium.

Do you know of a good, slim (sound bar style) speaker that has good horizontal dispersion when on it's side, and adequate power rating for live performance use? 
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Jeff Carter

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Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2014, 12:27:36 PM »

I'd be tempted to think about sidefills (which could be a little easier to hide) or even in-ear monitors rather than floor wedges in that kind of scenario.
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g'bye, Dick Rees

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Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2014, 12:54:49 PM »

Have been asked to quote our new stage monitors to a conventional/conservative style of church.

They need monitors desperately but refuse to use a standard stage monitor/ floor wedge due to it's "hideous look on stage". They've asked for something very low profile and slim. And an option to integrate it into a recessed design concept. My father is a fabricator and said he'd create something that we could easily mount a slim speaker to that could be kept or flipped down when not in use and then flipped up when in use.

I've looked a lot at JBL line array speakers because they're very slim in design. However once flipped on their side, they'll lose their horizontal dispersion to cover a nice vicinity of the stage on either side of their podium.

Do you know of a good, slim (sound bar style) speaker that has good horizontal dispersion when on it's side, and adequate power rating for live performance use?

If you make the recess large enough to let out a usable amount of sound, you'll be left with a fairly large set of holes in the floor...enough for someone to step in and take a tumble.  If the in-floor monitor pop up half way, they're still ugly lumps.  AND any such installed monitors will have fixed, inflexible coverage to go along with the sonic anomalies attending.

Side-wash for vocals can indeed be nice and unobtrusive.  Otherwise, IEM's or Micro-wedges. 
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Tom Young

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Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2014, 04:49:01 PM »

Stage monitors built into stages are a potential engineering nightmare. If they are completely recessed (or flush) they must be firing at an angle (towards the listeners) and this means there is a cavity plus various chamber members that reflect the sound. There goes your pristine frequency response.

They also require thick perforated steel grills that are walkable. In order to be as acoustically transparent as possible the holes will be 1/4"-3/8" and these are risky with women in high heels. An they tend to collect dirt, dust and chemical cleaners used when shampooing the stage carpet. And, of course, once you commit to these the seats cannot be moved.

You are correct that a line array (column speaker) will not work well in the rotating, flush mount configuration. But something like a Meyer UPM-1P (or 2P), EAW JF80, EV Xi1082 would probably work well in this application. You will still have a small cavity which will exhibit some suck-out but probably not a huge amount.
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Jonathan Kok

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Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2014, 05:02:12 PM »

Have been asked to quote our new stage monitors to a conventional/conservative style of church.

They need monitors desperately but refuse to use a standard stage monitor/ floor wedge due to it's "hideous look on stage". They've asked for something very low profile and slim. And an option to integrate it into a recessed design concept. My father is a fabricator and said he'd create something that we could easily mount a slim speaker to that could be kept or flipped down when not in use and then flipped up when in use.

I've looked a lot at JBL line array speakers because they're very slim in design. However once flipped on their side, they'll lose their horizontal dispersion to cover a nice vicinity of the stage on either side of their podium.

Do you know of a good, slim (sound bar style) speaker that has good horizontal dispersion when on it's side, and adequate power rating for live performance use?
I seem to remember seeing a post in the past of someone having used a column array as a subtle stage lip fill speaker. I believe they used K-Array's, possibly the KK52? It has a selectable 10 or 60deg vertical dispersion.
http://www.k-array.com/en/professional-sound/installation/install-speakers/kk52.html
Of course, all other caveats mentioned above still play a factor.
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Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2014, 05:19:16 PM »

I seem to remember seeing a post in the past of someone having used a column array as a subtle stage lip fill speaker. I believe they used K-Array's, possibly the KK52? It has a selectable 10 or 60deg vertical dispersion.

Which in the OP's case would translate to horizontal...

Meanwhile, the 120 or 150 degree (whichever it is) would be reflecting off the floor and the ceiling.

Wronger you could not be.

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Jonathan Kok

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Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2014, 05:20:42 PM »

Which in the OP's case would translate to horizontal...

Meanwhile, the 120 or 150 degree (whichever it is) would be reflecting off the floor and the ceiling.

Wronger you could not be.
Um..
110x10, or 110x60.
At least, that's my understanding of the spec's. Hard to figure out which orientation is which...
;)
Alternatively, KP52, 90x10 or 90x45. Again, hard to figure out which way's which.

EDIT: found it in the manual. I mistakenly assumed it was intended as a horizontal array (kinda how the picture on the website shows). But you're correct, it's a vertical array. So 110 vertical and 60 horizontal (or 90x45). Not unreasonable as a monitor. Ideal? No.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2014, 05:33:20 PM by Jonathan Kok »
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Cailen Waddell

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Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #7 on: January 29, 2014, 06:47:54 PM »

Danley SH mini or SH micro.  Whichever one is the 8" coax.... That's pretty small and could be relatively unobtrusive even if it popped up a couple inches.  This is assuming reasonable monitor levels are expected from it.
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Frank DeWitt

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Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2014, 09:12:19 AM »

They have three choices

1  Look good.
2. Sound good.
3  Use In ear Monitors.
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Scott Jordan

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Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2014, 11:28:48 AM »

Have been asked to quote our new stage monitors to a conventional/conservative style of church.

They need monitors desperately but refuse to use a standard stage monitor/ floor wedge due to it's "hideous look on stage". They've asked for something very low profile and slim. And an option to integrate it into a recessed design concept. My father is a fabricator and said he'd create something that we could easily mount a slim speaker to that could be kept or flipped down when not in use and then flipped up when in use.

I've looked a lot at JBL line array speakers because they're very slim in design. However once flipped on their side, they'll lose their horizontal dispersion to cover a nice vicinity of the stage on either side of their podium.

Do you know of a good, slim (sound bar style) speaker that has good horizontal dispersion when on it's side, and adequate power rating for live performance use?

Take a look at this offering from K-Array: http://www.k-array.com/en/professional-sound/portable/portable-monitors/krm33.html

10.5"x12", 4" tall, available in powered and unpowered. The nice thing with this monitor is that you can switch it between spot (30 degree horizontal, so covers right in front of it) or floor (90 degree horizontal, for wider areas). Vertical dispersion out is 90 degrees. Saw and experienced this at InfoCOMM last year, def had the output abilities, very small footprint, sounded fantastic. Street price on these is approx. $1500 for the powered, $760 for the passive version, a dealer would probably have their price they sell these at.
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Scott Jordan

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Slim Stage Monitor Ideas?
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2014, 11:28:48 AM »


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