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Author Topic: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recording Setup  (Read 43432 times)

Tommy Peel

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recordind Setup
« Reply #10 on: December 05, 2013, 07:22:02 PM »

I think it's pretty clear they did this because of Soundcraft's existing investment in MADI for their higher end desks. I agree, though.
That makes sense. It just seems like MADI (and AES50 for that matter) are very limited versus Dante and don't appear to offer many, if any, benefits.

Anyway that's just my observation and opinion which probably isn't worth much. I also like(and probably the manufacturer's don't like) that Dante is universal for the most part across brands and, as a standard, is controlled by a 3rd party.

Sent from my Nexus 4 running OmniROM 4.4 KitKat using Tapatalk Pro

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Mac Kerr

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recordind Setup
« Reply #11 on: December 05, 2013, 08:11:44 PM »

That makes sense. It just seems like MADI (and AES50 for that matter) are very limited versus Dante and don't appear to offer many, if any, benefits.

Anyway that's just my observation and opinion which probably isn't worth much. I also like(and probably the manufacturer's don't like) that Dante is universal for the most part across brands and, as a standard, is controlled by a 3rd party.

I am a big proponent of Dante, but another way of looking at it is that if you are dealing with 1 or 2 stageboxes going to 1 or even 2 consoles only, Dante doesn't offer much over MADI, and it can be more complex to run.

In the circumstances where Dante's flexibility comes into play it (or other systems like Ravenna, or Nexus) seems to be the way to go, but if what you need is point to point high channel count signal transport, MADI is hard to beat.

MADI is an AES standard.

Mac
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Tommy Peel

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recordind Setup
« Reply #12 on: December 05, 2013, 09:06:51 PM »

I am a big proponent of Dante, but another way of looking at it is that if you are dealing with 1 or 2 stageboxes going to 1 or even 2 consoles only, Dante doesn't offer much over MADI, and it can be more complex to run.

In the circumstances where Dante's flexibility comes into play it (or other systems like Ravenna, or Nexus) seems to be the way to go, but if what you need is point to point high channel count signal transport, MADI is hard to beat.

MADI is an AES standard.

Mac

Thanks for the clarification. Learn something new every day.

Sent from my Nexus 4 running OmniROM 4.4 KitKat using Tapatalk Pro

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Michael Grimaila

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recordind Setup
« Reply #13 on: December 06, 2013, 07:24:19 PM »

Thanks for the inputs....

Michael
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Behringer X32 / X32 Rack
Soundcraft Si Expression 3 / Soundcraft Mini Stage Box 32 / Soundcraft MADI USB & Dual CAT5 & Dual Optical MADI cards
6 x Sennheiser EW300 G3 / Sennheiser EW572 G3 / Sennheiser EW365 G3 / Sennheiser EW352 G3
2 x Yamaha DSR115 / 2 x QSC KW 118

Adam Cooke

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recordind Setup
« Reply #14 on: December 07, 2013, 03:29:44 PM »

I am a big proponent of Dante, but another way of looking at it is that if you are dealing with 1 or 2 stageboxes going to 1 or even 2 consoles only, Dante doesn't offer much over MADI, and it can be more complex to run.

In the circumstances where Dante's flexibility comes into play it (or other systems like Ravenna, or Nexus) seems to be the way to go, but if what you need is point to point high channel count signal transport, MADI is hard to beat.

MADI is an AES standard.

Mac
Good point. One thing I've been wondering... do Dante and MADI differ in their ability to remotely control mic preamp gain and phantom power?


It seems that many of the digital snake options that are bundled with consoles use MADI, and they include control of the stagebox. The Soundcraft Mini Stageboxes, for example. If I was to get a Dante card for the Expression, and then eventually some kind of Dante stagebox, would the console be able to control it? Is that possible with Dante? Does either Dante or MADI support preamp gain/48V control as part of the standard, so you can mix and match consoles and stageboxes, or do you have to use matched equipment from the same manufacturer for that to work?


Forgive my ignorance...
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David Sturzenbecher

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recordind Setup
« Reply #15 on: December 07, 2013, 04:05:34 PM »

Dante doesn't have control functions baked in, but doesn't have any problems living on a network with control data. The yamaha CL series is one example of this being done out of the box. If soundcraft offers up a Dante stage box option, I would bet it would have preamp control.
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Bob Leonard

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recordind Setup
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2013, 12:10:46 AM »

Those are the type questions Soundcraft should answer in all actuality. My take on the subject is about the same as David's with the exception you should keep in mind that you are extending the channel count and full control of the additional channels will depend on the card and the stage box as a combination. They must work together.

Keep in mind that Soundcraft and Studer stage boxes will work with the SI series of boards, however, it's always best to check with Soundcraft before you spend the money. I'll see if I can get a company rep to chime in here and do some research during the week.
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Adam Cooke

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recordind Setup
« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2013, 11:47:33 PM »

Those are the type questions Soundcraft should answer in all actuality. My take on the subject is about the same as David's with the exception you should keep in mind that you are extending the channel count and full control of the additional channels will depend on the card and the stage box as a combination. They must work together.

Keep in mind that Soundcraft and Studer stage boxes will work with the SI series of boards, however, it's always best to check with Soundcraft before you spend the money. I'll see if I can get a company rep to chime in here and do some research during the week.
Thanks for the replies! I've been trying to read up on the standards but I haven't really found very much detail about the preamp control aspect of either MADI or Dante. I'm getting the impression that both Dante and MADI standardize the multichannel audio transmission, but that the preamp control is proprietary for each manufacturer, although Dante control can be run on the same cabling with the audio network, and MADI preamps can be controlled by MIDI within the MADI stream, or by other means?


If that's the case, it seems that it would be worth including preamp control in those standards, so it would be possible to connect more varied devices and still have preamp control. That would make it easier to use existing equipment inventory, cross rent, upgrade, etc. All the advantages we typically get from having standards.


Regardless, I likely won't be investing in a digital stagebox any time very soon anyway, unless it's bundled with a console, but it would be great to be able to mix and match stageboxes and consoles eventually.
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Michael Grimaila

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recording Setup
« Reply #18 on: December 16, 2013, 10:00:21 PM »

I decided to grab the Soundcraft Multi Digital Card.  I was having trouble finding one in stock and just noticed that Full Compass just got some in stock as I just ordered one!
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Behringer X32 / X32 Rack
Soundcraft Si Expression 3 / Soundcraft Mini Stage Box 32 / Soundcraft MADI USB & Dual CAT5 & Dual Optical MADI cards
6 x Sennheiser EW300 G3 / Sennheiser EW572 G3 / Sennheiser EW365 G3 / Sennheiser EW352 G3
2 x Yamaha DSR115 / 2 x QSC KW 118

Samuel Rees

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Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recording Setup
« Reply #19 on: December 16, 2013, 11:33:46 PM »

Neither standard includes control data, AFAIK.
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Soundcraft Si Expression Live + Recording Setup
« Reply #19 on: December 16, 2013, 11:33:46 PM »


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