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Author Topic: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?  (Read 3336 times)

Tim Halligan

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #30 on: December 01, 2013, 12:35:12 pm »

It is likely that a small percentage of audio people will return to analogue too. Just because they want to.

Saw Muse on Saturday night.

FOH was Midas XL4 - I think...I was a fair way away - with lots of outboard.

Some guys are lucky to be able to make choices based on sonics and workflow, rather than economics.

Cheers,
Tim
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Tim Weaver

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #31 on: December 01, 2013, 07:33:37 pm »

It's funny how many "analog holdouts" I see. Without fail, by the time those guys have mixed a dozen shows on a digi board, they figure out that the benefits of digital far, far outweigh the warm, fuzzies they get with an analog desk.

Most of the time, just mixing the opener on the same desk, on the same channels, using the same mics on stage is enough. Just press a button and voila! ready for the headliner!


Anyone here remember carrying those adhesive dots to mark your knobs with?
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Justice C. Bigler

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #32 on: December 01, 2013, 07:45:56 pm »

Before we become too enamored w/ being thoroughly modern technocrats we should remember how digital mixers work.

Take some pristine ANALOGUE sound and...

yawn....you lost me at pristine analog.... ::)
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Mark McFarlane

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #33 on: December 02, 2013, 08:28:22 am »

...
Anyone here remember carrying those adhesive dots to mark your knobs with?

Still using them on my 01v96 console with non-recallable preamps....
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TJ (Tom) Cornish

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #34 on: December 02, 2013, 08:50:21 am »

+1 Mr. Leonard!
 Before we become too enamored w/ being thoroughly modern technocrats we should remember how digital mixers work.
Take some pristine ANALOGUE sound and chop it into millions of bits. Now re-assemble those millions of pieces BACK into ANALOGUE sound. Now believe it's better because hey, it's  Digital, it's NEW and it's Hi-tech. 

Soundmen! Do you have enough headaches and problems? No? here's your chance to add buggy software, compatibility issues and hard drive failures and software crashes to your list. Don't miss it! Did I mention this is all available at only 3 to 10 x the cost!? Yippee.
Of coarse you will be able to save scenes with variable results and spend 3 days with a manual trying to figure out how to patch a 1/3 octave eq across an aux out. Fun. fun. fun.
One of the most positive results of all this is when you realize that if you have the network skills to get a tablet wi-fi'd into a computer/mixer software working dependably you could probly get an I T job that pays about 5 times what being a soundman does. Hmmm. scratch, scratch.

Maidson lives in Haiti which is a tropical climate. His sound systems move at parade pace on a big flatbed truck through the crowded streets of Haiti during Carnivale powered by a big ass generator. Not sure that's the kind of environment I'd recommend a big digital mixer for.
The day will come when digital mixers are solving more problems than they create.   Still too close to 50/50 on that for me.
  I understand with many situations "cool factor" is paramount and in a large metro area you gotta have a digital desk.  In smaller market areas of America and out on the frontiers of the third world it's a little different. Analogue consoles like Maidson mentioned still sound wonderful and dependability will likely not be an issue until looong after the mixer has earned it's investment back! Buy a digital board if you want but if you listen carefully you might hear laughter from corporate types who know what planned obsolescense means. (It means they'll have a good bit more of your money soon for the upgrade) Ha Ha.  (end rant)
Oh yeah, my choice for mixer. #1 APB unsurpassed dependability.
#2 Midas.  Mixed on a Verona for 3 years in a Casino. Never a single problem. lovely feature set. -and the prestige of a Midas.  I heard NO better sound  from any of the 3 or 4 acts that brought in whatever big new digital desk they were traveling with.       #3 A&H  Great sound, great feature set, dependable and reasonable price.    #4  Soundcraft  Great sound, great feature set, sexy looks, reasonable price.  Happy sailing!
Have a large analog console you're trying to sell?

I'm not sure if you've checked the prices of digital boards lately, but unless you're comparing digital to the nearly scrap metal prices most analog consoles are selling for these days, digital is WAY cheaper than analog has ever been.  When you factor in trucking costs and labor savings, the difference is even bigger.

I'm pretty sure that tropical climates aren't particularly good for analog electronics either - jack corrosion, pot issues, etc. 

Good luck with that MH4/56 on your parade float.
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Kevin McDonough

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #35 on: December 02, 2013, 09:57:55 am »

Have a large analog console you're trying to sell?

I'm not sure if you've checked the prices of digital boards lately, but unless you're comparing digital to the nearly scrap metal prices most analog consoles are selling for these days, digital is WAY cheaper than analog has ever been.  When you factor in trucking costs and labor savings, the difference is even bigger.

I'm pretty sure that tropical climates aren't particularly good for analog electronics either - jack corrosion, pot issues, etc. 

Good luck with that MH4/56 on your parade float.

Yeah I was gonna say the same. Just the board on its own yes an analogue is usually cheaper than its digital counterpart channel for channel. But that's not a like for like comparison, you're not just buying a board on its own.

When you factor in that you usually get many more outputs, many more routing options, racks of outboard built in etc, replicating all that with analogue tips it way over the scale in price, transport costs and headaches, labour, maintenance, patching and cable costs etc etc.

With the sound of even small basic desks like GLD, soundcraft expression etc etc being so good nowadays, there are many more weak links in the system (acoustics of venue, choice and set up of PA, proper delay and crossover settings, the mixing ability of the bag of bones pushing the buttons, quality of the instruments & players on stage) that you'd need to concentrate on way before the slight differences in an analogue vs good modern digital desk became your biggest limiting factor.

k


« Last Edit: December 02, 2013, 11:38:00 am by Kevin McDonough »
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Tommy Peel

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #36 on: December 02, 2013, 11:18:05 am »

Still using them on my 01v96 console with non-recallable preamps....

I use the "take a picture of the knobs with a smartphone" settings recall method all the time.  ::) Of course "back in the day" there weren't any smartphones to be taking pictures with. I love it when the band insists on switching singers on a given mic(despite my protests during practice/sound check)... Then it's a mad dash to get the settings "recalled" from my phone before the next song.  :o
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EvanKirkendall

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #37 on: December 02, 2013, 11:40:33 am »

Which analog console would you prefer to see at FOH from a sound company for under 1500 to 3,000 attendance shows?


Those are the mixers that i work with this year.
Allen heath GL3800
APB Spectra-T/Ti
Soundcraft MH
Midas "Verona, Siena ... "

The answer to your question is: none of the above.

Analog is dead, and no regional PA companies should be investing money in analog consoles if they want a chance to stay relevant and compete. I see analog desks stuck in club installs because they were able to get them cheap. But, the number of analog desks left in "A-list" clubs is quickly diminishing.

Do yourself a favor and buy a Yamaha M7CL. It's the pm4k of digital consoles. It's nobody's first choice, but it is accepted by everyone, it always works, and it beats the pants off of any of the analog toys you mentioned.



Evan
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dick rees

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #38 on: December 02, 2013, 11:54:53 am »

The answer to your question is: none of the above.

Analog is dead, and no regional PA companies should be investing money in analog consoles if they want a chance to stay relevant and compete. I see analog desks stuck in club installs because they were able to get them cheap. But, the number of analog desks left in "A-list" clubs is quickly diminishing.

Do yourself a favor and buy a Yamaha M7CL. It's the pm4k of digital consoles. It's nobody's first choice, but it is accepted by everyone, it always works, and it beats the pants off of any of the analog toys you mentioned.



Evan

Take your digital bias and stick it.
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Which analog console would you like to see at FOH ( Medium Show) today ?
« Reply #39 on: December 02, 2013, 12:01:55 pm »

Take your digital bias and stick it.

Dick, where's the the smiley for "irony"?  Trading in your StudioLive and Qu16 for a PM4000?

My mother ironies and my father steels... ;)
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