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Author Topic: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?  (Read 36402 times)

Mike Pyle

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Re: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #280 on: February 11, 2014, 06:05:28 pm »

Dear Guys,

We are in the process of developing a specific Ethercon cable for our digital consoles made for us by Neutrik. It will be built to the proper specification and also be quite affordable.  We will follow up when the cable is available via our distributors.

Best Regards,
Joe Sanborn
Senior Manager, Marketing Communications
MUSIC Group
BEHRINGER

Will it have a reinforced jacket?
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Mike Pyle  Audiopyle Sound  707-315-6204
Dealer For: Yorkville, EV, QSC, RCF, FBT, SLS, Renkus Heinz, Danley Sound Labs, Tannoy, Lab Gruppen, Powersoft, VTC, EAW, Allen & Heath, Ashly, APB, Denon, Rane, Audix, One Systems, OnPoint Audio, Beyerdynamic, Presonus, K&M, Ultimate, Global Truss, Road Ready, SKB, Gator, Radial Engineering, Turbosound, dB Technologies, American DJ, Odyssey, ProCo, Rapco, CBI, Elation, Mipro, Chauvet, Blizzard, Shure, Whirlwind, BenQ, Yamaha, Line 6, more...

Tim Padrick

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Re: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #281 on: February 12, 2014, 12:11:07 am »

Sorry if this has been mentioned: There are EtherCons that can be installed on pre-terminated cables.
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Corey Scogin

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behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #282 on: February 12, 2014, 01:04:17 am »

Sorry if this has been mentioned: There are EtherCons that can be installed on pre-terminated cables.

As a quick reference for anyone looking:

Ethercon connectors for pre-terminated cables are
NE8MC (silver) and
NE8MC-B (black)

Ethercon connectors for yet-to-be-terminated cables are
NE8MC-1 (silver) and
NE8MC-B-1 (black)

The only difference is the boot.  One is 2 piece for fitting over the RJ45 connector, the other is very similar to an XLR boot and slides on before attaching the RJ45.
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John Ng

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Re: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #283 on: February 17, 2014, 03:11:13 am »

Thought I'd give an update to my experience. We rolled our own cables, using STP CAT-5e, shielded RJ45 connectors and Ethercon connectors (i.e. continuity between the two metal ethercon shells). Although it hasn't been as dry as of late, I've still shocked the board once in a while and we haven't had any dropouts in a few weeks. Something interesting to note is we use 2-S16s, and we've only used a shielded Ethercon setup from the X-32 to the first S-16. The S-16 to S-16 connection still uses a non-ethercon cable that doesn't use a shielded RJ-45 connector.

At the same time we also eliminated another variable, which is people/chairs stepping on the cable (our cable is a permanent installation, we re-routed it to avoid any problems). But I think the ethercon is the major contributing factor.
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Dan Mortensen

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Re: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #284 on: February 20, 2014, 12:41:31 pm »

Hi All,

As reported earlier ITT, a friend of mine got (for his work at a major theater here) a new Midas Pro3, and it came with a couple of 100meter reels of rugged Cat6 (I think, might be CAT5e) STP with Ethercons. He needed to put the CAT for his console in conduit from mix position to stage, so instead of chopping off an end of his cables, he got some raw cable, ran it through the conduit, and terminated it. All was well, and he kept the reels of terminated cable for future use.

I have a multi-stage festival coming up and have not yet found a permanent STP solution for the systems (all X32's), so he was going to let me borrow the reels of STP to cover two of the stages, and brought them by. When I connected one to an S16 and X32 and shocked the S16 with a modified BBQ sparker, it completely and immediately lost sync!

Looking closer at the cable, it clearly says "UTP" on it, not STP.

He hadn't looked closely at it (or even opened the boxes), and was shocked to learn that he'd gotten the wrong cable.

He called Midas Service, and, long story short, they didn't reply to him for several weeks, but finally did so yesterday.

Actually, he said two guys separately called him, Frank and Kyle, and each told him the same thing: although some early versions of the XL8 had a problem with UTP, Midas went into them and fixed what was lacking, so that they and all other Midas consoles now work just fine with UTP. All Midas consoles now ship with UTP when cable is provided.

This seems significantly different than what we've heard about X32's and the reasons for their need for STP. It now appears to me that there is something lacking in the X32 in their resistance to sparking, and the STP is a bandaid to fix that lack.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not about to renounce the X32, I still think it's a wonderful console, it would just be nice to get a straight story and understand why things are as they are. If there's a way to fix the S16 so that it works with UTP, that would be money well-spent IMO.

Dan

PS John Ng, that's good news that your problems were solved. Interesting that you only need to go STP to the first S16. I'll try that, shock it, and report back. I would have thought that shocking the second one would result in loss of sync, but this is a surprising phenomenon.
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RYAN LOUDMUSIC JENKINS

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Re: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #285 on: February 20, 2014, 02:44:24 pm »

If there's a way to fix the S16 so that it works with UTP, that would be money well-spent IMO.

Dan

Maybe just ponying up and buying STP correctly terminated would be money well-spent???

I have spent nearly $1000 on very good TMB Proplex Cat5 cables for my GLDs.  I wasn't going to skimp on quality.  It was well worth the investment!  Why is it that so many of the X32 owners are hoping for miracles rather than just getting the correct cable?

If people were willing to spend $500 on a snake for their $2000 analog consoles then surely they should be willing to spend $500 on a snake for their $2000 digital consoles???
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Dan Mortensen

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Re: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #286 on: February 20, 2014, 06:12:19 pm »

Maybe just ponying up and buying STP correctly terminated would be money well-spent???

I have spent nearly $1000 on very good TMB Proplex Cat5 cables for my GLDs.  I wasn't going to skimp on quality.  It was well worth the investment!  Why is it that so many of the X32 owners are hoping for miracles rather than just getting the correct cable?

If people were willing to spend $500 on a snake for their $2000 analog consoles then surely they should be willing to spend $500 on a snake for their $2000 digital consoles???

Dear Loudmusic,

My company has already spent well over $2000 buying the type of cable that Behringer initially recommended as being perfectly suited for use with the console and S16. I believe I have said that here before, or at least indicated it without attaching a monetary value.

What is hard to understand about
a) not wanting to spend that much or more on a new lot of cable?
b) there being an extremely limited selection of STP available, and that there is not one that exists that precisely meets my needs the way the UTP does (ease of handling, tri- or quad-Ethernet runs in one cable, heavy jacket, etc.)?
c) a correlary of b): I have some Proplex, and I don't like it. The quad is the worst handling cable I've ever had the displeasure of dealing with, and the single's jacket is nasty feeling. It does work, though.

Also, I think the jury is still out on what happens when a console and S16 are in a situation where there is a significant ground potential difference between the AC sources powering each, and they are then connected with STP. Yes, I know there are ways to avoid that, but there are also situations that could necessitate doing so. UTP would have no problem. What happens when you short the grounds together through the STP? I don't know.

Dan
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Mike Pyle

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Re: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #287 on: February 21, 2014, 12:01:23 pm »

Maybe just ponying up and buying STP correctly terminated would be money well-spent???

I have spent nearly $1000 on very good TMB Proplex Cat5 cables for my GLDs.  I wasn't going to skimp on quality.  It was well worth the investment!  Why is it that so many of the X32 owners are hoping for miracles rather than just getting the correct cable?

If people were willing to spend $500 on a snake for their $2000 analog consoles then surely they should be willing to spend $500 on a snake for their $2000 digital consoles???

The Proplex is certainly a high quality product. Initially it was the only stranded core Cat5e recommended by A&H as a less expensive alternative to the OEM cable A&H sold for the iLives. Nevertheless, people still have the option to use solid core Duracat or other less expensive UTP Cat5e cables with the A&H mixers, and apparently they should work fine with the Midas Pro series as Dan indicates. Considering Behringer's price level in the digital console marketplace, I think it would make sense for them to fix the mixer so it can be used with relatively inexpensive solid core UTP.
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Mike Pyle  Audiopyle Sound  707-315-6204
Dealer For: Yorkville, EV, QSC, RCF, FBT, SLS, Renkus Heinz, Danley Sound Labs, Tannoy, Lab Gruppen, Powersoft, VTC, EAW, Allen & Heath, Ashly, APB, Denon, Rane, Audix, One Systems, OnPoint Audio, Beyerdynamic, Presonus, K&M, Ultimate, Global Truss, Road Ready, SKB, Gator, Radial Engineering, Turbosound, dB Technologies, American DJ, Odyssey, ProCo, Rapco, CBI, Elation, Mipro, Chauvet, Blizzard, Shure, Whirlwind, BenQ, Yamaha, Line 6, more...

Mark McFarlane

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Re: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #288 on: February 21, 2014, 04:46:12 pm »

... Considering Behringer's price level in the digital console marketplace, I think it would make sense for them to fix the mixer so it can be used with relatively inexpensive solid core UTP.

And come out with a proper shielded ether con cable for around $1/foot
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Mark McFarlane
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Brian Wynn

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Re: behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
« Reply #289 on: February 21, 2014, 11:17:55 pm »

Dear Guys,

We are in the process of developing a specific Ethercon cable for our digital consoles made for us by Neutrik. It will be built to the proper specification and also be quite affordable.  We will follow up when the cable is available via our distributors.

Best Regards,
Joe Sanborn
Senior Manager, Marketing Communications
MUSIC Group
BEHRINGER

They are working on it read quoted test from Joe
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