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Author Topic: DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing  (Read 2337 times)

Phil Hornung

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DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« on: February 12, 2013, 05:44:23 pm »

I did a search and couldn't find any thread about this, but I feel like I'm missing something really obvious here...

I'm setting up an SD10 in a shop to do a monitor gig. I want to use just 1 Solo Bus (it's all wedges), have the inputs PFL always, and the outputs AFL always. In other words, without toggling the AFL switch on the solo control area on the surface. This is how pretty much every console I've ever used (which is almost all of them) works as default, and I can't at all see a way to make this do it, even through workarounds like Macros. I'm already brainstorming a summing circuit to use both solo busses into one amp circuit for my listen, but that seems like a lot of effort to accomplish something so simple.

I've only used DiGiCo product in the past to do FOH and this never really caught my attention.

Any help would be much appreciated.
Phil
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Jens Palm Bacher

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Re: DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2013, 08:36:46 pm »

I did a search and couldn't find any thread about this, but I feel like I'm missing something really obvious here...

I'm setting up an SD10 in a shop to do a monitor gig. I want to use just 1 Solo Bus (it's all wedges), have the inputs PFL always, and the outputs AFL always. In other words, without toggling the AFL switch on the solo control area on the surface. This is how pretty much every console I've ever used (which is almost all of them) works as default, and I can't at all see a way to make this do it, even through workarounds like Macros. I'm already brainstorming a summing circuit to use both solo busses into one amp circuit for my listen, but that seems like a lot of effort to accomplish something so simple.

I've only used DiGiCo product in the past to do FOH and this never really caught my attention.

Any help would be much appreciated.
Phil
Well you could do the following:

Use solo 1 to pfl channels
use solo 2 to afl aux sends

Output from solo 1 to graphic eq 23, flat
Output from solo 2 to graphic eq 24, flat

Use matrix to combine output from eq 23 and 24
Send from matrix to wedge.
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Samuel Rees

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DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2013, 11:07:02 pm »

I don't follow - why can't you just use both solo busses, one AFL and one PFL , and set the direct outs for both to your cue? I'd have to look at the desk to see how mine is configured though, I can't remember
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 11:12:18 pm by Samuel Rees »
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Jens Palm Bacher

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Re: DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2013, 05:48:04 am »

I don't follow - why can't you just use both solo busses, one AFL and one PFL , and set the direct outs for both to your cue? I'd have to look at the desk to see how mine is configured though, I can't remember
You can't route Solo 1 and solo 2 to the same output, hence my little workaround.
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peter dakin

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Re: DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2013, 06:29:06 am »

I did a search and couldn't find any thread about this, but I feel like I'm missing something really obvious here...

I'm setting up an SD10 in a shop to do a monitor gig. I want to use just 1 Solo Bus (it's all wedges), have the inputs PFL always, and the outputs AFL always. In other words, without toggling the AFL switch on the solo control area on the surface. This is how pretty much every console I've ever used (which is almost all of them) works as default, and I can't at all see a way to make this do it, even through workarounds like Macros. I'm already brainstorming a summing circuit to use both solo busses into one amp circuit for my listen, but that seems like a lot of effort to accomplish something so simple.

I've only used DiGiCo product in the past to do FOH and this never really caught my attention.

Any help would be much appreciated.
Phil
I haven't a console infront of me at the moment, so hence my obvious ramblings.
What you're saying is when in PFL mode, a cue'd aux is PFL'd? It doesn't naturally switch to AFL (even though PFL is still selected)?
I'm in a similar position to you and only used as a FOH console. This seems like a glaring obvious oversight, and one I'm surprised DigiCo haven't solved!
I'm sure you've tried all the obvious, but just to humour me, when in AFL mode, what happens when you press the "PFL" on a channel, does it not swap?
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Steve Ferreira

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Re: DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2013, 08:27:49 am »

From the user manual:

Touching the Solos menu opens the Solo 1 and Solo 2 displays. These displays are used for configuring the console’s solo
busses. Solo buss 1 is configured in the left-hand display, and solo buss 2 in the right. Both displays function in exactly the same
way:
At the top of each display is a black box containing the solo meter(s), three buttons, and an input trim pot. These controls are
duplicated on the console worksurface in the right hand section:
The first button selects which point in the channel feeds the buss, and toggles between PFL and AFL, as indicated by the pfl or
afl labelling above the button turning green. The button is also ringed green on the worksurface when afl is selected.
The second button toggles the two solo button modes: multi in which multiple channels can feed the solo buss at once, or
single in which only one channel can feed the buss. In single mode, when a channel is feeding the solo buss, pressing the solo
button on a different channel will cause the originally selected channel to be deselected from the solo buss. The solo button mode
is indicated by the multi or single labelling above the button turning red. The button is also ringed red on the worksurface when
single is selected.
All feeds to the solo buss can also be cleared by pressing the clear button. When there is a feed to that solo buss somewhere on
the console, the button is ringed blue on the worksurface.
The level of the solo buss can be adjusted using the on-screen trim pot or the trim encoder on the worksurface. The on-screen
trim pot is always assigned to this worksurface encoder, as indicated by the presence of green ring around it. The signal can be
trimmed by ±18dB, and the trim value is indicated to the right of the on-screen trim pot.
In the centre of the Solo 1 or Solo 2 display, there is an auto solo area which lists all the channels which are selected for the
auto solo function. This function automatically routes selected channels to that solo bus whenever another channel is assigned
to it, and the selected channels can be scrolled if necessary using the scroll bar on the right of the list. The auto solo channels
are selected in the Channel Setup display. This auto solo function is enabled and disabled by touching the left-hand blue button
below the auto solo list. The button label displays whether the auto solo function is enabled or disabled. The channels in the
auto solo list can all be removed by touching the clear all button below the auto solo list.
Tip: If you are using effects returns, selecting auto solo will allow soloed tracks to be auditioned with their
effects returns.
The solo buss signal can be delayed using the delay pot to the right of the auto solo area. Switch the delay on using the on
button below the pot. Touch the pot to assign it to the Touch-Turn encoder. The delay value has a range of 0 to 3 seconds and is
displayed above and to the right of the delay pot.
The mono, stereo and LCR buttons define the buss format. The selected button is red and the format is also indicated by the
number of meters displayed in the top-left corner of each display
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Phil Hornung

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Re: DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2013, 11:29:07 am »

Thanks for everyone's responses...

Jens - Your suggestion is probably the closest thing to a solution. The only 2 problems I have are I can't spare 2 graphic eq's for this (96 input, 26 mix show), and even if I could the master fader can only be assigned to control one solo bus at a time. It'll probably be easier in the long run to just use the hard AFL switch in the Solo control area on the surface. Once we're through soundcheck I should be able to pretty much leave it in AFL mode anyway.

Peter - Yes I've done listening tests both ways both modes and it won't switch unless you hit that button (which also clears the solo bus forcing you to re-solo whatever it was you were trying to listen to which is an extra special PITA!). I'm with you, this is a glaring oversight to me, and I can't believe with the number of these on major tours doing monitors that this hasn't been addressed in a software update.

Steve - Thanks for posting the manual clipping. I had read it and unfortunately, because there doesn't seem to be a solution, the manual doesn't address this particular issue anywhere.

I still hope I'm missing something obvious, so if anyone else has any thoughts, I'd welcome them.

Phil

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Adam Robinson

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Re: DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2013, 01:37:06 pm »

Thanks for everyone's responses...

Jens - Your suggestion is probably the closest thing to a solution. The only 2 problems I have are I can't spare 2 graphic eq's for this (96 input, 26 mix show), and even if I could the master fader can only be assigned to control one solo bus at a time. It'll probably be easier in the long run to just use the hard AFL switch in the Solo control area on the surface. Once we're through soundcheck I should be able to pretty much leave it in AFL mode anyway.

Peter - Yes I've done listening tests both ways both modes and it won't switch unless you hit that button (which also clears the solo bus forcing you to re-solo whatever it was you were trying to listen to which is an extra special PITA!). I'm with you, this is a glaring oversight to me, and I can't believe with the number of these on major tours doing monitors that this hasn't been addressed in a software update.

Steve - Thanks for posting the manual clipping. I had read it and unfortunately, because there doesn't seem to be a solution, the manual doesn't address this particular issue anywhere.

I still hope I'm missing something obvious, so if anyone else has any thoughts, I'd welcome them.

Phil

You can also achieve this by taking the signal out of the desk and back in (like via the on-board AES io) and then patching those AES inputs to the matrix where you mix the two together.  The matrix inputs can not only be derived from paths internal to the desk like channels, auxes, and groups, but you also have the option to route any socket directly to the matrix without ever hitting a channel strip.
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Samuel Rees

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DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2013, 03:01:22 pm »

Weird I guess I just run everything AFL. If you are running post-fader as a Mon console what does it matter? I'll have to look at the desk.
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Jim Turner

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Re: DiGiCo PFL/AFL funtionality for monitor mixing
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2013, 03:28:21 am »

If you are running post-fader as a Mon console what does it matter?

Yea... I guess.
 The two solos will both route to the headphone outs... Silly stereo TRS to mono XLR adapter to feed cue mix? Phones volume for listen wedge?
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smile & wave...
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