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[Frank DeWitt]

They can be configured as 10 mono or 5 stereo. We'll be using 10 mono. I understand stereo is nicer, but we've used mono for years now and it's perfectly fine, especially if you have a good quality signal.

We would be using the SL as a head to drive IEMs and their mixes, as you said, and continue to use the Roland for FOH. It'll be less than $4k altogether including headphone amps.

Cool.  We use a Rane HC-6.  With some creative wiring of the plugs you can get 12 mono signals through it and it sounds good.  BTW there are a bunch on Ebay right now.  We use ours with a SAC system

[Thomas Harkin]

Unfortunately you are trying to fix the problem that is caused by another problem that is caused by the the original problem.
The drums are being played to loud.
I attended a seminar on micing drums given by two professional drummers and a professional producer.  The guy sitting at the kit said "If you need a shield, take that money and spend it on lessons for your drummer." The other two agreed.   It may take training, it may take IEMs, but drums can be played at any number of volumes. 

BTW We are a 200 person church in a room that will hold 270  We have a full drum kit with mics and the drums are not so loud that they control the mix.

Frank

+1 with a bullet!!

In the meantime, try micing just the kick, along with only one, or two, overhead condenser mics. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised with the results.

[Jason Lucas]

+1 with a bullet!!

In the meantime, try micing just the kick, along with only one, or two, overhead condenser mics. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised with the results.

Not that pleasantly, unfortunately. I tried this approach during our christmas service and I couldn't run the overheads very hot at all or they would feedback. So you couldn't really even hear them through the speakers. Don't know if it was a problem of the drum kit being too close to the subwoofer or what. I don't normally have feedback issues with other microphones.

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

Not that pleasantly, unfortunately. I tried this approach during our christmas service and I couldn't run the overheads very hot at all or they would feedback. So you couldn't really even hear them through the speakers. Don't know if it was a problem of the drum kit being too close to the subwoofer or what. I don't normally have feedback issues with other microphones.

Try lowering them.  Loudest sound at the mic wins.

Get in there and stick your head around, listen for spots where everything seems balanced and try a mic there. 

I have done drum kits in unbelievably high ambient noise levels using hyper-cardioids pulled down tight on the kit using the nulls to regulate the cymbal content.  Solo the headphones......nothing but kit.

There's an answer.  It will seem simple once you find it.  Don't assume anything.

[Thomas Harkin]

Try lowering them.  Loudest sound at the mic wins.

Get in there and stick your head around, listen for spots where everything seems balanced and try a mic there. 

I have done drum kits in unbelievably high ambient noise levels using hyper-cardioids pulled down tight on the kit using the nulls to regulate the cymbal content.  Solo the headphones......nothing but kit.

There's an answer.  It will seem simple once you find it.  Don't assume anything.

I thought you said the drummer was on headphones.  As Dick said, the loudest sound wins.  What was the feedback path?  Where were the speakers that were feeding it?

"There's an answer."

Start simple and break down the problem. Get the mics as close as possible to the drums, without getting in the drummer's way.

I suggested this method because I've had good success with it.

(EDIT)
I missed the mention of the subwoofer. Did you have the high pass filter on the overheads?

Blessings,

[Jason Lucas]

I thought you said the drummer was on headphones.  As Dick said, the loudest sound wins.  What was the feedback path?  Where were the speakers that were feeding it?

"There's an answer."

Start simple and break down the problem. Get the mics as close as possible to the drums, without getting in the drummer's way.

I suggested this method because I've had good success with it.

(EDIT)
I missed the mention of the subwoofer. Did you have the high pass filter on the overheads?

Blessings,

I did, although it may have been set too low.

If you stand right next to the sub with a hot mic in your hand and the HPF is below 280Hz, you'll get feedback. I think the sub just has a crappy crossover. Because 280Hz seems unnaturally high, yet I can ramp up the HPF to about 350Hz on a vocal channel before you start to notice it sounding "thinner" at all.

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

I did, although it may have been set too low.

If you stand right next to the sub with a hot mic in your hand and the HPF is below 280Hz, you'll get feedback. I think the sub just has a crappy crossover. Because 280Hz seems unnaturally high, yet I can ramp up the HPF to about 350Hz on a vocal channel before you start to notice it sounding "thinner" at all.

Why did you not simply raise the HPF on the OH's until the feedback stopped?

You have to try things.  And you have to think......but not too much......

[Jason Lucas]

Why did you not simply raise the HPF on the OH's until the feedback stopped?

You have to try things.  And you have to think......but not too much......

It was quicker and easier to just turn them down than to experiment with what HPF setting I could get away with at the time.

Anyway, I think we just need to experiment with things. I do think ditching the snare and tom mics and just trying the kick + OHs may work if we have it setup right. I'm also all for getting rid of the drum shield if we can get the drummer's monitors figured out. I'll experiment a bit this weekend.

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

It was quicker and easier to just turn them down than to experiment with what HPF setting I could get away with at the time.

Anyway, I think we just need to experiment with things. I do think ditching the snare and tom mics and just trying the kick + OHs may work if we have it setup right. I'm also all for getting rid of the drum shield if we can get the drummer's monitors figured out. I'll experiment a bit this weekend.

You can do a kit very nicely with 3 mics.  Two if you work at it.

Edit:


Here's a link to a drum kit miking discussion.

http://soundforums.net/junior-varsity/6081-one-my-favorite-drum-mic-techniques.html

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