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[Frank DeWitt]

I have and you're right, the MH is definitely the better board. The GB8 might be one of the best 48 channel Analog mixers you can get new, but shopping used there's MH, APB and Midas (if you're lucky) so might as well look for used.

My church paid $7000 for our digital mixer and I was curious as to how much that would fetch in the analog world. I honestly don't think the board we got is the best fit for us. But it works well enough, and we already bought it.

There is probably a lesson there, what board did you get and why doesn't it fit?

Frank

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

There is probably a lesson there, what board did you get and why doesn't it fit?

Frank

It's a Roland 400 according to the signature accompanying every post he makes.  I imagine the digital work-flow for inexperienced volunteers is the poor fit.

[Thomas Lamb]

This is mostly a theoretical question, since my church is not currently looking at buying a new console. But I wanted to ask you guys what you think the best 48 channel analog desk is, for $7000 or less.

So far the only two I've found are the Soundcraft GB8 and Allen & Heath GL2800-848.

So what do you think is the best? Requirements would be at least 48 channels, analog, and $7000 or less.

My understanding is that GL2800 series is either no longer available or will not be available soon. A&H has been slowly phasing out all of their larger frame analog desks over the past year.

[Jason Lucas]

It's a Roland 400 according to the signature accompanying every post he makes.  I imagine the digital work-flow for inexperienced volunteers is the poor fit.

Actually the people who run it have only ever used digital boards. We had a Mackie TT24 in the past.

But, our channel count has grown since then and that necessitated the use of layers, which no one likes. Every time we've rethought the channel layout on the board we've always tried to fit as much on to the first layer as possible so as to not have to switch at all. That plus the lack of sub-groups, the inability to send a channel to an AUX pre-dynamics (or make the EQ come before the compressor, as I like to do) plus no delay on outputs.

But none of that is as frustrating as the proprietary REAC network which either means you use Roland products for recording, IEMs, and everything else, or you treat it like an analog console. The board lacks ADAT (which should really be a given on digital consoles imo). No AES/EBU outputs unless you get the expensive S-4000S-MR modular (8 rack-space) snake. And even though it's digital and has layers, there aren't any LED scribble strips like the Yamaha CL, Soundcraft Vi and Allen & Heath iLive/GLD boards have, so if you want to have different channel layouts on different scenes your channel labels won't match.

I actually had to talk the worship pastor out of having everyone use the same scene on the mixer. I mean, the thing supports like 300 scenes, and they wanted us to all use 1. Thankfully that didn't last.

So I honestly think we would have been better served by an analog console. We wouldn't have scenes so the worship pastor wouldn't have to worry about that. No layers, and an individual knob for each function.

The Roland is a pretty decent board but it's pretty lacking in features that I've come to think of as standard on mixers, especially digital ones.

[Frank DeWitt]

But, our channel count has grown since then and that necessitated the use of layers, which no one likes.

Yikes,  good points all.  One thing I have never understood is why all digital mixers don't support a aux video screen.  They are computers, they know how to make video, so put a jack on the back, let people plug in a 24 inch monitor from staples and show all channels at once.  add a mouse and you could get to and control all channels at once.  OK it doesn't put them on the faders where I want them, but at least I can find the ch and get to it quickly.

Frank

[Samuel Rees]

The board lacks ADAT (which should really be a given on digital consoles imo).

Most live digital consoles don't have ADAT.

[Caleb Dueck]

Most live digital consoles don't have ADAT.

+1, at least the "Pro" ones mostly don't.  Dante is becoming the popular protocol for moving lots of channels to and from a computer, among other uses.

Layers aren't necessarily bad, it's how they are implemented.  The static, for lack of a better term, way that Roland and many Yamaha consoles do it is a way of saving fader count but with an out dated work flow.  The VCA spill, POP groups, sub-sections of faders, etc is a more mature use of many functions on few faders. 

More than 1 function per fader isn't a problem, and analog isn't really the solution. 

[Jason Lucas]

Most live digital consoles don't have ADAT.

Okay, most don't come with them, granted. But several digital mixers out there have ADAT add-on cards (GLD, iLive, Soundcraft Si/Vi, and Yamaha CL to name a few).

[Jason Lucas]

+1, at least the "Pro" ones mostly don't.  Dante is becoming the popular protocol for moving lots of channels to and from a computer, among other uses.

Layers aren't necessarily bad, it's how they are implemented.  The static, for lack of a better term, way that Roland and many Yamaha consoles do it is a way of saving fader count but with an out dated work flow.  The VCA spill, POP groups, sub-sections of faders, etc is a more mature use of many functions on few faders. 

More than 1 function per fader isn't a problem, and analog isn't really the solution.

In addition to the faders, the "everyone use one scene" thing was also an argument for getting analog. Most digital consoles that have more than 24 faders are very pricy. Definitely outside the $7k range.

I'm not against digital mixers, I'd kill for an iLive or Soundcraft Vi console, but they're a LOT more money than the Roland.

[Caleb Dueck]

I'm not against digital mixers, I'd kill for an iLive or Soundcraft Vi console, but they're a LOT more money than the Roland.

Roland and Midas are pretty close in price now, the GLD is as well.  We sold many Roland mixers, until the iLive chipped away some market, the GLD some more, the X32 some more, now with Midas it's all but done for. 

[ProSoundWeb Community]