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Author Topic: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra  (Read 4465 times)

jason misterka

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Re: Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #20 on: November 30, 2012, 11:06:28 am »

Thanks everyone.  It looks like the Oktava is quite a bit more expensive.  A friend had recommended the MXL.  My dilemma is this is not for critical applications and most people won't know the difference, and price is an issue, so I should probably just go with something like that, but I'm too proud and like to stick with at least a certain level.  I will likely take Dick up on his offer but am checking a couple more things.

I think you were in the right ballpark with the AT Pro37 mics.  There are many better sounding mics but not near the same price range.

Jason
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Mike Karseboom

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Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #21 on: November 30, 2012, 11:13:50 am »

Those of you who have real world experience with the Oktava, could you please give us some details about what you like about it?    How does it compare with the standard go-to SDC such as Pro37,  SM81,  KMS184, etc.

I just used a pair on a children's choir outdoors for a Christmas tree lighting.  There were about 20 kids in two rows with half on the ground and half on hay bales.  The group was about 10 feet wide.  The Oktavas were placed about 4 feet wide and about 1 foot above the first row of kids.  The mains from the stage behind them were not used and instead two mackie srm450's were put on stands about 10 feet in front and 10 feet to the sides to try and reduce feedback issues.  There were about 200 people in the audience in a 5-6 deep semi-circle butting right up to the srm450's.

Well those kids did not project all that well and it was difficult getting much volume in the mains without feedback.  It seems like the mics picked up the crowd - who were fairly quiet and at least 15 feet away - as much as the kids. 

I am wondering if the pick up pattern on the Oktavas might be too broad for this type of application?  I do have some low cost Audix F15 mics and wonder if anyone can recommend those for this application?
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James A. Griffin

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Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #22 on: November 30, 2012, 11:16:56 am »

I am wondering if the pick up pattern on the Oktavas might be too broad for this type of application?  I do have some low cost Audix F15 mics and wonder if anyone can recommend those for this application?

Is it possible you had the omni capsules on them at the time?
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Craig Smith

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Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #23 on: November 30, 2012, 11:19:03 am »

Sounds like the stuff I deal with.  I've been sticking with cardioid mics for more even pickup of groups (I assume), but I should probably be looking at supers or hypers more.  Monitor placement is sometimes an issue though and I worry about the rear lobe.

I should mention that these are on my church's budget (although I may end up having to foot some of it).  If it were just my money I'd definitely get something better.
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Mike Karseboom

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Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #24 on: November 30, 2012, 12:34:02 pm »

Is it possible you had the omni capsules on them at the time?

James - the Oktava's had the cardiod capsules and the -10dB pad inserts were left out.  They did have 1/8 inch thick foam windscreens on them.  No monitors, just mains.
 
The first feedback frequency seemed to be about 800Hz or so.  There was no "ringing out" ahead of time as this was just one of a variety of performances. And the feedback started at such low reinforcement levels that I did not try to notch anything on the fly.  I just rode the main fader to stay just under the feedback level.  Not ideal or particularly expert, but all I could manage at the time on the Ipad.
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--Mike
"If your not confused, you don't know what is going on"

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Tim McCulloch

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Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #25 on: November 30, 2012, 12:47:37 pm »

I just used a pair on a children's choir outdoors for a Christmas tree lighting.  There were about 20 kids in two rows with half on the ground and half on hay bales.  The group was about 10 feet wide.  The Oktavas were placed about 4 feet wide and about 1 foot above the first row of kids.  The mains from the stage behind them were not used and instead two mackie srm450's were put on stands about 10 feet in front and 10 feet to the sides to try and reduce feedback issues.  There were about 200 people in the audience in a 5-6 deep semi-circle butting right up to the srm450's.

Well those kids did not project all that well and it was difficult getting much volume in the mains without feedback.  It seems like the mics picked up the crowd - who were fairly quiet and at least 15 feet away - as much as the kids. 

I am wondering if the pick up pattern on the Oktavas might be too broad for this type of application?  I do have some low cost Audix F15 mics and wonder if anyone can recommend those for this application?

I've used Oktava MC-012... 5 or 6 across the front line of bluegrass festivals with wedge monitors and did so for several years.  I did not have the experience you describe.  I quit using them because after 5 year years of continuous use they began to show mechanical problems with the XLR male connectors and mic body that led to phantom power issues.  With more attentive maintenance I might still be using them.  As it is, I have 4 that are 100% reliable and 3 more that need some TLC when used, but sound fine.

The cardioid pattern IS rather broad and for a lot of things that's not really bad, you just need to be aware of it and plan accordingly.

Blaming mics because you didn't have time to optimize your EQ or delay, or because you were mixing from an iPad (yuck.. this novelty needs to be reserved for situations where you absolutely can't run a snake for a proper FOH position) is putting the guilt at the wrong end of the signal chain.
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Craig Smith

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Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2012, 01:34:59 pm »

... the worse mic ever created, with TLM103 close following.
Wow, I hadn't ever researched it but I didn't realize it wasn't very loved.  When I bought a recording mic for my wife, I broke down and got a non-name brand non-American/European made ADK CE, but I was thinking I should have looked at the TLM103.
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #27 on: November 30, 2012, 01:45:32 pm »

Wow, I hadn't ever researched it but I didn't realize it wasn't very loved.  When I bought a recording mic for my wife, I broke down and got a non-name brand non-American/European made ADK CE, but I was thinking I should have looked at the TLM103.

The ADK is a very decent mic.  You did well.
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RYAN LOUDMUSIC JENKINS

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Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #28 on: November 30, 2012, 02:18:00 pm »

I do a lot of choir work.  In the last month I have provided for at least six different choirs from approximately 7 year old to young adults and I have another choir next week that is made up of 2nd grade kids. 

One of the concerts we did this month was the All-State High School Jazz Choir Concert here in Arizona.  This included three different choirs for the concert.  Two were jazz groups singing into individual mics.  All the singers had SM58s.  There were 20-23 kids in each choir.  The third group was a "Show" choir with 40 kids that had choreographed dance while they were singing.  We used 7 SM58s across the front.  The mics were strategically placed so the stands could be used as markers for the dance routine.  It worked absolutely perfectly.  We chose not to use hanging condensers for this particular concert but have done so in the past for Show Choirs in addition to the 58s.  They all had a live Jazz combo for the music and we used condensers for the Piano, guitar and drums, while we used good ol' SM57s on the brass and woodwind.

People really over think the choir stuff.  If you aren't recording it then keep it really simple and use your 58s.  You'll have a way easier time with monitors and it will still sound just fine.

BTW, I have four of the "Real" Oktava MC012 mics mentioned earlier and they are the mics that I would typically hang above a show choir.  I love them, they work and sound great.  Very hard to get the real ones now days though.
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Justice C. Bigler

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Re: SDC Mics for Choir/Orchestra
« Reply #29 on: November 30, 2012, 02:18:37 pm »

This is the 3031. 
Some searches end up showing the 3030 which is much larger and side-address.  I couldn't attach a photo to a PM, so here it is in reply to JB's post.

 ??? Not sure why you were going to PM a pic of the 3031. I have two of them. I know what they look like. I also have an AT 3035 which is quite good as well, and is a side address LDC.
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