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Author Topic: The worlds first perfect moving head?  (Read 6369 times)

John Strzalkowski

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Re: The worlds first perfect moving head?
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2011, 01:16:29 pm »

I wonder if they count the split colors as a color in that count of 18.
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duane massey

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Re: The worlds first perfect moving head?
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2011, 05:49:45 pm »

And this fixture is superior to, say... this one?
http://www.elationlighting.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ItemNumber=1752&MainId=1&Category=Moving%20Head

...which does have CMY.

JACK has an 8-color wheel, which means they are counting split colors as well as full colors and white to come up with 18 colors. That's pretty bogus marketing BS.
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Duane Massey
Technician, musician, stubborn old guy
Houston, Texas

Steve (Stevie Ray) Kalbach

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Re: The worlds first perfect moving head?
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2011, 06:21:21 pm »

Duane,
When I came across it, I thought it was pretty impressive, and I thought wow at 23 lbs, very friendly for a mobile DJ (like I mentioned in the first line of the first post).  A 50 lb mover is pretty difficult to handle when you have to setup and rig by yourself.  The Jack by it's specs is also brighter.  Spec for spec I think overall the 5R pro is more impressive. 

PS. I do have ties to the ADJ family of companies, as I am an administrator for their forums.  I just usually do not start threads on their products, as some people on other forums, have come down on me saying I am pushing product.  Saying all that, Elation has some very interesting heads on the way.
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Stephen (Stevie Ray) Kalbach
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James Feenstra

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Re: The worlds first perfect moving head?
« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2011, 09:04:40 pm »

And this fixture is superior to, say... this one?
http://www.elationlighting.com/ProductDetails.aspx?ItemNumber=1752&MainId=1&Category=Moving%20Head

...which does have CMY.

JACK has an 8-color wheel, which means they are counting split colors as well as full colors and white to come up with 18 colors. That's pretty bogus marketing BS.
I've never understood why companies are building lights with CMY AND a color wheel in them...if it's got CMY you don't need the wheel.

Leaving that out would save money, weight and channels without taking anything away from the fixture!
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Elevation Audiovisual
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Taking your events to the next level

Steve (Stevie Ray) Kalbach

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Re: The worlds first perfect moving head?
« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2011, 09:55:15 pm »

It's probably due to the fact that for some colors CMY mixing greatly REDUCES the output of the fixture.
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Stephen (Stevie Ray) Kalbach
Owner Stevie Ray Entertainment
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mark lonow

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Re: The worlds first perfect moving head?
« Reply #15 on: December 13, 2011, 06:01:39 am »

It's probably due to the fact that for some colors CMY mixing greatly REDUCES the output of the fixture.

color consistency is greater on color wheelz in big rigs and older/overused  fixtures vs cym

color bouncing  say red to no color is a difrent look  on cym vs a color  wheel with then 2 colors next to each other on a wheel

that said i do agree with jamses cut the 2nd gobo wheel, 2nd color,  prisum,the difuser   get me  cym on the low end of fixtures

my fav cym small guy  still is
http://www.coemar.com/prodotti_dettaglio.aspx?flag=eng&str_navigazione=&cerca=&id_categorie=105&page=1&id_prodotti=305

 
« Last Edit: December 13, 2011, 06:04:25 am by mark lonow »
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James Feenstra

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Re: The worlds first perfect moving head?
« Reply #16 on: December 13, 2011, 03:16:37 pm »

the features I'd like to see on a 250w moving light (aka mac 250 entour) would be;

CMY
Iris
1 Rotating gobo wheel w/ 9-10 slots and GOOD gobos for arial effects

anything else is pretty much bonus

as for colour wheel vs cmy, well, yeah I see the point, but really, how often does one use the wheel over the cmy in a colour mixing fixture? I've never seen reason to use it...if I want a fixture to say, colour scroll (the biggest advantage to having a colour wheel), it's still relatively simple to program using a CMY engine. Does take some extra work though.

I'd still rather loose the colour wheel though...especially when across 12-16 fixtures that's a fair bit of weight and a fixtures worth of channels. When you're restricted by things like console output and in house rigging, it can make a difference.
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Elevation Audiovisual
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duane massey

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Re: The worlds first perfect moving head?
« Reply #17 on: December 13, 2011, 06:09:00 pm »

Steve, I am an independent contractor with a long history in the past with High End, ADJ/Elation, Chauvet, Robe, Coemar, etc, through my former employer (Core Systems). I am very partial to ADJ/Elation, as they have products and service that fit most of my particular clients' needs, and their service department has been decent as well. Virtually none of the mobile DJ's in this area are in the financial levels where a fixture of this magnitude would be appropriate, but I can see the appeal to operators that have a better (re: higher $$) market to work in.

I do tend to call "bulls***" when marketing claims are misleading. Probably why I'm not in politics.
At the very least they could have a link to the fixture manual.
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Duane Massey
Technician, musician, stubborn old guy
Houston, Texas

Craig Leerman

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The Wheel
« Reply #18 on: December 18, 2011, 03:00:36 am »

There are a few good reasons to have a color wheel AND color mixing in the same unit.

The first and obvious to guys who do video and IMAG is that the wheel can contain color correction filters and allow you to match up the moving head with the static wash lighting  color temp. The second and not so obvious is that the wheel can give you different colors in combination with the CMY that you can't get by using the CMY alone.  Last, the wheel can give you colors that CMY cannot produce, like darker greens, indigo or congo blues, or blacklight effects.

And of course, many wheels can do split colors, and can scroll, giving a different look than the fades and snaps from CMY color systems.

Already mentioned is color consistancy between units. While well maintained color mixing units should all be the same color, slight variations in the position of the wheels or indexing can result in different colors between units. Also, if you want to perfectly match a certain gel or dichro color, you can order one from various manufacturers and have the exact color you want in the wheel.
 
Not saying that many manufacturers actually load the wheel with how I want them to, but at least the end user can take advantage of the wheel if they choose to.

One trick I do is to get some custom color "crushed Dichros" that have multicolor chips and put them in the wheel. Great for multi-color pattern projections of abstracts on the back wall.

Craig

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I'm so old, when I was doing FOH for Tommy Dorsey, to balance out the horn section I would slide their chairs downstage and upstage to mix!

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